West Marine changing strategies: likely de-emphasising sailing related support

[phantomracer]

Originally Posted by Randyonr3

Not defending WM but in defence of the "local" business in your area, when you say "If I have to order it, I'll buy it from Defender every time."
You deserve for your local store to close down on you with an attitude like that, whoever they are.. someday you'll go knocking on the store open on Sunday only to find a "close due to lack of support" sign posted on their front door.

sooooooooo we have to support a business that is more expensive, less convenient..

If WM wants to go full bore mail order like they used to be years ago.. thats fine..they are 90% there now. If you want a t-shirt, you are golden. You want just about anything else that has to be shipped.. why order from WM.. cut out the middleman. save money and get your product faster from just about any other retailer..and often save sales tax over buying at WM.

Its not personal, its business. Other businesses are more hungry and streamlining the process of getting you the goods, faster and less expensive, all the power to them. ship to store special orders take way too long, even at their fastest. The 70's called..they want their bell bottoms back!

WM has made it clear they are going into the boating lifestyle market, instead of boating/sailing..hope it works for them.

[savoir]

Originally Posted by jtsailjt

If you buy in a WM store, you'll have to pay sales tax in most states, but if you order from Defender and shipped to a location outside CT, you will not be charged sales tax. Depending on the item, the sales tax savings can pay for shipping so Defender still maintains a price advantage on most items. Also, since WM doesn't carry many items in stock, you'll probably have to wait just as long and then spend money for gas, etc. to drive to the WM store to pick it up once it arrives, which also adds to your total cost, depending on just how close to your home your "local" WM store is located.

Fair comment. When I go to WM it is the one in Newport. Three times last summer they did not have what I wanted. The Newport store is pretty big although not as big as the one in SD. The items were pretty mundane - a block, some plastic hose, a zinc.

You have to worry about a chandlery which devotes to blocks 10% of the space that it devotes to t shirts.

[savoir]

Originally Posted by RainDog

Because Defender charges shipping. After you figure in the cost of shipping, many of the items you listed are cheaper at West if bought in store.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

I'm with jtsailjt on this one. Most times the freight that you pay is cancelled out by the tax that you don't pay making it all a non issue.

If anyone is in the area, Defender do have a retail outlet in northern CT about 10 mins off 95.

[Randyonr3]

what is said about sailboat HWD could be the case in many areas,
And something I heard years ago in parrell to this..............
The story was that two guys decided to build marinas, one building for sailboats and one for power boats.. when the two had gotton together, they were asked and the owner of the sailboat marina stated he was building for the people owning sailboats, had somewhere to park their boats, where the owner of the powerboat marina said, screw the boats, as he was interested in money, and sailboat owners dont spend any.
He built a marina for the powerboats, withg gas pumps and a bar.. Saying powerboaters spend money on fuel and drinks..................................

So it happened and anyone in the california delta will know these marinas, one built for sailboats, Brunos Island, now in dis-aray, and owned by the bank,
And the other being Korths Pirates Lair, built for powerboats and has expanded to two other marinas owned by the same family, expanding from the origional, Willow Berm, and Oxbow Marinas, and all have covered slips, and gas pumps, and cater to the power boaters..........
For the most part, sailboaters are cheep, compared to their counterpart, the powerboater....................................... ....

Even in the business I owned doing marine canvas, about 90 percent of my work went to powerboaters and if anyone bitched about pricing, it was uasally a sailboater.. so why would a business support a group of people that dont spend ..
money compaired to powerboaters......................

I work at a "Flag Ship WM" and have seen a sailboater bitch about the price of a shackle when paying but the guy behind him has 2 carts full of product for his powerboat and pays without question.............

You are in business to make money, not friends, do the math...........

[CaptTom]

Disregarding the time and gas to and from the store, and the tax difference, what I'm hearing is that WM is often CLOSE to the best price you can get on line.

Sometimes above, sometimes below. But often close.

But the real point, which I think we're all in agreement on, is that they're hurting themselves by devoting so much space to high-margin "fashion" items, while doing away with the low-margin necessities that bring people in.

Many of us think it's short-sighted of WM corporate management to make this decision.

