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Old 28-05-2011, 03:43   #16
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Re: Catamaran in the Philippines

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Originally Posted by Bruce626 View Post
There is a 22 hp Volvo Penta marine diesel in the port hull. This will help charge the battery bank nearby and Nigel says it will push the boat at around six knots. The prop has some kind of cage around it to keep debris from fouling it (if not, that is what the AirLine hooka is for) . I guess this is how one goes upwind.
Hi Bruce - Congratulations on launching your cat & I really enjoyed readng your detailed description.

I have a question though regarding the motors as from your description it sounds like it only has a motor in the port hull, Can you elaborate on this please as with only one motor in the port hull I cannot see how you would steer a straight course without going around in circles.

All the best,
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Old 28-05-2011, 08:36   #17
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Re: Catamaran in the Philippines

No referigeration? You must prefer Rum over beer.
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Old 05-06-2011, 04:43   #18
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Re: Catamaran in the Philippines

Hi Bruce626,
I hope your experience sailing in the PI is going well so far. How is the Cat holding up? I am Nigel's daughter and lived on the original cat he designed and built back in 2000. I haven't seen Nigel for several years as I live in Australia, but was curious as to how the boat has been changed and modified over the years? Please feel free to message me if you would like to have a chat.

Kim
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Old 05-06-2011, 10:15   #19
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Re: Catamaran in the Philippines

Yes, only the one engine. It does however, have two rudders so I have simply assumed that I can correct for the off center-line thrust. I really didn't want to have a noisy and smelly diesel engine in the same hull I live in. The maids will just have to put up with the noise and smell as their berth is relatively close to the engine. Hopefully I will sail much of the time and then will only have to correct for a bit of extra port drag. If circumstances warrant, I can probably add another engine at some point in the future.
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Old 05-06-2011, 10:20   #20
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Re: Catamaran in the Philippines

I am anticipating the installation of a cooler or two - but likely for food storage as I dislike beer (it was also a problem in the Army which is a coffee and beer organization and I am a tea and wine drinker) and rarely drink rum - although I have used the white Tanduay rum here as mouthwash as it is cheaper than Listerine (or whatever).
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Old 05-06-2011, 10:23   #21
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Re: Catamaran in the Philippines

I haven't actually been on the boat since it was launched. The rigging is still being worked on - but I hope to be going there soon. Did you enjoy living on a sailboat?
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Old 05-06-2011, 10:45   #22
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Re: Catamaran in the Philippines

OK, I think that I have attached two pictures. It says attached thumbnails but then it says 0 size followed by a size in KB so I am not sure.
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Old 05-06-2011, 11:18   #23
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Re: Catamaran in the Philippines

Ooh, nice boat! Very short(shallow) rudders. I had to lengthen the one on my first banka to get it to turn in a reasonable distance and in weather, but I'd assume that Nigel has used this size previously. Regardless, you'll have the opportunity to test them out on the sail test. You'll have to come down & see us on Samal(@Tagpopangan). Best of luck with completion! Did you have a chance to speak to John M.?
Mike
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Old 05-06-2011, 18:19   #24
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Re: Catamaran in the Philippines

Just found this site and love it already.
I spend time running around the Philippines and expect we will meet up someday. My boat’s name is Carabao. I built it there
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Old 05-06-2011, 20:31   #25
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Re: Catamaran in the Philippines

I tried to contact him by posting a 'paging' message on the site - no response. Someone sent me a link to many John M.s but I don't know which one.

The rudders look big when one is next to them - most bancas seem to have a postage stamp to go with their tiny prop. Some time ago another poster on another forum mentioned that he had built a banca and it didn't turn well either. He claimed to have improved the steering by moving the amas (outriggers) back so instead of being centered the aft ends were aligned with the stern of the banca.Thread drift follows:

Rather than install an engine on a small banca that is often used by poor fishermen, I have toyed with building a demonstration prototype using pedal power - similar to the many pedal trikes one sees on the roads.

32) Banka propulsion – with fuel getting more expensive, an inexpensive retrofit for mid sized fishing bankas could be foot powered side paddles. One can see a similar technology in use in fish ponds where the paddles are mounted on a floating platform and spun by an electric motor in the center with two side paddle wheels used to aerate the water. This can be especially useful on the small bankas which are usually paddled since the cross arms that support the outriggers make paddling awkward (if the outriggers and their supports are set back sternward a bit instead of being centered, the boat might steer better as well) – but the small banka will need to be fitted with a rudder for steering.

Using a simple bracket that fits onto the gunwales one can use two or four paddles (or more) per side connected to a simple foot crank used for pedaling in a recumbent position and steering with a rudder – crank dimensions can be obtained from bicycle pedals (6.5”). It might be useful to have a method of reducing bearing friction – oil, grease, or Teflon inserts. Mounting the bearing brackets is the most critical operation as they must be level with one another and exactly aligned in yaw and roll – perhaps by using an inexpensive laser pointer. For prototype tests and small bankas, the bushing can be as simple as two blocks on the top of the gunwale with a top piece that locks the shaft down – if the bearing slot is square, the cylindrical shaft will only bear at two or three points, places where a smooth plastic insert (Teflon?) can be placed to reduce friction.

