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Old 14-02-2018, 02:16   #346
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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Don't even get me started on what the impact of robotics will do to the blue collar workforce. Some people will just be obsolete. Young people face these challenges while I was able to retire at 44 because of the job opportunities I had in the eighties. Good night.
no, you were able to retire because you worked hard, are smart & grabbed the chances you had.
today: different opportunities, different chances (or could you have become a "webdesiner" in the eighties?
the lazy, the careless & the stupid - they will be phased out. it is called "evolution"
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Old 14-02-2018, 03:36   #347
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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How was "oppurtunity stolen from them"? They quit their jobs.

No one is suggesting they have to live the "leave it to beaver" white picket fence lifestyle.

You keep telling people to calm down and let it go...why are you so insistent that it's great that they are being irresponsible is great?
Thank you.
I knew we could agree on something.



And no, its not confirmation bias.
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Old 14-02-2018, 03:54   #348
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

"...it is called evolution" - & started right there in the entrance...
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Old 14-02-2018, 03:59   #349
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

I actually think "crowdfunding" is a great thing.

A lot of people contribute an inconsequential (to them) amount, and the recipients get to live their dreams. Contributors get to live them vicariously.

I just wish I looked good enough in a bikini to make it work for me.
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Old 14-02-2018, 04:26   #350
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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I just wish I looked good enough in a bikini to make it work for me.
show us a picture and let us be the judge...
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Old 14-02-2018, 04:35   #351
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pirate Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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Looking at that chart with its green mark on the stbd side of the dredged cut I would be asking a few questions of the port authority. If entering in daylight or dark my normal reaction would be to ignore the chart plotter and leave that beacon to port... oops....!! That of course would be based on the bold assumption that the port authority moved the marks as required so that they were on the correct side of the safe water.

Let me tell you a little story...

In 2001 I spent some time in Macquarie Harbour on the west coast of Tasmania. The chart available at the time was hopelessly out of date.... Lat and Long on chart and on GPS made no attempt to agree with each other... and there was absolutely no detail of any consequence in the south of the harbour.

Another feature was that the water is quite opaque ... being stained with tannin from the buttongrass swamps... and there is no way of telling the depth by eye..

So... on a fine sunny day we found ourselves entering the Gordon River.... and sighted three green posts with no topmarks right ahead... ( a pic of one is below vvv with us passing it outbound... remember this IALA A territory ... green to starboard inbound... )

Anyway... green sticks ahead ... I put them fine to starboard and next thing I know we are hard enough aground that it took one of the big charter cats to pull us off.

Strange story but true... one of those co-incidence things ... it transpired that a week earlier another shipmaster - who worked for the same company as me - had run aground in exactly the same manner....

And a few weeks later another chap I knew, a pilot in one of the Northern Tasmanian ports... ran aground in almost the same spot in his tinny.....

So three 'master mariners' on the putty in the space of a month.....

Back in Strahan conversations went a bit like this.... 'they are port hand marks'..'but they are green'... 'yes but everyone knows they are port hand marks....' 'So why aren't they red? '... 'because everyone knows they are port hand marks...

A month or so later I was talking with the Australian hydrographer about issues with the chart and mentioned these marks... he spoke to the Harbourmaster who assured him that they had only just been put there and they hadn't had time to paint them yet...

I told the hydrographer that they had been like that for at least two years... I do so hope that the h/master got a damn good kicking...

Moral of story.... let he who is without sin cast the first stone...
Not casting stones.. having been aground a couple of times myself..
Just saying.. how I read a chart and someone else reads a chart may not be the same.. as previous posts of confusion demonstrate..
The straight line is not always the right line.. despite how it looks.
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Old 14-02-2018, 04:40   #352
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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They are trying to exist in a world where opportunity has been stolen from them by outsourcing and cheap immigrant labor.

Automation doesn't make your list? A convenient omission...
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Old 14-02-2018, 04:49   #353
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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...boats are cheaper & more plentiful than ever. that they "set off" after saving only $10.090 shows a certain attitude...
the regulations do not make it "unaffordable" - the cruising life is more affordable than it was in the eighties! - they are just a major annoyance (& I for one take strong exception to a desksailor/penpusher in a ministery telling me what safety equipment I have to take along!)