Boaters will do what consumers always do; vote with our wallets. If WM closes because of this, so be it.

If it turns out we're wrong, and WM becomes some sort of fashion icon among Millennials, increasing sales by getting rid of boating "stuff", more power to them.

I know which outcome I'd bet on.

[phantomracer]

Originally Posted by CaptTom

Disregarding the time and gas to and from the store, and the tax difference, what I'm hearing is that WM is often CLOSE to the best price you can get on line.

Sometimes above, sometimes below. But often close.

But the real point, which I think we're all in agreement on, is that they're hurting themselves by devoting so much space to high-margin "fashion" items, while doing away with the low-margin necessities that bring people in.

Many of us think it's short-sighted of WM corporate management to make this decision.

Boaters will do what consumers always do; vote with our wallets. If WM closes because of this, so be it.

If it turns out we're wrong, and WM becomes some sort of fashion icon among Millennials, increasing sales by getting rid of boating "stuff", more power to them.

I know which outcome I'd bet on.

Yes. I just can't wrap my head around, buying something out of stock at WM, and it taking longer to come in, and requiring 2 trips to the store...then paying more for that?

I don't see this as a sail or power boat thing..

If I were a power boater and was installing new electronics and was just about to wrap up and just needed one NMEA2000 cable .. bop into WM to get it.. only to be told they dont have it..be 2+ days and $10 more than anyone else in the world.. its not a power vs sail issue. Its service in addition to price and store policies

This was OK before..have special ordered hundreds of items over the last quarter century from WM...but they always matched prices.. now they don't..so what is the incentive to buy there? If I had to special order something, and it was the same price as defender, et al, I would normally do it. Now I don't.

Its more than just price, its service, which has tanked along with their policies and in-store inventory of actual boating gear!

[Wrong]

Originally Posted by CaptTom

Disregarding the time and gas to and from the store, and the tax difference, what I'm hearing is that WM is often CLOSE to the best price you can get on line.

Sometimes above, sometimes below. But often close.

But the real point, which I think we're all in agreement on, is that they're hurting themselves by devoting so much space to high-margin "fashion" items, while doing away with the low-margin necessities that bring people in.

Many of us think it's short-sighted of WM corporate management to make this decision.

Boaters will do what consumers always do; vote with our wallets. If WM closes because of this, so be it.

If it turns out we're wrong, and WM becomes some sort of fashion icon among Millennials, increasing sales by getting rid of boating "stuff", more power to them.

I know which outcome I'd bet on.

I need only a small quantity of phosphoric acid cleaner but cost wise there's no advantage in buying less than a quart. Have used Ospho in the past that goes a looooong way with it's water like consistency. Last thing I need on my boat is another quart of something I'll need only once in several years, and then only a small amount. So, I've been shopping around. The nearest Ace hardware Store sells Ospho in the quart size for $10. West Marine in Marin City $21.99 for the same product, same size. OSPHO Rust Converter/Metal Primer | West Marine Only an idiot would buy from West Marine - and their prices are similarly high across their whole line. Never looked at their clothing, but so-called 'lifestyle' stuff is overpriced everywhere because there are oodles of deep pockets idiots who don't even think about cost.

[Wrong]

Originally Posted by Wrong

I need only a small quantity of phosphoric acid cleaner but cost wise there's no advantage in buying less than a quart. Have used Ospho in the past that goes a looooong way with it's water like consistency. Last thing I need on my boat is another quart of something I'll need only once in several years, and then only a small amount. So, I've been shopping around. The nearest Ace hardware Store sells Ospho in the quart size for $10. West Marine in Marin City $21.99 for the same product, same size. OSPHO Rust Converter/Metal Primer | West Marine Only an idiot would buy from West Marine - and their prices are similarly high across their whole line. Never looked at their clothing, but so-called 'lifestyle' stuff is overpriced everywhere because there are oodles of deep pockets idiots who don't even think about cost.

Dropped into a Mill Valley paint store to check availability and price of Ospho. They have Jasco Prep & Primer for $5.99/qt. So, WM lost a sale not only on the phosphotizer but a small brass brush too. My only option at WM two small stainless bristle brushes @ $6.99. Bought a real nice high quality brass bristled brush for$2.99 at the paint store. Total out of pocket $9.74. Less than half what WM was demanding for Ospho alone, which is the same product sold by Jasco and included the brush. Both are 'phosphotizers'.

