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Old 26-09-2010, 01:50   #61
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Sjadows - Are you my shadow? The dark on the light side of me? Whilst you appear more sedate and I more feral I fear we both come from the same place with minds in the same space. Excellent advise to read those who've failed, goes along with my mantra of the best criminals avoid jails. The ones locked up inside proclaim innocence but its lies, the ones that remain free say they are guilty - so sue me
8 - Better to say I am both sides of my own coin, and I am become my own paradigm. I am, effectively, curiosity wrapped in a convenient fleshy package! Same place, same space, dancing with the lightnings with a grin on my face.

I could put lots of pretty words here, but some things are simple and ought to be expressed so.

Eventually some of us realize that pretty soon, in the next couple years, we're going to be "done". And, there's no negotiation in that, and there's not an ounce of give, no more than the mountain full of ice has. You realize that it's best to prepare for it and be ready, because it IS coming.

And thats why people like you and I, we wake up out of a dream and simply know.

This is what I'm going to take a shot at. I'm going to see if I can take this absolutely insane pipe dream and MAKE IT REAL.

Maybe, maybe not. But there's a lot worse ways to live, and I know more of 'em than I'd like. If I find I don't like it, well, I can find another path from there, can't I?

Besides. If I didn't try, I'd never know, and that would be worse than failure now.
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Old 26-09-2010, 18:13   #62
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I am become my own paradigm.
But how do you hoist it?

I understand you attach it to the halyard by the head and then also somehow to the dick?

Ooops - deck.

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Old 26-09-2010, 21:54   #63
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Surely you've heard of people who march to their own drummers before! lol
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Old 27-09-2010, 22:13   #64
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If you've never really been on the ocean, then like many others say here, you just need to go out and see for yourself if you enjoy it. Don't bust your teeth out on the first taste, meaning stay in relatively calm waters and just see if it's actually for you.

If it does look good to you at that point, then I suggest you take a hammer to your mouth and go looking for a good squall somewhere. The difference between 35 knots of wind and 55 isn't really that big when you're out in the ocean, so if you can get into a little tussle with ol' Mother Ocean and not feel overly intimidated (you'll probably be scared, and that's good! You just don't want to be so scared that you feel like running away) that will tell you the other important part.

After that, it's all one giant learning curve. I'm a pretty smart guy, and I've been around boats my entire life, but there is literally no end to the amount of expertise is required to maintain a boat, regardless of size. Some people can afford to have others do the work for them, others have to learn it all for themselves. Personally, I enjoy the challenge, and I think most sailors do as well.

There is a tremendous amount of work involved, but the glory of sailing is that everything is right there in your hands. Your obligations are in preparation (food, fuel, water, etc..) and then keeping the thing afloat en route to your destination. The guy who sold my family our first sailboat said that sailing is "98% bliss and 2% sheer terror." For most of us that have crossed oceans with nothing but our prep work and wits to save us, it's the perfect blend.

And of course, you get to live in places that most people only catch glimpses of in movies, rent free (if you take a few months to learn about anchoring, anyways).

But I'll echo the sentiment carrying through this thread: don't wait. Get out on a daysail with someone, ANYone immediately. Start trolling the docks with a six pack, looking for some salty old dude who wants an ear to chew on, and you'll be out on his boat in no time.
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Old 27-09-2010, 23:18   #65
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Med.

Your budget is a bit scarce... I would go for joining some boats as deckhand, that way you can learn a bit about sailing, make some money along the way, and see if the boat thing is for you. then, if it all works out, get your own boat when you are much more educated.
But that is just my 2 cents. you can do it and have the time of your life, no one can tell what suites another man.

And with tghat...
Awesome song! A good part of the world's people see America the way that song portrays it. I have talked to many people wwho think life it incredibly easy in America. Makes you wonder about our perceptions.
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Old 27-09-2010, 23:28   #66
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OK it's good that people are being encouraging but I think this thread needs a reality check.

All your talk of the "open sea" and freedom and "rodentine labyrinthistic structure" and all that makes you sound like a disgruntled worker with a romantic escapist fantasy.

Following advice to shop for and buy a boat now "and everything will come together all by itself" could potentially work out great, or it could lead you broke, with a rapidly deteriorating $30,000 liability, doing something it turns out you don't enjoy.

Find a way to spend time on boats now. If it turns out you like it, take lessons and get good at it. If you still like it, make a real, long-term financial plan, and stick to it.

What you're talking about right now sounds like a desperate escapist fantasy and could end poorly or worse. See also: Into The Wild.

You should sail because you love sailing, not because you hate working.
Brilliant.
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Old 27-09-2010, 23:29   #67
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Brilliant - I meant that seariously.
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Old 28-09-2010, 00:39   #68
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When I was much younger, I sailed on other people's boats. First on the Chesapeake Bay, and later on world cruiser's boats while I lived in Panama, and they were just "cruising" through.

I learned very quickly that the life of the itenerant sailor is certainly the life for me. And my dream was that "some day" I would be one of those happy, ranging-rovers. But of course, life got in the way, for what is life? As you quoted from the late, great J.Lennon - "Life is what happens when you're busy making other plans".

