Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 15-08-2012, 06:15   #16
Senior Cruiser
 
skipmac's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: 29 49.16 N 82 25.82 W
Boat: Pearson 422
Posts: 12,372
Re: Hello from Baton Rouge

Quote:
Originally Posted by AirMedMech View Post
So, I guess my first official question would have to be:
What would be an ideal training vessel for my my wife and I to learn the art of sailing?
Well, you could look at this question two ways. The art of sailing as in how to hoist, trim and generally propel a boat most efficiently with sails OR the much more complex issue of how to manage a cruising boat with regarding to navigation, safety, maintenance and all the other aspects of owning and cruising on a boat. The later I would call seamanship and would apply not just for sailboats.

If you want to learn just sail handling the best method is on a small boat like a Hobie Cat, or sunfish or something. In a smaller boat anything you do with the sails you see immediate response and can tell what effect your actions have on speed, healing, course, etc.

If your concern is seamanship and handling a larger boat, get something that is large enough to be comfortable for you but not so large you feel intimidated. For most people this might be something in the 25-30' range. That is large enough to have reasonable room on deck and below, heavy enough that the motion of the boat at sea is comfortable but not so large that maneuvering around the marina is scary (you can usually push the boat around by hand if necessary), sails and equipment aren't so large, etc.

If your situation and finances allow, could be a good idea to buy a starter or learning boat. That will let you get used to boating, learn what you like and don't like (which will almost certainly change over time) and be able to make a more informed decision on what you want for a more long term cruiser.
__________________

__________________
The water is always bluer on the other side of the ocean.
skipmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-08-2012, 07:23   #17
Registered User
 
AirMedMech's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 38
Well, just doing a quick search on line, I found a 1973 Catalina 27'. Needs work, but price seemed reasonable...
Not saying, I'm headed to pick this thing up, but would something like that serve the purpose?
__________________

__________________
AirMedMech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-08-2012, 08:32   #18
Senior Cruiser
 
skipmac's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: 29 49.16 N 82 25.82 W
Boat: Pearson 422
Posts: 12,372
Re: Hello from Baton Rouge

Quote:
Originally Posted by AirMedMech View Post
Well, just doing a quick search on line, I found a 1973 Catalina 27'. Needs work, but price seemed reasonable...
Not saying, I'm headed to pick this thing up, but would something like that serve the purpose?
The Catalina 27 was a great little boat. As long as it is in reasonable condition and a good price would be hard to go wrong. If I recall they came in outboard and inboard powered options. If the engine is in decent shape the inboard would of course be higher value but the outboard easier to repair or replace.
__________________
The water is always bluer on the other side of the ocean.
skipmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-08-2012, 08:39   #19
Registered User
 
AirMedMech's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 38
This is the ad I found:
"1973 Catalina 27' $2000 Springfield La I have sailed this boat on Lakes Pontchartrain and Maurepas for 3 years. Has main, jib, 150% Genoa. Top side repainted and deck hardware reset 2 yr ago. The sails and all the rigging is in good condition, most running rigging replaced last year . Replaced sliding hatch slides and runners. Companionway boards replaced with Lexan glass. New deck wash down pump and hose. 7.5 mercury outboard runs OK . Cabin walls replaced with cypress boards. Head rebuilt and has new 15 gal holding tank and new marceator pump. New DC electrical panel. Boat still needs some work. Bottom needs paint. Cabin needs some finishing up. Boat is ready to sail. Boat is currently in the water. Has no trailer."

Does any of this stand out as good or bad?
__________________
AirMedMech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-08-2012, 09:22   #20
Senior Cruiser
 
skipmac's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: 29 49.16 N 82 25.82 W
Boat: Pearson 422
Posts: 12,372
Re: Hello from Baton Rouge

Quote:
Originally Posted by AirMedMech View Post
This is the ad I found:
"1973 Catalina 27' $2000 Springfield La I have sailed this boat on Lakes Pontchartrain and Maurepas for 3 years. Has main, jib, 150% Genoa. Top side repainted and deck hardware reset 2 yr ago. The sails and all the rigging is in good condition, most running rigging replaced last year . Replaced sliding hatch slides and runners. Companionway boards replaced with Lexan glass. New deck wash down pump and hose. 7.5 mercury outboard runs OK . Cabin walls replaced with cypress boards. Head rebuilt and has new 15 gal holding tank and new marceator pump. New DC electrical panel. Boat still needs some work. Bottom needs paint. Cabin needs some finishing up. Boat is ready to sail. Boat is currently in the water. Has no trailer."

Does any of this stand out as good or bad?
No immediate, absolute red flag deal breakers but questions I would ask.

1. Mercury 7.5 HP runs OK. First Mercs are not my favorite outboard. And how OK? Needs to be reliable enough to get you away from the dock and back home if the wind dies and you have to be at work in a few hours.

2. Deck Hardware reset. One thing that will kill the value of an older boat is wet, rotten or delaminated deck core. 99% of the boats out there the deck is a sandwhich construction, fiberglass top and bottom; plywood, balsa, foam or other in the middle. If there were leaks from the deck hardware, especially into a plywood core and it sat for years the plywood could be rotten inside the glass outer layers. Could have been good maintenance when the hardware was reset or could have been because the core was going. If the core was wet and not dried before the job he could have sealed in the moisture and made the problem worse.

3. Cabin walls replaced with cypress. Why? Were the old "walls" stained or rotten from leaks? Check very carefully the main bulkheads ie. the walls that go across the boat to separate the different cabins, usually main cabin, head, forepeak. Look around the tops, edges and dig under lockers and cabinets to look at where these are attached to the inside of the hull. Look for water stains, rot and areas where the bulkhead attachments have come loose.

