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Old 22-03-2017, 18:27   #106
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Re: Advantages to have a small boat

It is not necessary to own a boat at all to be flat broke, dumpster dive, or crap in a bucket! don't ask me how I know. Boat expenses or equipment failure can quickly force a fine Lady or Gentleman into this state though...
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Old 22-03-2017, 20:41   #107
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Re: Advantages to have a small boat

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Originally Posted by thomm225 View Post
I'm still thinking a smaller boat is better for the weekend/vacationing type of cruiser.....especially a single hander

They are just easier to handle and maintain.

Also, sailing 45-70 miles over the weekend on a 40'-50' boat wouldn't be much of an adventure whereas it can be on a smaller one

There are just so many variables for each person (boat owner) and bigger simply isn't always better.


As far as cost, I'm sure some folks buy small because it's what they can afford but many others of us buy smaller because it fits with what we are doing.

I don't need another condo, apartment, or home on the water. I just need a boat with a place to put a few things, one that has a place to sleep, and sails reasonably well

My GPS units are not mounted in the cockpit but you can move them out there. They are still hard to see. One is now on the blink and my old Danforth Compass has failed so I "upgraded" with a Suunto Handheld Compass. (It's the A-10 for $20.00!)

I'll be using this handheld to navigate in open water. When I'm close to shore, I'll rely more on the GPS if I need to so I won't run aground when taking short cuts out of the marked channels.

If I do run aground though, it's not a big deal because I have a small, full keel boat that I can manhandle somewhat, and that is pretty tough. Running aground with a deeper draft fin keeled 45' plus boat would be a different story and you can forget about taking short cuts out of the channel near shore or exploring up a creek passed the marked channels.......

Now if you are cruising long distance and will not be back to your home or condo for a few months or years etc then having a bigger boat is understandable but as a single hander, I'm thinking 32'-35' or so

On the big boat side, there's the speed thing. Bigger is faster .....which would help the weekender cover more ground but after covering said ground could you dock the thing?

Example: There is a C&C 37R up here for sale. This boat is about 40' long and draws 8.16'. It's PHRF is in the 60's. The problem is that you cannot get in most creek especially up the bay a ways.........
Boat size is a compromise like everything else to do with boats. You can have complicated small boats and simple big boats. I've had trailer sailers up to the 50 we have now.
Small is less expensive if the same age/condition.
The bigger boat does allow us to cover more ground in more comfort/less discomfort. We sail to a schedule on vacation. So we always get some crap weather. Plus for the bigger boat takes weather better and still makes good miles.
Do we dock when we get there, nope. Only once now in 4 years. We use the dinghy or the kids Opti or the paddle board or the inflatable kayak. Different than our 37 we would dock a few time on a trip. So a trade off/compromise. But some of the place we like best don't have docks as a option anyway.
C&C37 draws more than our 50 which is under 6'.
Friends 39 centerboard draws 4.5 board up I think.
Lots of options, how boring would it be if we all had the same boat...
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Old 22-03-2017, 21:04   #108
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Re: Advantages to have a small boat

I have sailed for 35 years. I like the concept of buying the smallest boat that meets your needs. There is a lot to learn. I will also tell you telling is not teaching an reading is not learning. I like the the 20 to 22 foot for first timers. Two normal sized people can enjoy the boat and experience the do's and don'ts. Sail on and catch the wind.
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Old 23-03-2017, 04:07   #109
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Re: Advantages to have a small boat

I went from 53ft to 37ft. Best thing i ever did. My ego bought my first boat, my brain my second. Don't try to keep up with the jones's. When the winds blow strong, smaller is so much safer. The average size yacht sailing from Panama to Brisbane Australia is a 28ft mono (Source, Australian customs office )
I see a llt smaller mooring up where i am. How much room do you really need? Are you wanting a floating house or a yacht.
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Old 23-03-2017, 07:38   #110
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Re: Advantages to have a small boat

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Originally Posted by Tacmed View Post
I went from 53ft to 37ft. Best thing i ever did. My ego bought my first boat, my brain my second. Don't try to keep up with the jones's. When the winds blow strong, smaller is so much safer. The average size yacht sailing from Panama to Brisbane Australia is a 28ft mono (Source, Australian customs office )
I see a llt smaller mooring up where i am. How much room do you really need? Are you wanting a floating house or a yacht.
Average size is 28'? I find that kind of hard to believe. For all the 40+ footers, there are an equal number of sub 20 foot boats? My boat is usually the smallest in any anchorage or cruising marina. Nice to know I'm just slightly below average in this regard too.
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Old 23-03-2017, 08:07   #111
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Re: Advantages to have a small boat

To someone currently sailing a 22 footer my 36 footer is "big". While for someone on a 55 footer it's "small", even puny. So it's back to each owner's own needs/wants. IMO one should get a boat which is sized for him or her and not because some other sailor says it should be big or should be small.

