Any Boat Builders Here ?

[sail_socal]

Not only do I want to cruise the open ocean, I want to design and build my own boat for it. Either one of those goals is hard enough, so I might be a bit crazy thinking I can do both.

Is anyone else here building a boat, or thinking about it?

[anjou]

Yassum.

Banging my head against the wall as I write.

My advice would be, ......building your boat should be fun.
Once it becomes a chore, forget it.

[Doodles]

Originally Posted by sail_socal

Not only do I want to cruise the open ocean, I want to design and build my own boat for it. Either one of those goals is hard enough, so I might be a bit crazy thinking I can do both.

Is anyone else here building a boat, or thinking about it?

Thought about it ... gave it up and bought a boat. Life's too short to spend years building something you can have now for less.

[knottybuoyz]

Originally Posted by Doodles

Thought about it ... gave it up and bought a boat. Life's too short to spend years building something you can have now for less.

Sometimes it's not only about the destination but the journey too!

"The road of life twists and turns and no two directions are ever the same. Yet our lessons come from the journey, not the destination.”

Don Williams, Jr. (American Novelist and Poet, b.1968)

[Doodles]

Originally Posted by knottybuoyz

Sometimes it's not only about the destination but the journey too!

"The road of life twists and turns and no two directions are ever the same. Yet our lessons come from the journey, not the destination.”

Don Williams, Jr. (American Novelist and Poet, b.1968)

Absolutely, its all about the journey for sure. And building a boat can be a wonderful journey. I built a sailing dinghy once so I know something about the learning curve and the satisfaction of the process. I also have read too many stories about boats that are never finished or it took 10 years instead of the two they planned. If you really want to build a boat, I say do it for sure, but if you really want to go cruising I think you will get going a lot sooner if you just buy something. And chances are once you are out cruising you aren't going to wish you were back home building a boat and dreaming of cruising one day.

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by Doodles

Thought about it ... gave it up and bought a boat. Life's too short to spend years building something you can have now for less.

And what if the boat you want to cruise in doesn't exist?
And even if it did exist you probably couldn't afford or justify buying it?

Fine if you can accept and be happy with the "standard" selection of boats offered on the market
For others, "standard" is not good enough and we have to build.

[cburger]

[QUOTE=knottybuoyz;494679]Sometimes it's not only about the destination but the journey too!

I would suggest it's all about the journey, I find that often the destination is melodramatic.

[smallyachts]

* Take this with grain of salt from someone who knows.

I have built a couple of boats over the years, and assisted with many others.

The projects that went at a reasonable rate were built off a good set of plans from a knowledgable designer. The projects that took longer than normal, were home designed by amatuers (myself included)

A quick example,

Hurricane Frances got ahold of our ketch and put her on a seawall, minimal damage, threw on a temporary patch and moved her under her own power to a boatyard for repairs.

Damage to the hull from the storm was 99% cosmetic and the 1% structural damage was repaired in less than 30 days.

Then I got a GREAT IDEA. Hair is getting thinner, dogs are getting harder and harder to lift in and out of the forward or aft cabins. Let's put a pilot house on, save my scalp from skin cancer and my back from lifting the dogs.

I toyed around with having a designer draw me up a set of plans, but after all its only a pilot house, why would I need a set of plans.

3 months concept to dried in pilot house framing.
18 months and working on various window frames.
12 months and working on companionway access to aft cabin.
6 months and working on companionway access to forward cabins.
12 months and working on pilot house door design, should they slide or swing?
Redesign of both galley and nav station in forward cabins - still "designing"
Redesign of aft cabin layout - one very big cabin as it is, or two big cabins.
Reconfigure fuel and water tankage - still "designing"
The list goes on.......

And I still have to figure out winch, tracks, blocks and traveler positions now that the pilot house has touched all of those systems.

Between SystemTamers and SmallYachts taking up over 60 hours a week, I only get a few hours a week to work on the boat.

My advice -

Buy a good boat, go cruising and have fun. When you get cruising out of your system (if that ever happens ), by all means come back, have a boat professionally designed, or buy a set of proven stock plans and build to your hearts content.

Good solid boats are going for pennies on the dollar during this economy, you may have to go across the country to find the right one, but it will be cheaper and faster than building one, and certainly safer than an amatuer design.

[Doodles]

Originally Posted by cat man do

And what if the boat you want to cruise in doesn't exist?
And even if it did exist you probably couldn't afford or justify buying it?

Fine if you can accept and be happy with the "standard" selection of boats offered on the market
For others, "standard" is not good enough and we have to build.

In those cases, I think it is not about going cruising but more about the boat or an image of the boat that you have to have.

What boat is it that doesn't exist that you can't go cruising without?

What can you build that will be cheaper and better than some of the "standard" boats on the market?