4. Rigging in good condition. Probably referring to the wires that hold up the mast ie standing rigging (as opposed to running rigging which are the ropes that hoist and adjust the sails). What is his opinion of good condition? Is it original or how old? Most experts recommend the standing rigging be replaced every 8-12 years max (depending on which expert you listen to and where and how much the boat was sailed). Look carefully at the fittings attached to the bottom end of the wires. In this case probably a stainless steel tube with an eye on the end called a swage fitting. If you see rust or ANY CRACKS AT ALL, question the rigging.

Most of the other stuff sounds like cosmetics, paint and varnish and possibly wood work stuff. If you're handy (and good practice if you aren't) you can do this yourself, just allow for that in the purchase price.
__________________
The water is always bluer on the other side of the ocean.
skipmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-08-2012, 09:27   #21
Registered User
 
AirMedMech's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 38
Awesome. Thanks for the advice! Im thinking it would at least be worth going and having a look...
__________________
AirMedMech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-08-2012, 09:56   #22
Senior Cruiser
 
skipmac's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: 29 49.16 N 82 25.82 W
Boat: Pearson 422
Posts: 12,372
Re: Hello from Baton Rouge

Quote:
Originally Posted by AirMedMech View Post
Awesome. Thanks for the advice! Im thinking it would at least be worth going and having a look...
If not too far certainly worth the look. Guess I don't have to warn you that sellers have been known to describe things better than the actually look.

Also, sending you a PM.

Skip
__________________
The water is always bluer on the other side of the ocean.
skipmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-08-2012, 10:51   #23
Registered User
 
AirMedMech's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 38
Well aware of over zealous sellers! LOL
I'm about 45 minutes away from this thing, so definitely not too far out of the way...
__________________
AirMedMech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-08-2012, 12:26   #24
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: W Carib
Boat: Wildcat 35, Hobie 33
Posts: 7,909
Re: Hello from Baton Rouge

Quote:
Originally Posted by AirMedMech View Post
So, I guess my first official question would have to be:
What would be an ideal training vessel for my my wife and I to learn the art of sailing?

As others have said, smallish (25-30) monohull, is ideal for learning because it is responsive and has minimal "quirks" in its sailing behavior (unlike H-16's for example).

While buying a small relatively inexpensive boat to learn on is not a bad idea, keep in mind that you don't have to own the boat to learn on it. Even if you buy the Catalina 27, a good choice for this purpose I think, then still seek out opportunities to sail on other boats. This will increase your knowledge of boats and broaden your hands-on experience.

Dramatic case in point, in my 20's I had the opportunity to crew for an older guy in his 70's. He had been sailing decades longer than I had been alive. I thought -- "Wow, what a great learning opportunity!". Turns out this old guy had only ever sailed the same boat in the same around the bouys events at the yacht club....for decades. Due this very narrowly limited experience, his sailing knowledge and skills were also quite limited. What a disappointment -- I ended up having to take over handling of his boat in a storm because he was clueless what to do.
__________________
belizesailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-08-2012, 12:41   #25
Registered User
 
AirMedMech's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 38
Sounds like he had a well established and very narrow comfort zone!
__________________
AirMedMech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-08-2012, 12:47   #26
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: W Carib
Boat: Wildcat 35, Hobie 33
Posts: 7,909
Re: Hello from Baton Rouge

Quote:
Originally Posted by AirMedMech View Post
Sounds like he had a well established and very narrow comfort zone!
Very much so, and big winds and big seas in the mid-atlantic were waaay outside that box.

Even though I had decades less experience than he, mine was much broader. So, buy yourself a little boat to learn on and go sailing on others at every opportunity.
__________________
belizesailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-08-2012, 17:28   #27
Registered User
 
AirMedMech's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 38
That doesn't sound like my style at all. In my opinion, one has to know one's limits, and respect one's limits, but always push against that boundary and constantly expand one's capabilities. To do less is to lose some of that excitement and adventure life can bestow upon us.
__________________
AirMedMech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-08-2012, 20:40   #28
Registered User
 
AirMedMech's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 38
Went and examined the boat today. Had a commercial diver friend examine the hill below the waterline for us. This boat is definitely worth more than what is being asked.

We're headed down to Lakefront Airport in New Orleans tomorrow. I know there's a marina right next to the airport. I'm thinking after we're done troubleshooting aircraft, we might pop in and see what's shaking at that little marina as well...
__________________
AirMedMech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-08-2012, 21:18   #29
Registered User
 
AirMedMech's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 38
Oh, and I picked up Sailing For Dummies, and The Annapolis Book of Seamanship off of Amazon. Both are awesome books.
__________________
AirMedMech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-09-2012, 19:48   #30
Senior Cruiser
 
SkiprJohn's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2006
Location: Kea'au, Big Island, Hawaii
Boat: Cascade, Sloop, 42 - "Casual"
Posts: 14,192
Re: Hello from Baton Rouge

Aloha and welcome aboard!

You asked what boat would be good for you and your wife to learn to sail aboard and I'd recommend any boat that the local sailing school has lessons on.

The Catalina 27 you looked at is the cheapest one I've seen on the market. They go for $5K plus but you might want to take a class or two before purchase because once you learn to sail you might have different priorities for the boat.

A good basic sailing book is "Start Sailing Right!"

kind regards,
__________________

__________________
John
SkiprJohn is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:54.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.