For example my second boat, the one destined for FL for occasional sails once a month or so, is 28'. Since I will not be entertaining more than another couple there and only me and my g/f will be overnighting on it it is a perfect size for these purposes. Anything smaller would not be as comfortable and certainly would lack the head room it has. Anything larger would have issues of costs, dockage, bridge clearances, etc. But here at home a 28 footer, while would do in a pinch, would severely limit my options as I like to sail with friends and buddies and other couples and we often do weekend and long weekend sails and stays aboard. Also at my haul out yard their real limit is about 38' and 6' draft due to tides, their equipment, etc. But that makes them considerably less expensive than other more versatile and capable yards. And that's fine with me.

A friend who is a liveaboard has a 46 footer and sometime wishes he had a smaller boat (when it comes to buying sails, etc.) Sometimes he's happy with her size or even wishing for a bigger one (when doing 14kts getting away from the weather front). It's all relative.
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Old 23-03-2017, 08:50   #112
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Re: Advantages to have a small boat

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Originally Posted by Kenomac View Post
Why buy a small boat?

You'll be admired and even idolized on this forum. Even better if you're flat broke and jobless.

Dumpster dive or crap in a bucket... and become a God.

Yep, you are my idol!
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Old 23-03-2017, 10:26   #113
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Re: Advantages to have a small boat

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Originally Posted by Kenomac View Post
Why buy a small boat?

You'll be admired and even idolized on this forum. Even better if you're flat broke and jobless.

Dumpster dive or crap in a bucket... and become a God.
Well, you just about described me! You left out homeless!

OK, not really. Limited budget? Yes. Jobless? Will be shortly. Homeless? No....I have my small boat to liveaboard.

I am repatriating to the US after having lived in Egypt for the past 20 years. Have no living family and no place that I have to be in the States. I purchased my little 27-footer (with 6-foot headroom) to be used as a live-aboard while I get to know my own country again (My last visit to the States was 10-years ago).

Now I know that my example here is not the "norm" as I have zero assets in the States. But consider this: "How much does it cost to rent an apartment in whatever city/town (first month + a month's deposit, set up utilities, buy some cheap furniture, outfit the galley, head, etc.). Possibly in a city/town that you won't even like!

For the same $'s that I would have spent getting set up in new land-based digs, I bought a small sailboat, had it surveyed (pretty much turn-key), and as Jim Cate stated on another thread: "This will give me a place to escape too when the stress of repatriating becomes too much". Or words to that effect (Thanks Jim for the words of wisdom there! ).

Now, about buying that 27-footer. 27-feet is that largest I've single-handed when I had my Columbia 27 years ago. So that is what I am considering my LOA limit for my abilities at this time (and I ain't as fit as I was 20 years ago). Upkeep: simpler systems (and I repair yachts for a living, at least for another couple of weeks), less teak or mahogany to maintain, cheaper sails, cheaper slip fees compared to larger boats.

Yeah, I'd like to have a larger boat just as would like to have a larger bank account. This one will do me good for now.

On larger boats: Sailed as crew on a 20-meter yacht last year. Owner and his girlfriends (non-sailors) were having too much fun below and too much to drink. Had to bring the vessel in on my own. Those are some BIG sails to haul down and stow! Luckily the weather was with me and was able to get her to the dock easier than I remember doing on my other, smaller boats (weight made the difference I believe).

As has already been stated and beaten to death here, get the boat that suits your needs, sailing area and intentions, and plan for the costs that come with owning a boat post-purchase.
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Old 23-03-2017, 10:43   #114
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Re: Advantages to have a small boat

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Originally Posted by nematon785 View Post
It is not necessary to own a boat at all to be flat broke, dumpster dive, or crap in a bucket! don't ask me how I know. Boat expenses or equipment failure can quickly force a fine Lady or Gentleman into this state though...
More likely personal decisions. Spending money you don't have seems high on the list.
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Old 23-03-2017, 11:13   #115
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Re: Advantages to have a small boat

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Perhaps a better question to us all is what would we choose if money were no object?
As much as I love my smaller boat... Gloucester schooner for me!!
If money were no object, I would have all of
- 2 or 3 windsurfers *
- a 16' beach cat
- 19'-22' trailerable/beachable microcruiser *
- 30' - 36' boat on the great lakes
- 40'+ boat for the Med or Carribean
- and I'd rent a 30' tug-like thing for doing canals

* 2 down, 3 to go!

