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Old 13-01-2016, 13:56   #1651
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Re: Why Climate Change Won't Matter in 20 Years

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Originally Posted by jackdale View Post
James Hansen and some his colleagues have come out in support of nuclear energy.

http://dotearth.blogs.nytimes.com/20...ar-power/?_r=0
Good article, highly recommended Reefmagnet reading!

I'm not personally that concerned about AGW as these guys are, but I am concerned about continuing to pump pollutants into the environment. So for somewhat different reasons, we both agree that nuclear is a less bad option than what we are doing now. While I agree that we should continue to work on other alternative sources of energy, we need to be realistic that nothing on the horizon except nuclear has the potential to provide for our growing worldwide energy needs and these guys discuss that and more and possibly, even though they are saying almost exactly what I've been posting over the last hour or so, maybe Reefmagnet and other AGW devotees will be more inclined to listen to them. Actually, I think that a nuclear resurgence is inevitable because more and more people will realize that we have no other choice, at least for the forseeable future.
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Old 13-01-2016, 13:59   #1652
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Re: Why Climate Change Won't Matter in 20 Years

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I have no issues with their data. I have issues with some of the conclusions they draw.

Have you noticed that I also do not reject Curry out of hand.
Except it doesn't seem only to be the conclusions skeptics like Christy & Spencer reach from the raw data that you find fault with. It's pretty obvious you also seem to believe their religious beliefs have an influence on those conclusions. As I said, and given the level of scientific uncertainty with much of this, exploring individual actor's biases is certainly fair game. But once no causal connection can be established, it becomes overly speculative and just an all too easy way to discredit someone's person rather than their work product. Given the level of personal disdain some of the establishment scientists (and Democratic politicians) appear to have for Christy & Spencer, you'd think any sort of religious bias would have been exposed long ago.

I didn't read anything about Curry's religious affiliations. Does she have any that might be relevant?
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Old 13-01-2016, 14:01   #1653
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Re: Why Climate Change Won't Matter in 20 Years

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That is obvious. Now what is that reason?
,
Australia's Uranium | Uranium Mining in Australia

This whole site seems to be worth exploring. It clearly has a bias.
The reason, in a nutshell, is nuclear power is deemed too hazardous and too expensive. Too much risk vs reward.

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Old 13-01-2016, 14:06   #1654
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Re: Why Climate Change Won't Matter in 20 Years

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The reason, in a nutshell, is nuclear power is deemed too hazardous and too expensive. Too much risk vs reward.

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Even though the evidence suggests otherwise.
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Old 13-01-2016, 14:09   #1655
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Re: Why Climate Change Won't Matter in 20 Years

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Junior high assistant principal - the disciplinarian.
Yup, just had this funny, sorta instinctual feeling . . . . As I recall, the principal eventually threw up his hands (after calling my father in), but then the ass't principal took over and actually tried to do something about it. One credible threat of bodily harm that I had yet to hear worked wonders.
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Old 13-01-2016, 14:14   #1656
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Re: Why Climate Change Won't Matter in 20 Years

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Good article, highly recommended Reefmagnet reading!

I'm not personally that concerned about AGW as these guys are, but I am concerned about continuing to pump pollutants into the environment. So for somewhat different reasons, we both agree that nuclear is a less bad option than what we are doing now. While I agree that we should continue to work on other alternative sources of energy, we need to be realistic that nothing on the horizon except nuclear has the potential to provide for our growing worldwide energy needs and these guys discuss that and more and possibly, even though they are saying almost exactly what I've been posting over the last hour or so, maybe Reefmagnet and other AGW devotees will be more inclined to listen to them. Actually, I think that a nuclear resurgence is inevitable because more and more people will realize that we have no other choice, at least for the forseeable future.
James Hansen is driven by his AGW agenda. He has attracted raised eyebrows from even some of his colleagues in recent times as a result of some of his published forecasts.

The real nuclear experts actually predicts a slowdown in nuclear energy growth in the coming decades which is diametrically opposed to your prediction.

http://www.world-nuclear-news.org/NP...h-0809157.html
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Old 13-01-2016, 14:15   #1657
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Re: Why Climate Change Won't Matter in 20 Years

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The reason, in a nutshell, is nuclear power is deemed too hazardous and too expensive. Too much risk vs reward.

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Or maybe they weren't overly concerned about the pollution caused by burning coal and oil instead so just kept doing it even when better options became available. But these decisions are usually made largely by politicians and I've found that it's a rare politician who puts logic and science ahead of what he thinks will get him reelected and what the lobbyists paying for his campaign want him to think. Call me cynical but here in the US that's how I see it and I suspect it's not much different down under.
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Old 13-01-2016, 14:18   #1658
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Re: Why Climate Change Won't Matter in 20 Years

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Even though the evidence suggests otherwise.
What evidence would that be?