But the dream remained. And while I presently live in the desert, I have found that I can still sail (thanks to the human ingenuity of altering our environment with large blocks of concrete placed in the course of normally happy rivers). I bought a boat on eBay ... $1900 US ... an old 22 foot Hughes/Northstar. It came complete with trailer, full set of sails (original but useable), small outboard (that works like a charm!), and leaks a-plenty. She isn't ocean-worthy, but she's sailable, and she's my teacher for now.

In another 5 years I will have amassed what I consider to be my monetary fortune, I will find a boat that fits my needs. It will be within the budget that I set for myself, and it will carry me across the oceans to visit far away lands ... perhaps even the likes of Lilliput. Or I might even set a course for the third star on the right - and go straight on till dawn, and I'll fish for the herring fish that live in the beautiful sea. By that time, I will be 56 years young, and my dream will have waited 40 years for me to finally wake up.

I realized very quickly, when I first sailed on other people's boats, that sailing and I were made for each other. There is plenty to be "learned" from books, forums, and classes ... but none can confirm that the dream is real, or simply compare with doing it ... feeling it. When you take a tiller in your hand, and you feel the wind tighten the sails and halyards, and you feel the way the boat cuts through the water ... and the grin on your face gets so big it starts to hurt ... then you'll know that sailing is a good thing, and it is a right and joyful thing.

Stuff will happen as you "learn" to sail "your" boat ... maybe you'll run aground (how many out there on this forum have, or will admit it?) ... maybe you'll reef too late and blow a sail, or have the cr#p scared out of you as you turn her into the screaming wind and fight with an unruly sail while dousing her before the devil takes his due ... maybe you'll watch the sunset over the long rolling waters, while you ghost along at 3 knots with absolutely no land in sight (a peace known only by sailors) ... or maybe you'll listen to the whistle and clicks of the porpoise as they ride your bow wave. You can be technical about it all, or you can be spiritual about it all ... or you can be both. And who knows, maybe you'll end up like Crowhurst ... or maybe you'll end up like Moitessiere (my preference) ... but if you don't do it ... maybe you'll only read about these things, or those men, or dream about them. And then what will you have?
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Old 28-09-2010, 01:56   #69
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Saucy Sailoress - Why would you recommend missing Amsterdam? They have all the best drugs you know A friend of mine also suggested similar, he stated to go from the UK to France then around the Med basin and back for my first spin. I agree that it sounds sensible.
Yeah see - you've answered your own question twofold. But just to be sure you didn't miss the point, I'll spell it out:

1 - Drugs are addictive
2 - Amsterdam is addictive
3 - Addictions aren't easy to break
4 - Note - Your own mate suggested France as a starting point, NOT Amsterdam!

Get the idea?
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Old 28-09-2010, 07:36   #70
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Some of the typical learn-to-sail advice assumes you have readily disposable funds. If you are husbanding your money more carefully, then the lower-budget methods become more helpful.

You don't have to take only one path to your dreams; you could be crewing on other people's boats whilst practicing basic skills on your own inexpensive "starter" boat or small dinghy, finding inexpensive or free boating classes, hanging out with sailors at sailing centres/clubs/co-ops, looking for less expensive ways of getting to sail on bigger boats, and checking out books and videos from the library.

Many people nowadays don't have the patience for an unpowered cruising boat or don't have the skill to navigate an unpowered boat close to shore in some conditions (no wind, too much wind, or severe adverse currents), but perhaps you are an exception.

Time on the water is good. Sailing on different kinds of boats is excellent.

Having a boat is good. Having friends with boats is wonderful.

And,

There is no one perfect boat
(except maybe for "the next one").

Snug lines, fair winds
So True. I am one of those small budget sailers and you could have said it better.
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Old 28-09-2010, 07:45   #71
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When I was much younger, I sailed on other people's boats. First on the Chesapeake Bay, and later on world cruiser's boats while I lived in Panama, and they were just "cruising" through.

I learned very quickly that the life of the itenerant sailor is certainly the life for me. And my dream was that "some day" I would be one of those happy, ranging-rovers. But of course, life got in the way, for what is life? As you quoted from the late, great J.Lennon - "Life is what happens when you're busy making other plans".

But the dream remained. And while I presently live in the desert, I have found that I can still sail (thanks to the human ingenuity of altering our environment with large blocks of concrete placed in the course of normally happy rivers). I bought a boat on eBay ... $1900 US ... an old 22 foot Hughes/Northstar. It came complete with trailer, full set of sails (original but useable), small outboard (that works like a charm!), and leaks a-plenty. She isn't ocean-worthy, but she's sailable, and she's my teacher for now.

In another 5 years I will have amassed what I consider to be my monetary fortune, I will find a boat that fits my needs. It will be within the budget that I set for myself, and it will carry me across the oceans to visit far away lands ... perhaps even the likes of Lilliput. Or I might even set a course for the third star on the right - and go straight on till dawn, and I'll fish for the herring fish that live in the beautiful sea. By that time, I will be 56 years young, and my dream will have waited 40 years for me to finally wake up.