One can double the power of the side wheels by putting in another seat on the other side of the crank (one person facing forward, steering, and the other facing aft). A piece of plastic pipe can be used for a circular bushing to hold the pedal blocks and allow them to easily swivel. If paddle spray is a problem the paddle blades (made from cheap steel shovel heads?) can either be canted outward a bit to throw the spray away from the hull or spray screens can be fitted.

Two sided paddles might be used so that the paddles lie in the same plane as the crank so that both sets of paddles are out of the water when horizontal for beaching. Side paddles will not interfere with the outriggers and a simple pole running from the gunwale to the outrigger will support each paddle out of the water if desired. The whole assembly can be made to be easily removable if required so it can be moved out of the way while fishing or storing the banka. Foot platforms (grooved wood blocks glued together and held centered with washers welded to the crank – perhaps with a Teflon insert to reduce friction) can also be added for comfort and increased power application with pipes placed onto the rod stock prior to bending for foot pedals.

A four paddle wheel will give a smoother ride but may interfere with beaching if the paddles dip below the keel unless they are removable. More paddles, larger wheels, and gearing options can be added if desired on larger bankas – pamboats. As paddles are added it may be desirable to add hoops for reinforcing – and if strong enough, the hoops can act as wheels to move he boat over relatively smooth surfaces such as a beach.

One gearing option that may be useful is to rig the system so that one side wheel goes forward while the other goes backward allowing the boat to spin on its axis for sharp turns. Another option for gears is to put a fixed toothed gear just inside of each bearing – one could power a flexible shaft that could run a small impeller type bilge pump and the other could run a small twelve volt DC motor acting as a generator for LED navigation lights. It is possible that the paddle wheels will interfere with the long steering pole commonly used and a possible modification might be to shorten the pole and optionally fix it to a vertical rod pivoted at the bottom (a slotted board might be used to hold the rudder straight ahead or at various fixed angles).
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Old 05-06-2011, 20:35   #26
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Re: Catamaran in the Philippines

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Just found this site and love it already.
I spend time running around the Philippines and expect we will meet up someday. My boat’s name is Carabao. I built it there
Do you live on the hook? Have you had any boat security problems? What is your cruising area? I will likely be in the Visayas for the next couple of years, making my way around each of the major islands a day (or so) at a time - and visiting the smaller islands as well. I will keep an eye out for you when I am actually on the water.
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Old 07-06-2011, 11:09   #27
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Re: Catamaran in the Philippines

I believe you will regret having one motor. The boat will be difficult in tight quarters. Also she will not handle well going in reverse. Yes, it is a sailing boat, but one engine will lead a novice, and even an experienced person to grief sooner, or later.........i2f
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Old 07-06-2011, 11:25   #28
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Re: Catamaran in the Philippines

Bruce i am concerned that you think paddle wheels are an efficent propulsion method.
The propellor drive option was demonstrated as most efficent in 18/1900,s if you rig a dynamo up to your excersize bike and battery with a electric engine then you may get a burst of effective drive for such a large boat?

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Old 07-06-2011, 19:17   #29
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Re: Catamaran in the Philippines

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I believe you will regret having one motor. The boat will be difficult in tight quarters. Also she will not handle well going in reverse. Yes, it is a sailing boat, but one engine will lead a novice, and even an experienced person to grief sooner, or later.........i2f
It is possible. Once I get some experience I will have a better idea. This way allows me to get going sooner at less cost - I figure that if it really bothers me I can pile up some more money and install another engine. It seems like roughly the same amount of work will be done now or later. The builder did not seem to have a problem with it and he is the one with forty years experience living aboard, maintaining, designing, and building boats - I have no experience yet. If he had pushed on a second engine it is likely that I would have gotten it - after all, what do I know? He does build boats with dual outboards hung under the bridge deck - I looked at another catamaran with this option but didn't like the reduced clearance. I have often wondered why builders don't just put outboards on a fixed or movable 'transom' near the water at the swim steps - no one does it so I must be missing something. Mounted like this they would be near the water, could be kicked up or removed when anchored (most of the time) - especially with davits to assist, and easy to repair or exchange.
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Old 07-06-2011, 19:42   #30
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Re: Catamaran in the Philippines

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Bruce i am concerned that you think paddle wheels are an efficent propulsion method.
The propellor drive option was demonstrated as most efficent in 18/1900,s if you rig a dynamo up to your excersize bike and battery with a electric engine then you may get a burst of effective drive for such a large boat?

Apparently as the warden said to Cool Hand Luke - "What we have here is a failure to communicate." The paddle wheels are not for my catamaran - they are for the small local bancas typically used by poor fishermen here in the Philippines (and other nearby countries). The comparison is not with a propeller but with a paddle. I have paddled these small boats and it sucks - the wood paddles are heavy and the bamboo outriggers and their supports (amas and akas) get in the way big time and prevent long more efficient strokes. I believe that side paddle wheels would be a major improvement as one would be using the stronger leg muscles while sitting in a more comfortable reclining position (the upper body arm muscles are the ones used most in fishing - typically with nets). Side paddle wheels are cheap to build and easy to retrofit - and there is no hole through the bottom of the boat - or fuel / maintenance cost. One sees these guys, wrapped up like mummies, miles out to sea with only a paddle in a boat that has only inches of free-board and no PFD (I designed one of those too, made out of trash - scraps of old net and empty plastic bottles. Perhaps the idea won't work, I would be interested in hearing your low cost ideas of how to do this more efficiently - I have no nautical nor engineering experience, just the occasional odd idea.
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