Why Climate Change Won't Matter in 20 Years

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by jackdale

If you knew I would would post that that photo, why would you imply that the Louis St Laurent was ice breaking?

Successful trip. Not enough wind.

I never said it was breaking ice. I said the Louis st Laurent was leading the freighter. Which is the definition of escorting

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by SailOar

Just to make sure we are on the same page, would you mind defining "coral bleaching"?
Thanks

Personally, I haven't seen more than a few pieces down below that were bleached. Got this pic off the internet.

[jackdale]

Originally Posted by newhaul

I never said it was breaking ice. I said the Louis st Laurent was leading the freighter. Which is the definition of escorting

And what is your point?

[Delfin]

Originally Posted by jackdale

Nope. And I have never seen the movie.


Kenomac invokes Gore's Law

As an online climate change debate grows longer, the probability that denier arguments will descend into attacks on Al Gore approaches one.


Here's a hint. Al Gore could be short, evil and fond of child sacrifice. He could emit more CO2 snoring at night than Christopher Monckton does all year. And his movie could be even more inaccurate than the Great Global Warming Swindle. But this wouldn't change a thing. What matters is not Al Gore's character but science. And, in the case of climate change, it's awfully compelling.

Actually, since Al Gore has made quite a lot of money duping the gullible and has made himself the poster boy for the pseudo scientific scam of AGW it is quite natural for him to come up in a conversation about that topic. Especially when the scam is being defended by equally clueless and unscientific, yet wildly narcissistic warmist clowns.

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by jackdale

Nope. And I have never seen the movie.


Kenomac invokes Gore's Law

As an online climate change debate grows longer, the probability that denier arguments will descend into attacks on Al Gore approaches one.


Here's a hint. Al Gore could be short, evil and fond of child sacrifice. He could emit more CO2 snoring at night than Christopher Monckton does all year. And his movie could be even more inaccurate than the Great Global Warming Swindle. But this wouldn't change a thing. What matters is not Al Gore's character but science. And, in the case of climate change, it's awfully compelling.

Jack,

It was a cartoon. Do you have any sense of humor?

Ken

[jackdale]

Originally Posted by Delfin

Actually, since Al Gore has made quite a lot of money duping the gullible and has made himself the poster boy for the pseudo scientific scam of AGW it is quite natural for him to come up in a conversation about that topic. Especially when the scam is being defended by equally clueless and unscientific, yet wildly narcissistic warmist clowns.

AL Gore was born wealthy. He added to his wealth through the sale of his network and as a member of the board of directors of companies like Google and Apple.

And Delphin dives to the depths of Graham's hierarchy.

[jackdale]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

Jack,

It was a cartoon. Do you have any sense of humor?

Ken

I do. And you?

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

We both look at the same glass. I see the water half full on its way to being completely full, you see the glass half empty on its way to being completely empty with no more water available to fill it...

Actually, I see the the container half full, with a large hole draining it quickly, and a small tap filling it slowly. For all practical purposes, that container will end up virtually empty.

An optimist sees the glass half full.
A pessimist sees the glass half empty.
A realist sees that the glass is too large.

[Kenomac]

Speaking of water, what are you fellow Canadians drinking up there that places all of you so firmly on the same page with this Global Warming stuff?

Is it the education system? I wouldn't know since I migrated (like the birds and fishies do ) to the USA when I was two years old. I moved from a very cold Hamilton, Ontario to sunny and hot Southern, California.... and didn't drown or die due to the climate change.

Or is it the long, cold winter contributing to a vitamin D deficiency that's making you depressed?

[SailOar]

Black Carbon and Warming: It’s Worse than We Thought | Environment360/Yale.edu

A new study indicates soot, known as black carbon, plays a far greater role in global warming than previously believed and is second only to CO2 in the amount of heat it traps in the atmosphere. Reducing some forms of soot emissions — such as from diesel fuel and coal burning — could prove effective in slowing down the planet’s warming.

To get a clear sense of soot — which is known to scientists as black carbon — an international team of 31 atmospheric scientists has worked for the past four years to analyze all the data they could. This week, they published a 232-page report in the Journal of Geophysical Research. “It’s an important assessment of where we stand now,” says Veerabhadran Ramanathan of the Scripps Institution for Oceanography, an expert on atmospheric chemistry who was not involved in the study.

The big result that jumps off the page is that black carbon plays a much bigger role in global warming than many scientists previously thought. According to the new analysis, it is second only to carbon dioxide in the amount of heat it traps in the atmosphere. The new estimate of black carbon’s heat-trapping power is about twice that made by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change in 2007.

