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Old 20-02-2004, 14:42   #16
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Hull Insurance: I think because there is less long term data on cats, insurance companies don't know how to assess the risks and either choose not to insure, or increase premiums to reduce their exposure for Cats. Certainly, having fewer players makes for less competition and increases premium prices. I don't think it's that bad really. Of course, you are right that the more expensive the boat the higher the premium, and newer cats can get quite spendy. But, If you check the price of a new Amel, you can see that it doesn't take two hulls to make a high price.

Medical: There are insurance plans (e.g. http://lifeboatmedical.com ) that offer "international insurance". You must be out of the US for at least six months of every twelve. A large portion of medical costs in the US are legal and malpractice insurance fees. By reducing your exposure to the US medical and legal system you can reduce your medical claim costs and offer reduced premiums. Some require you to have an address outside the US, and some don't. Most of the coverages are for major medical only with high deductibles.

Woody
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Old 21-02-2004, 07:44   #17
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Back to the original topic, in US Navy studies it was found that seasickness can be triggered differently in different people. In this study there were an equal number of people who are primarily affected by quick motion but who can live with large amounts of slower motion as compared to an equal number of people who are comfortable with quick motion but who develop seasickness when exposed to large amounts of slower motions. There is still an equally large group that can't tollerate either quick motion or large amounts of slower motions.

In this study the people who can tollerate quick motions have the best chance of accommodating over time. You will read annecdotal accounts of people who experience seasickness only on the first couple days at sea but then are fine. That group usually fall in the category of people who are comfortable with quick motion but who develop seasickness when exposed to large amounts of slower motions.

Depending on your personal characteristics, you may be more prone to seasickness on a Cat than a monohull. (I fall in that category) A study of the charter companies a few years back suggested that the number of people who cannot tollerate the motion of a catamarran is fairly large, although still significantly smaller than the figures for a monohull. One interesting side note was that a fairly large percent of those who reported seasickness on Cats indicated that they did not experience seasickness on Monohulls. If you are thinking about going the multihull route I would suggest spending some time on one first. You may be in the majority who thrive on the Catamarran motions or you may be in that smaller group for whom a Cat's motion is a killer.

In terms of reducing seasickness, there are a variety of things to try. Get a lot of sleep. Stay warm. Keep your sinuses clear. Avoid alcohol, caffeine, greasy or gas producing foods. Try to stay on deck, standing, and looking at the horizon. As mentioned steering can help some. There are a variety of medicines that can help with seasickess symptoms. If you are of a type that can accomodate after a few days at sea, then taking some of the oral meds for the first few days underway or when encountering a storm can help a lot. If you are person who is prone to seasickness no matter what, then the Transdermscop patch is a the way to go.

Good luck,
Jeff
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Old 21-02-2004, 21:09   #18
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Woody:

Thanks for the insurance information. I looked at a quick quote for the medical insurance and that alone's good reason to stay abroad the majority of the year.



Jeff:

Well, that was informative. I can see I'm a long way from resolving the monohull/catamaran decision. Maybe I can charter one of each this summer and see how it goes. I don't know what category I fall into. I never got seasick until I was on a ferry in 20' seas. Since then I've gotten sick every blessed time unless I use dramamine.

Do you know if you can use the patch long-term, should all else fail?


Kim
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Old 22-02-2004, 20:05   #19
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I believe that you can wear the patch for fairly long periods of time without having any side effects but I don't know for certain.

Jeff
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Old 24-02-2004, 21:48   #20
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A multihull may not be a cure-all for motion sickness. Cats and trimarans do have a more comfortable motion in a seaway but it is motion none the less. My wife would get queasy on our 22 foot monohull quite often but sailing on our trimaran has lessened the frequency by at least 75%. I have two friends who have gone out for daysails and their wives were puking in two foot seas and 10 knots of wind. Another friend who was with me on a recent 400 mile trip most of it running down wind in 20 knots and eight foot seas said that she would be puking her guts out in her dad's monohull in the same conditions. She was a little queasy once in a while but no real problems. Multihulls will have a more comfortable motion overall than monos but cats especially will have a quicker pitching motion fore and aft in steep closly spaced waves.
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Old 25-02-2004, 04:56   #21
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With all due respect, I disagree with your statement that "multihulls have a more comfortable motion overall". I would say that for some people, in some conditions cats have a more comfortable motion. But without the qualifier I would disagree with your statement, especially based on my own experience.

Jeff
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Old 25-02-2004, 06:49   #22
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insurance

Exposure,
See my post under "Insurance". I believe $800/mo. for a family of four cruising in the U.S. is not a bad deal. That doesn't mean it is not a lot of money, but I doubt that you will do significantly better. The bigger shock is the quote you will receive in 18 months when COBRA runs out and you have to look for individual coverage. My $355/mo. individual coverage under COBRA jumped to $1100 as an individual. No thanks.
Good luck.
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Old 25-02-2004, 08:18   #23
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Motion