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Old 13-01-2016, 14:20   #1659
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Re: Why Climate Change Won't Matter in 20 Years

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Or maybe they weren't overly concerned about the pollution caused by burning coal and oil instead so just kept doing it even when better options became available. But these decisions are usually made largely by politicians and I've found that it's a rare politician who puts logic and science ahead of what he thinks will get him reelected and what the lobbyists paying for his campaign want him to think. Call me cynical but here in the US that's how I see it and I suspect it's not much different down under.
Yep, I'd vote for a pollie that wanted to put a nuke generation plant and/or waste dump behind my house.

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Old 13-01-2016, 14:20   #1660
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Re: Why Climate Change Won't Matter in 20 Years

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James Hansen is driven by his AGW agenda. He has attracted raised eyebrows from even some of his colleagues in recent times as a result of some of his published forecasts.

The real nuclear experts actually predicts a slowdown in nuclear energy growth in the coming decades which is diametrically opposed to your prediction.

IAEA sees slow but sure nuclear growth
Well if they are right and we don't expand utilization of nuclear technology to generate energy, and the demand for energy grows as much as is predicted, there's going to be a LOT more coal burning and oil burning going on because there are no other options that will supply the ever increasing worldwide demand for energy. I'm not an AGW worrywart but that seems sort of counterproductive and bad for our environment in lots of ways. But I guess that's what happens when you have politicians making energy policy decisions mostly based on getting themselves reelected.
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Old 13-01-2016, 14:22   #1661
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Re: Why Climate Change Won't Matter in 20 Years

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James Hansen is driven by his AGW agenda. He has attracted raised eyebrows from even some of his colleagues in recent times as a result of some of his published forecasts.
Yeah like this one from 1981.



His forecast was low.

BTW - the New York flooding one was predicated on a doubling of CO2.

James Hansen made his statement in response to a question by Bob Reiss, a journalist and author, in 1988. He did not predict that the West Side Highway would be underwater in 20 years.

Bob Reiss reports the conversation as follows:

"When I interviewed James Hansen I asked him to speculate on what the view outside his office window could look like in 40 years with doubled CO2. I'd been trying to think of a way to discuss the greenhouse effect in a way that would make sense to average readers. I wasn't asking for hard scientific studies. It wasn't an academic interview. It was a discussion with a kind and thoughtful man who answered the question. You can find the description in two of my books, most recently The Coming Storm."
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Old 13-01-2016, 14:23   #1662
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Re: Why Climate Change Won't Matter in 20 Years

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Yep, I'd vote for a pollie that wanted to put a nuke generation plant and/or waste dump behind my house.

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Hey, I KNEW we could eventually find agreement on something because I would vote for that same pol, and I might even make a campaign donation to him if he said he'd put a nuke generation plant ON your house!
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Old 13-01-2016, 14:29   #1663
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Re: Why Climate Change Won't Matter in 20 Years

Some more homework

Good article on the feasibility of small scale renewable energy and other solutions.

Quote:
A balanced energy R&D portfolio proposed by the authors would allocate the bulk of resources to proven technologies like hydro, wind, solar photovoltaics, and nuclear; devote 20 percent of funds to related technologies like thin-film solar PV and next-generation nuclear fission reactors; and keep a pot of money for “crazy” ideas like cheap fusion.
What It Would Really Take to Reverse Climate Change - IEEE Spectrum

It is highly germane to the OP.
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Old 13-01-2016, 14:34   #1664
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Re: Why Climate Change Won't Matter in 20 Years

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Well if they are right and we don't expand utilization of nuclear technology to generate energy, and the demand for energy grows as much as is predicted, there's going to be a LOT more coal burning and oil burning going on because there are no other options that will supply the ever increasing worldwide demand for energy. I'm not an AGW worrywart but that seems sort of counterproductive and bad for our environment in lots of ways. But I guess that's what happens when you have politicians making energy policy decisions mostly based on getting themselves reelected.
It might surprise you that I think nuclear energy has it's use. In fact, I'd have no major issues with having a handful in my country (as long as it's not in my backyard, of course). However, as we live in neither a perfect or unicorns and rainbows world, the very real threats of radioactive materials falling into the wrong hands, along with terrorism related issues in general when it comes to nuke plants as targets all start to detract from the appeal.

Now to move onto pollutants. Sulphur dioxide washes out of the atmosphere quickly; C02 is either consumed by vegetation or absorbed into the ocean; methane eventually escapes to space. All happens in a relatively insignificant amount of time compared to the one quarter of a million years radioactive waste remains not only a pollutant, but an extremely toxic one at that.

There's a reason why coal ash doesn't need to be encased in bomb proof containers.

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Old 13-01-2016, 14:40   #1665
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Re: Why Climate Change Won't Matter in 20 Years

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C02 is either consumed by vegetation or absorbed into the ocean;

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The problem is that the CO2 balance that existed for 100 of thousands of years has been disrupted. The burning of carbon that was sequestered over millions of years has overwhelmed the natural sinks

The Carbon Cycle: Sources and Sinks
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