Quote:
Originally Posted by daletournier View Post
I wonder what percentage of big yacht owners want a smaller yacht compared to small yacht owners wanting a bigger yacht?
I guess that depends what your metric for 'big' is, and where you are when you ask.

I can tell you that almost every time we trailer to a new place with our 19' micro-cruiser, we run into somebody who tells us how they moved from a small boat to a larger boat and weren't sailing as much, or had to give the big boat up for money, logistic, or health reasons.

We're seeking a larger boat (25' to 27'), but we are going to hang onto the 19' boat as well cos it's too much fun for so little money, and it provides opportunities not available to larger non-trailerable boats.
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Old 23-03-2017, 14:34   #116
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Re: Advantages to have a small boat

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Originally Posted by Tacmed View Post
I went from 53ft to 37ft. Best thing i ever did. My ego bought my first boat, my brain my second. Don't try to keep up with the jones's. When the winds blow strong, smaller is so much safer. The average size yacht sailing from Panama to Brisbane Australia is a 28ft mono (Source, Australian customs office )
I see a llt smaller mooring up where i am. How much room do you really need? Are you wanting a floating house or a yacht.
I just wonder if those stats includes boats that were shipped from the US east coast. Wakeboarding boats, fishing boats etc.....

There is no way in hell, the average sailing yacht, sailing on it's own bottom is 28ft or even 38ft for that matter
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Old 23-03-2017, 15:09   #117
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Re: Advantages to have a small boat

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Originally Posted by ctl411 View Post
Boat size is a compromise like everything else to do with boats. You can have complicated small boats and simple big boats. I've had trailer sailers up to the 50 we have now.
Small is less expensive if the same age/condition.
The bigger boat does allow us to cover more ground in more comfort/less discomfort. We sail to a schedule on vacation. So we always get some crap weather. Plus for the bigger boat takes weather better and still makes good miles.
Do we dock when we get there, nope. Only once now in 4 years. We use the dinghy or the kids Opti or the paddle board or the inflatable kayak. Different than our 37 we would dock a few time on a trip. So a trade off/compromise. But some of the place we like best don't have docks as a option anyway.
C&C37 draws more than our 50 which is under 6'.
Friends 39 centerboard draws 4.5 board up I think.
Lots of options, how boring would it be if we all had the same boat...
My point about big boats was their speed which in my case would be the main reason I would buy one being a former racer.

The C&C 37R is a very fast 40' boat with a PHRF of around 63

Your GULFSTAR 50 is a fine cruising boat but much slower than the C&C 37R with a PHRF of 126

But as I stated, I cannot get into some of the creeks I want to go in due to the C&C37R's 8.16" draft

There is a larger boat I like though and it's a C&C 32 with a near 6' draft and PHRF around 150 or so
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Old 23-03-2017, 15:35   #118
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Re: Advantages to have a small boat

[QUOTE=thomm225;2354608]

The C&C 37R is a very fast 40' boat with a PHRF of around 63

Your GULFSTAR 50 is a fine cruising boat but much slower than the C&C 37R with a PHRF of 126
/QUOTE]

Hmmmm, I wonder about that "much slower" part. 11 more feet of waterline can be very helpful!
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Old 23-03-2017, 17:50   #119
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Re: Advantages to have a small boat

Have them both sail to windward off the start/finish line together and I'm thinking you'll get the point.....

The C&C has a much deeper keel and is half as heavy as the Gulfstar plus has a 32' waterline. The sail area/disp of the C&C is 21 compared to 14.5 for the Gulfstar

PHRF New England - Handicapping - Base Handicaps

C&C

C&C 37/40 R sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com

Gulfstar

GULFSTAR 50 KTH sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com
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Old 23-03-2017, 18:10   #120
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Re: Advantages to have a small boat

Hmmm, PHRF is one way to judge boats' relative speed, but I THINK on certain points, off the wind a bit, with stronger breezes, the C&C 37 (and I had the wrong one with the shorter w.l. earlier) with its 8 or nine feet length less of waterline will be at a disadvantage compared to the Gulfstar, in spite of its SA/D poverty and heavier displacement. BUT I have never seen the two in a race together. I'd be happy to be proven wrong in my theories. BTW the PHRF of 126 ain't that bad for a cruising boat, is it?!
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