[smallyachts]

Originally Posted by cat man do

And what if the boat you want to cruise in doesn't exist?
And even if it did exist you probably couldn't afford or justify buying it?

Fine if you can accept and be happy with the "standard" selection of boats offered on the market
For others, "standard" is not good enough and we have to build.

I guess my first question then would be - How much experience (coastal / offshore) does he have in order to be able to make the determination of what he wants to cruise in?

If he looks at the "real cost" of building this boat, if he can't afford to buy a similar boat at depressed prices that currently are out there, he can't afford to build it either.

A. You have to have a place to build it, even if you own the property, there is a cost there, additional utilities costs, insurance for the project etc..

B. You have to include the costs of your labor - in reality even a homebuilders labor cost something, rent, food, utilities, insurance etc...(after all, if you weren't stuck there building it, you could be cruising on that money)

Without experience as mentioned above, how can he determine if a "standard" boat is not good enough.

[Vasco]

I have found generally that those who like building boats don't end up sailing or cruising for long. Of course there are exceptions to this but I've known half a dozen guys who built their own boats, one taking 17 years to do so. I think they end up enjoying the building more than the sailing. By the time the boat's ready the sailing or cruising dream has faded. The one exception I saw, in my limited experience, was a guy who quit his job and spent the next year working night and day to build his boat. When it was finished he headed south with his wife and two kids. That was twenty years ago and he's still cruising Florida and the Bahamas.

[SkiprJohn]

Aloha and welcome aboard the forum of many opinions!
My opinion is that if you want to cruise within a couple of years now is the time to buy the boat you want to cruise in. It'll take you a couple years to learn your boat, how to sail it, add cruising items and get your schedule together.
If you want to build a boat it can take a lifetime and cost much more than a purchase and since you are an amatuer will probably not be as good plus will not be able to resell.
Seriously, think about it.
kind regards,

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by Doodles

In those cases, I think it is not about going cruising but more about the boat or an image of the boat that you have to have.

Wrong
For me it was about a vessel that my wife will be happy to be on.
We had built and cruised a 32 foot cat for 5 years previously, but it was to small to livaeboard so we needed something different.

After several years of observation , we decided to build what we are building

What boat is it that doesn't exist that you can't go cruising without?

Something that is long light and low powered able to economical miles in "The land beneath the wind" something that has shallow draft and does not need stabilisers, something that has a king sized bed, a "REAL" dinghy, a head that was outside of the living area and lots and lots of shade.

What can you build that will be cheaper and better than some of the "standard" boats on the market?

What I am building now
To buy something remotely close would cost $500k plus and still wouldn't fit the bill as production boats are notoriously overweight requiring additional HP defeating the intended purpose of this vessel.

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by smallyachts

I guess my first question then would be - How much experience (coastal / offshore) does he have in order to be able to make the determination of what he wants to cruise in?

Good point, I believe I had a fair bit

If he looks at the "real cost" of building this boat, if he can't afford to buy a similar boat at depressed prices that currently are out there, he can't afford to build it either.

Not true in my case, not even close.
Closest vessel that gets near to what we want is still $500k and tired
Compared to $140k and brand new.

A. You have to have a place to build it, even if you own the property, there is a cost there, additional utilities costs, insurance for the project etc..

Have it
$1500 for a shed
probably $20 mth extra in electricity
Household insurance under the existing policy covers it

B. You have to include the costs of your labor - in reality even a homebuilders labor cost something,

Sure you do
I reckon that I have priced in a reasonable rate of pay for our build (if we sold) and tax free dollars as well.
Boatbuilders are out of work at the moment, but I have a job working for me at the pace that I like, without all the silly rules that "working for the man" has.

While building this I have also been able to build up a reasonable income stream for when we cruise.
This is something I could not have done if I was out there on a boat.
There would have been to much missed opportunity

rent, food, utilities, insurance etc...(after all, if you weren't stuck there building it, you could be cruising on that money)

If I could find the boat (it doesn't exist remember)
If I did I would need $500k now, not a trickle charged $140 over several years

Without experience as mentioned above, how can he determine if a "standard" boat is not good enough.

Yes, there is that, but I believe in my case I have the experience


The point is that if you want a 40 ft mono, a 40 ft high speed powered mono, a mono trawler there is no way I would build as you are correct, they are a dime a dozen
But if you want or need something different, have the skills and the space, well guess what.

[sail_socal]

Originally Posted by cat man do

And what if the boat you want to cruise in doesn't exist?
And even if it did exist you probably couldn't afford or justify buying it?

Fine if you can accept and be happy with the "standard" selection of boats offered on the market
For others, "standard" is not good enough and we have to build.

That's a very accurate summary of my thinking on the issue. I've already spent 5 years designing my ideal boat, now it's time to start building!