The $10,090 quoted is neither fair nor accurate.

They bought the boat for $5000
Then spent an unspecified amount in refit costs
If you listen to the video they say their plan was to get a job in Key West. So they weren't "setting off" just yet.
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Old 14-02-2018, 05:16   #354
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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Automation doesn't make your list? A convenient omission...


My apologies you mentioned robotics later in the thread. But automation isn't just an issue for the future. It has displaced jobs for decades already and will only accelerate with machine learning/AI. Frankly immigration and oustsourcing are only relatively small factors hurting American workers (despite their outsized airtime in politics)

I agree with your statement that young people have gotten a poor deal, PARTLY due to the excesses of the baby boomer generation. I'm technically also a millennial but it's really shocking how much the price of tuition has increased even since my time. Meanwhile starting salaries have barely budged upward due to non-existent wage inflation. Add on uber sized inflation for healthcare and asset prices as well as almost complete shift to defined contribution retirement plans and you can start to understand the challenges faced by millennials today. Sure you can say there are still plenty of opportunities for intelligent/diligent workers and there are. Even I (an early millennial) was able to be financially independent by mid-thirties. But one has to be realistic that those opportunities simply are unattainable to the vast majority of the population.
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Old 14-02-2018, 10:10   #355
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

"The law does not require operators licenses and insurance for boats, what else can you do?"

Actually, Florida does require a certificate of completing a recognized boater safety course, if you were born after 1988 (they picked the date originally to grandfather in older boaters with experience) and a motor over 10hp.

So if these folks had a 10hp engine, and stayed in Florida more than 90 days (in or out of the water) their boat would have required Florida registration as well, and then they would have been required to have training.

I think Florida doesn't require the training of visitors who bring their own boats--but some places like NJ require it for everyone, anytime.

Every incident like this, where every nice cat lady says "Why do I have to pay tax money to clean this up?!" pushes us closer to making boats just like cars. Which is horribly logical, given the masses on the water these days.

On my side of the Hudson I don't need no steenkin license. On the Mainland side, I do. Makes no sense to me.

"There's your boat, here's a shovel. Go clean it up. Bring the shovel back when you're done."

How would you feel about letting folks go out and rent, or buy, excavators and bulldozers, and bring them home for a little gardening project? Or, some dynamite to clear their stumps? Yes, this is how gummint gets involved in things.
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Old 14-02-2018, 10:24   #356
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pirate Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

I figure I'll wait and see what happens with the 'Go Fund Me' $$$'s before I pass any judgement..
Looks they had an accident somewhere it seems even 'experienced sailors' on here suffered some confusion with the chart, so no harsh words from me..
For now its just a wait for reports of a salvage/wreck clearance on their $$'s.. or the State's.
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Old 14-02-2018, 10:36   #357
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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"...it is called evolution" - & started right there in the entrance...
Evolution is the physical changes in a persons body/form. That's not whats happening here. These kids are facing "Social Engineering" and it benefits only the people on the top controlling it.
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Old 14-02-2018, 11:13   #358
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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Evolution is the physical changes in a persons body/form. That's not whats happening here. These kids are facing "Social Engineering" and it benefits only the people on the top controlling it.
They've changed the maze and moved the cheese.

Some rats will figure it out soon enough, others may never adapt to the change.
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Old 14-02-2018, 11:16   #359
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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Evolution is the physical changes in a persons body/form. That's not whats happening here. These kids are facing "Social Engineering" and it benefits only the people on the top controlling it.
I strongly disagree just look at the basis of this entire thread. It seems to me that the social engineering you speak of seems to be benefiting these two who by their statements are toward the bottom of that particular leftist ladder.
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Old 14-02-2018, 11:19   #360
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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They've changed the maze and moved the cheese.

Some rats will figure it out soon enough, others may never adapt to the change.
Social Engineering is not about "figuring it out" it is about "PREFERENCE" being pushed down from the top. There is nothing you can do if your outside the preference bracket.
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