Motion is in the feel of the beholder. A boat may feel more comfortable to one person but not another. If you are comfortable on a catarmaran it does not mean that the cat has a more comfortable motion, it means that you have a motion tolerance that suits the cat. Take three monohulls, a light weight, moderate and heavy displacement and you have three different motions. If you are lucky you may be comfortable in all manner of boats, most people have a preference. It is like beer, millions drink Bud but I will not. Michael Casling
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Old 26-02-2004, 01:58   #24
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Jeff, you do have a point. Multihulls do have a differant motion that monohull sailors may not be used to. They can have a quicker pitching motion in certain conditions. But I still stand by my opinion that overall they are more comfortable. Maybe that's the wrong word because comfort is subjective but I don't know what else to use. I have sailed monos for over 20 years and have had my tri for 7. We don't have lee cloths to hold us in our bunks or straps by the stove for cooking in rough weather. We just don't need that stuff, that says something to me. Running downwind there is no comparison. There is no rolling you just rise and fall with the waves. On that trip I mentioned we were runnning at 10-12 knots in eight foot seas, we were having lunch, you could leave your can of pop or cup of tea on the cockpit seat or put your plate down on the cabin top while you adjusted a sheet. I had just put in new cabinets in the galley and did not have the door latches yet but you know , no problem. That says something about the easy motion. Going upwind in a seaway there is not much differance in comfort other than the lack of extreme heeling (to me anything over 15 degrees is extreme).
I still like to take my monohull out and put the rail down and let her rip, it's alot of fun but to me sailing at 20-30 degrees or rolling my way downwind is just not as comfortable as sailing at 10 degrees or less with no rolling.
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Old 26-02-2004, 18:37   #25
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Further to multihulls, motion and seasickness, I take comfort that if I feel a bit queezy, and still have to get into the boat, I do not face the psychological problem of going down into a boat, but just stepping into an airy cabin. I am sure my feelings are just feelings, but so is a lot of the seasickness. I have had experiences where, when sick, I had to go down a companionway on a mono where the lighting was poor, the spaces were small, and odours were not properly controlled (foul head and bilge); and now I relate seasickness to that experience. Very unfair to monos in general, but there it is.
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Old 02-08-2005, 15:09   #26
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Motion - Monos and Cats

After my trip from Canada to Trinidad, I have another comment on this. My wife and I certainly had our sea legs by the time we got to the Grenadines in our Tobago 35 cat. However, when we spent social time on monohulls at anchor in the harbours, we found that the change in motion could still affect us, especially below decks. Quite possibly, these owners felt the same feeling in our cockpit, or at least inside our boat.

The motion is different, and getting used to a motion does not mean we get used to all motions.
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Old 02-08-2005, 15:14   #27
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Seasickness Medicine

During our trip across to Bermuda, and from Bermuda to the BVI, we tried all types of seasickness medicine. The accupressure bands needed more confidence to work on us; the Gravol made us sleepy and strung out; and the patches seemed to give us a chemical hangover that lasted for days.

We tried Stugeron, a drug highly praised in the literature, but only available in Britain and British areas. We purchased it in Bermuda, and found it to be excellent. The pills are chewable, and easy to get into you even at the 11th hour; they did not make us sleepy, and did not cause any after-effects to us. Best, is they made us feel much better while acquiring our sea legs.

I vote Stugeron.
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Old 02-08-2005, 21:07   #28
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Wow! this thread has been dredged up from the depths eh. And what a detour it took part way through. But anyway's, if the original poster is still reading here, Sorry, but you may never get used to it.
I have been seriuosly seasick just once. And honestly, I couldn't have cared less if the boat sunk beneath me right then and there. And I do mean that honestly as Seasickness can be that debilitating. It is also one reason why it can become very dangerouse, along side of the fact that a seroiusely ill crewmate can become dehydrated, so a watch on someone is most important.
As suggested, their are remidies that can help and make a sailing life possible. Plus, if you get through the initial few days of total misserableness, then you will "click" out of the feeling. I have a freind that is a commercial fisherman and he spends a few weeks once a year, going after the Bluefin Tuna that run down our NZ west coast. It's a misserable piece of coast line most of the time. Constant Nor'westers coming across the Tasman and a constant ruff sea. No where to shelter and so at night, they just have switch off the engines and lay a hull to it. I asked him if he ever got used to sea sickness and his reply was, No. He had been doing this for most of his life and he wasn't a young sprog.
But he did give me some valuable pointers that I have used ever since and they seem to work.
Firstly, as already stated before, a view of the horizon is very helpful. The horizon, especially land, gives you something stationary to fix on. Sometimes this isn't possible. So lay down on your back and look up at the ceiling. Especially for someone very ill. Don't lay on your side.
Sea sickness can also be just a thought or suggestive. You think you may get seasick and then you are. One trick I know off was from another sailer on a passenger ferry. He told a woman that seasickness was because you had an empty stomich, Eat and you will be fine. So she had a pie and had no problem on the ruff crossing. Surprised, I later asked the guy about this. His reply was, No it makes no difference, but it does make a difference psycologicaly. So it can make a difference with attitude. Sometimes it just a case of saying to your self, Right I am not going to be seasick anymore and it can indeed work. I wouldn't say it would in all cases though. But getting your mind onto something else can help. I myself was in a very nasty sea once, about two years back. It was a seaway that would normally have a montionj sickenss affect on me. But in this case, we were in a dangerouse location on a leeshore to a reef and huge tide which made the sea what it was. I won't go into the reasons why I was there, but I was so focused on trying to keep the vessel punching into the seas, of which we were launching half our hull out of, that I simply had no time to be sick. Simple as that. It was a lesson to me, err, on several accounts, but mainly in that it can indeed be delt with via a thought process.
And of course, the lotions potions and patches can be very helpful as well.
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Old 03-08-2005, 01:47   #29
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Has anyone had experience with a spray product called Motion Ease.Just spray on tongue when sea sickness symtoms come on and bingo, all better.I have friends in Florida who swear by this product.
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Old 03-08-2005, 01:53   #30
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HOLY COW! SEASICK SHMEASICK Who cares. I get queasy every time I go below on So, Lake Mi. So I just move my cooler topsides. Any way seasickness thins out the herd and lake MI is getting too crowded anyway. Point is, I love being on my boat and out on the water and I deal with the queasiness. Yes, its never been real bad but boating is more important. My kids are a pain in the ass to but I still go home at night. If you enjoy cruising, you'll deal with it. Or maybe you won't enjoy cruising.

Greg
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