Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 04-11-2015, 12:47   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 5
Awlgrip paint cracking

My boat was painted June 20 2015 with Awlgrip. Most incredible job and it was perfect for 3 months. On October 14 2015, 4 months after painting at least 50 one inch vertical cracks have appeared.
Before painting there were no gel coat cracks. Preparation was sanding and a primer coat.
I believe there is a problem with the paint. Has anyone ever had this problem. I would appreciate your input. Thanks
__________________

__________________
ALHAYS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 12:56   #2
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: North Carolina
Boat: 44 footer
Posts: 923
Re: Awlgrip paint cracking

Question:

Did you do this paint job yourself, or did you contract it out?
__________________

__________________
Zach is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 13:11   #3
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 5
Re: Awlgrip paint cracking

The paint job was totally done by a contractor
__________________
ALHAYS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 13:15   #4
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Halifax, Canada
Boat: Hughes 35
Posts: 86
Re: Awlgrip paint cracking

I had the same problem with Kiwi Grip.
__________________
pierrrre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 13:58   #5
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 5
Re: Awlgrip paint cracking

Was it the paint? Was it repaired?
__________________
ALHAYS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 16:13   #6
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,061
Re: Awlgrip paint cracking

Have seen that. The bad news is that it's not a defect in the paint or application. It's in the layup and the boat builder's fault, and your boat is probably long out of warranty. I spoke with 2 pros who paint boats all the time and they both said it's rare but it happens and they don't know how to detect it in advance.

The problem is small air bubbles or voids beneath the underlying gelcoat, at the gelcoat/layup interface. If you were to sand the gelcoat nearly all the way through the gelcoat to the fiberglass layup you'd see small voids or pinhole gaps. The cracks are there from soon after the time the boat was built -- but they were very fine and not detected (and they were probably filled with compound/wax residue and any other coatings applied to the gelcoat).

The paint is a much smoother non-porous surface and is more flexible than gelcoat, and as it cures it shrinks to a high surface tension. The cracks in paint form when small defects of the underlying substrate expand/contract out of proportion to the rest of the surface.

If you went back to the boat builder with photos of the defect they'd likely take a position something like: "It's long out of warranty and the finish wore out, and it was fine for X years longer than our warranty."

The gelcoat must be removed (about 99%) until the voids are exposed, then if you follow the Awlgrip "textbook" -- use Hullguard Extra epoxy filler, then High Build Primer, then 545 Epoxy Primer, then color coat(s). Unfortunately that's more work than your original paint job.

You can live with it, or talk with your paint contractor and get Awlgrip involved. Awlgrip has seen this before, although they might pretend they haven't and tell you they need to investigate by "destructive tests" (sanding through to the bottom of the gelcoat). Chances are your painting contractor can get Awlgrip to supply free replacement materials and the painting contractor might cut you a break on the labor.

The deal you want to cut before any destructive testing is:
1) If it's a defect in the underlying gelcoat, prove it and give me your best reduced rate fixed-price to fix it forever, with a 3 year 100% warranty against cracking (other than wear/collision and abuse).
2) If the tests show it's in the paint or prep then you fix it for free.

If you don't cut one of the deals above you might just want to live with it, or get competitive bids, or consult an attorney. Unfortunately an attorney gets paid in most situations no matter what the outcome.



__________________
SailFastTri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 16:50   #7
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,061
Re: Awlgrip paint cracking

PS -- The image of dark blue surface above showing cracks is gelcoat -- that was AFTER the cracked paint was sanded off. The gelcoat was wetted with solvent to show the cracks. The other picture shows the fiberglass substrate after the gelcoat was completely sanded off.
__________________
SailFastTri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 17:44   #8
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 5
Re: Awlgrip paint cracking

Sailfish Tri
Thank you for the awesome response. I want to add some information. The boat is a 1988 and has been painted now the third time with Awlgrip. It has never cracked before. Do you have any additional thoughts.
They want to sand the paint to see if it is the fiberglass. How can I be assured that they are being honest? I must add the contractor is highly reputable. If it's fiberglass it will be at my expense. If it is the paint it is their cost. The paint job was for Red stripes on the Celebrity 26.5 ft and has already cost $4,500.

Thank you so much for your help.
__________________
ALHAYS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 18:04   #9
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,061
Re: Awlgrip paint cracking

Quote:
Originally Posted by ALHAYS View Post
Sailfish Tri
Thank you for the awesome response. I want to add some information. The boat is a 1988 and has been painted now the third time with Awlgrip. It has never cracked before. Do you have any additional thoughts.
They want to sand the paint to see if it is the fiberglass. How can I be assured that they are being honest? I must add the contractor is highly reputable. If it's fiberglass it will be at my expense. If it is the paint it is their cost. The paint job was for Red stripes on the Celebrity 26.5 ft and has already cost $4,500.

Thank you so much for your help.
I don't know why it never happened before. Maybe (I'm only guessing) Awlgrip changed the formula over the years, and the new paints are not as good at dealing with this issue?

In any event, this is not a paint-over situation. They have to sand off the defective layers completely, and build up again as I described above. It's a much bigger job than a quick rough sand to get some "tooth" on the prior surface.

If the issue is in the substrate as shown in my photos above, you will see the defects yourself in the gelcoat first as shown in the dark blue surface (you have to wet it because a chalky rough sanded gelcoat surface won't show it) and when you sand deeper down to the fiberglass you'll see the voids or pinholes. When you see it yourself there's no arguing. If you question your own judgment, find another paint contractor in the area or marine surveyor and hire him for a professional consultation for a reasonable fee. It should only take ~15 minutes plus travel time.
__________________
SailFastTri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 18:24   #10
Registered User
 
S/V Illusion's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Lakewood Ranch, FLORIDA
Boat: Alden 50, Sarasota, Florida
Posts: 1,693
Re: Awlgrip paint cracking

We had a boat years ago with similar vertical cracks. It was not due to any flaws in the underpayment or the prep. I could recite a long and tedious story describing the assessment by the yard and Awlgrip but suffice it to say -

Vertical cracking is a result to flexing of the topsides under normal use. While the glass is somewhat flexible (just push on it on any boat to see), the paint is not. Fiberglass is not rigid.

This happens frequently and no amount of surface prep will prevent it.

They repainted ours after some litigious moments and I lost track of the boat to see how it 'survived'. Our current boat is also painted as we don't like the typical vanilla hulls and so far, so good after 9 years.
__________________
S/V Illusion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 19:07   #11
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 5
Re: Awlgrip paint cracking

Thank you for all the help. I will post as it progresses.
__________________

__________________
ALHAYS is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
paint

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Gel coat cracking, hull oxidized question photousa Construction, Maintenance & Refit 33 11-03-2015 04:31
Mast collar cracking around turning block pins jkalucki Deck hardware: Rigging, Sails & Hoisting 4 23-02-2015 10:32
Cabintop Gelcoat Cracking Repair cburger Construction, Maintenance & Refit 5 02-12-2013 21:15
Catalina keel cracking... dropanchorfor3 Monohull Sailboats 5 13-03-2013 04:08
star cracking around shrouds fenceguy2 Construction, Maintenance & Refit 6 15-02-2008 01:33



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:42.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.