This result suggests that cutting black carbon emissions could go a long way to slowing climate change. But the authors of the new study warn that we’ll need to be careful about the sort of black carbon we choose to cut. “There’s a significant potential, but you have to be very targeted,” said co-author Sarah Doherty of the University of Washington...

If black carbon heats up the layer of the atmosphere where clouds are forming, for example, they will evaporate. They can no longer reflect sunlight back into space, and so the soot-laced clouds end up warming the atmosphere. But black carbon that hangs above low-lying stratocumulus clouds has a different effect. It stabilizes the layer of air on top of the clouds, promoting their growth. It just so happens that thick stratocumulus clouds are like shields, blocking incoming sunlight. As a result, black carbon also ends up cooling the planet...

After the scientists had taken into account all of these effects, they tallied them up to calculate how much extra energy was being stored in the
atmosphere thanks to black carbon. Climate scientists typically express that energy as watts per square meter of the Earth’s surface. The number they got — 1.1 watts — was enormous. Carbon dioxide, the biggest heat-trapper in the atmosphere, is responsible for an estimated 1.56 watts per square meter. Black carbon takes second place. “It took a while to convince ourselves it was correct,” says Doherty.

If black carbon is responsible for trapping so much heat, then reducing soot may be an effective way to slow down the planet’s warming. It’s even more attractive because black carbon washes quickly out of the atmosphere, and so reducing soot emissions would lead to a fast fall in the concentration of black carbon in the atmosphere. Carbon dioxide, by contrast, lingers for centuries in the atmosphere...

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by SailOar

Black Carbon and Warming: It’s Worse than We Thought | Environment360/Yale.edu

So " black carbon " both warms the planet and at the same time cools the planet how convienent I see at least another 4 years of grants to study that one further ( and still come up with a net 0 impact)

[SailOar]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

Personally, I haven't seen more than a few pieces down below that were bleached. Got this pic off the internet.

Yes, that's what bleached coral looks like. But what I was wondering if you knew what caused it? You said that that the sun causes the bleaching. So I was wondering why you thought the sun causes the bleaching? Do you mean like the sun fades the colors of your clothes?

[fryewe]

Originally Posted by SailOar

So I was wondering why you thought the sun causes the bleaching? Do you mean like the sun fades the colors of your clothes?

I thought the coral was bleached by ocean acidification. You know, like putting too much regular Clorox in your wash and bleaching your colored clothes.

[GordMay]

Elevated sea temperatures (climate change & El Niño) are the biggest causes of coral bleaching.

Other stress factors include:
- Ocean acidification
- Extra-bright sunlight (high solar irradiance), especially when combined with the aforementioned extra-warm seawater
- Disease
- Pollution from urban or agricultural run-off
- Changes in salinity
- Sedimentation

[Lake-Effect]

Hey I see it's been busy, with a flurry of some of our favourite classic denier jabs, followed by a forced retreat when they're shown, once again, to be empty.

Delfin's been foaming away, I see. One gem: "Of course, he is still a complete buffoon as all warmists are and completely wrong"

Phew, haven't heard such compelling oratory since about... grade 5. I think we need to create a new logical fallacy: appeal to because-I-said-so-so-there-nyaaaah!

Originally Posted by newhaul

...I noticed there was no comment to the post I did about the carbon sequestering of second growth tropical forests. I realise the paper was about 15 pages long with lots of serious math numbers but it also had a couple great pie charts that showed a near 200% sequestering of man caused carbon sequestering of the1995 to 2006 man caused emissions within the next 20 or so years. Of the member countries. Have to read it f more specifics ( not doing others homework I did my own first). It flies in the MMGW warmists face.

Mr_f gave you the long and detailed answer; I'll just give you the short one. Carbon is sequestered only for as long as the wood from those trees remains intact and is never burned and never rots away. If it goes into landfill, it's only sequestered again for as long as it doesn't rot and get released as methane. So what are you proposing - cutting all that wood and filling old mines with it?

But there is a seed of promise in this: combined with a rigorous reuse/recycling program that prevents the dumping and burning of all wood, such trees could be a valuable part of the mitigation effort... but we're so far from stopping deforestation, let alone implementing serious REforestation and a global wood-recycling program, that these trees are not going to provide such a valuable service yet. Work to do, kids...

So many of the denier factlets, especially quotes, are twisted, distorted or plain wrong. The AlGore one being the most recent usage. Speaking of homework, I've been researching a quote that was thrown about recently, which also proved to be yet another example of the denier distortion field at work. I will present it shortly; other things to do today.