I realized very quickly, when I first sailed on other people's boats, that sailing and I were made for each other. There is plenty to be "learned" from books, forums, and classes ... but none can confirm that the dream is real, or simply compare with doing it ... feeling it. When you take a tiller in your hand, and you feel the wind tighten the sails and halyards, and you feel the way the boat cuts through the water ... and the grin on your face gets so big it starts to hurt ... then you'll know that sailing is a good thing, and it is a right and joyful thing.

Stuff will happen as you "learn" to sail "your" boat ... maybe you'll run aground (how many out there on this forum have, or will admit it?) ... maybe you'll reef too late and blow a sail, or have the cr#p scared out of you as you turn her into the screaming wind and fight with an unruly sail while dousing her before the devil takes his due ... maybe you'll watch the sunset over the long rolling waters, while you ghost along at 3 knots with absolutely no land in sight (a peace known only by sailors) ... or maybe you'll listen to the whistle and clicks of the porpoise as they ride your bow wave. You can be technical about it all, or you can be spiritual about it all ... or you can be both. And who knows, maybe you'll end up like Crowhurst ... or maybe you'll end up like Moitessiere (my preference) ... but if you don't do it ... maybe you'll only read about these things, or those men, or dream about them. And then what will you have?
Stuff will happen as you "learn" to sail "your" boat ... maybe you'll run aground (how many out there on this forum have, or will admit it?) ... maybe you'll reef too late and blow a sail, or have the cr#p scared out of you as you turn her into the screaming wind and fight with an unruly sail while dousing her before the devil takes his due ... maybe you'll watch the sunset over the long rolling waters, while you ghost along at 3 knots with absolutely no land in sight (a peace known only by sailors) ... or maybe you'll listen to the whistle and clicks of the porpoise as they ride "your bow wave. You can be technical about it all, or you can be spiritual about it all ... or you can be both. And who knows, maybe you'll end up like Crowhurst ... or maybe you'll end up like Moitessiere (my preference) ... but if you don't do it ... maybe you'll only read about these things, or those men, or dream about them. And then what will you have?" I am going to hang this on my wall - if you don't mind.

Don't let anyone deter you. It is amazing when you look back over your life and realize how much of it you literally give away. Sometimes for good (family) / sometimes for not (taxes). It is time for your dreams - go live them.
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Old 28-09-2010, 16:32   #72
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I think this has got to be one of the best "newbie, I wanna sail the world" threads ever (and we have some great threads!). Too many pithy posts to quote just one. This thread really captures the essence of that single spark, that catalyst, that moment of turning towards, the beginning of a life well lived. I had that catalyst moment at 19, sitting in a hammock in Houston. Reading this thread, I feel like I am in that hammock again at that beautiful moment when I realized I didn't have to live like everyone else, and sun began to shine.
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Old 28-09-2010, 21:09   #73
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i'm with you Ocean Girl... reading this thread from the beginning dredged up feelings I had from almost 60 years ago when I rescued a sunken dinghy off Spanish Banks in Vancouver, Canada. She was only 10 feet long but caulking her so she could stay afloat for over an hour, 8 foot mast with a splint in the middle and one sail cut out of a an old sheet was an experience that set me on a course that took me towboating, commercial fishing, coastal freighters and offshore deliveries for over 50 years. My heart still beats a little faster when I smell the ocean. My advice to '8' follows Barnakiel's and Ambloplites', try it, you'll know quick enough if it is for you. If you find yourself hugging the shore, perhaps you should go back to 4 wheels... Capt Phil
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Old 28-09-2010, 21:44   #74
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Yes you are totally bloody insane. Regardless, if it is of any comfort to you the “ordinary man” – that dweeb on the Clapton omnibus – would probably say the exact same thing about the rest of the people like yourself who have thrown it all in and headed to sea, some on an even scarier budget with a similar lack of experience.

I am just a bit ahead of you in the same plans and to date have not been diagnosed with any serious recognised psychiatric disorders that they have bothered to inform me of.. I suppose the good thing if I was is that I could cruise around the Pacific on next to nothing collecting a disability pension? Hey maybe I am really crazy?

My serious advice would be to hit Amazon.com and spend a fraction on your budget on Pardey’s Self Sufficient Sailor http://www.amazon.com/Self-Sufficient-Sailor-Larry-Pardey/dp/0964603675 from here you can follow the recommendations etc to other authors with low budget philosophies. In the last few editions of Classic Boat Magazine (UK) I have noticed a few very seaworthy wooden boats going for ₤20 K that state they have had 50-60 k spent on them over the last few years. The same might go cheaper and there has to be similar bargains getting about even at a fraction of this price.
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Old 28-09-2010, 21:50   #75
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In the last few editions of Classic Boat Magazine (UK) I have noticed a few very seaworthy wooden boats going for ₤20 K that state they have had 50-60 k spent on them over the last few years. The same might go cheaper and there has to be similar bargains getting about even at a fraction of this price.
There is a reason that 50-60k is spent. Wooden boats are a crime of passion.

Maintenance has been described as starting a refit of the wood at the stern and proceeding to the bow. When you reach the bow go back and start at the stern again.

I love the look of well cared for wood but I definitely do not have the passion for it.
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