[Nicholson58]

Originally Posted by RainDog

Because Defender charges shipping. After you figure in the cost of shipping, many of the items you listed are cheaper at West if bought in store.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

I don't mean to be a quibbling grammarian, however, there is nothing "cheap or cheaper" about any of the boat jewelry we buy. Cheap infers lack of quality as well as a relatively low cost. Expensive, less expensive, obscene or ludicrously expensive are far more meaningful.

I too have found We$t Marine consistently higher priced for everything but end of season or clearance items. Check out top sides or Perfection paint sometime. The delta is nearly 2X including shipping.

BTW, the item that really irks me at We$t is when they put out the flares or other pyrotechnics & stack last year's left-overs in front of new stock at the same price with one year less on the expiration. Always read these packages.

[S/V Illusion]

Originally Posted by Nicholson58

I don't mean to be a quibbling grammarian, however, there is nothing "cheap or cheaper" about any of the boat jewelry we buy. Cheap infers lack of quality as well as a relatively low cost.

Good that you don't mean to be...

"Infer" is what I do with what you "imply".

[Randyonr3]

Originally Posted by Wrong

Dropped into a Mill Valley paint store to check availability and price of Ospho. They have Jasco Prep & Primer for $5.99/qt. So, WM lost a sale not only on the phosphotizer but a small brass brush too. My only option at WM two small stainless bristle brushes @ $6.99. Bought a real nice high quality brass bristled brush for$2.99 at the paint store. Total out of pocket $9.74. Less than half what WM was demanding for Ospho alone, which is the same product sold by Jasco and included the brush. Both are 'phosphotizers'.

with all the bitching you are doing about WM, I find it very odd that you would continue to stop in there to compare prices when you know they will be higher, as you have said..
an easy way to beat the high retail price is to create a small business and get a port supply account, and you'll find that many products as the bottom paint are as much off as 50% off the retail..
Or do as many, including myself, when the refit is due, go to work part time and recieve as much as 15% over cost on the products, and just by chance, the Marin store is looking for people..
We'll save over 10k on upgrades we're doing this summer.......

[RainDog]

I buy plenty of stuff online, and always price shop, but I sure as hell miss being near a West Marine flagship.

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[Sailor g]

Our WM (Marina del Rey or San Diego, CA) has most of the items we need in the store. The things we have to order come in quick enough for us. They will never be able to compete with an online place without the overhead of a brick and mortar store. The people who work there tend to be sailors/cruisers so they know about the products which is a big help.

It is great to be able to look at the item and compare things-something I can't do online. Then if there is a problem, I would have to go to a Post Office and wait forever in line here-if I could even return the item.

[phantomracer]

Originally Posted by Sailor g

Our WM (Marina del Rey or San Diego, CA) has most of the items we need in the store. The things we have to order come in quick enough for us. They will never be able to compete with an online place without the overhead of a brick and mortar store. The people who work there tend to be sailors/cruisers so they know about the products which is a big help.

It is great to be able to look at the item and compare things-something I can't do online. Then if there is a problem, I would have to go to a Post Office and wait forever in line here-if I could even return the item.

the problem is they are becoming (or are) mostly a mail order place, as so many run of the mill items have to be ordered lately..so you wait longer and and pay more.

I agree, I dont mind paying a premium to buy it in the store.. but in stock items are becoming harder to get, as more floor real estate is devoted to clothing. I am not going to pay a premium for something I can get faster and less expensive

returning items now-a-days is pretty easy. print the postage at home and hand to your carrier, or for ups, pre-print the labels and drop it off at a ups store or Staples or hand it to a driver when he drops off at your home/business (or countless drop off locations)

I know the people at my local WM.. been shopping there forever..great people..just never have anything i need, especially if I need 2 of anything.

[Red Sky]

Originally Posted by hpeer

It would be a loss for us. There are 2 WM's we frequent, I've often wondered at the proximity.

They are in Delaware, no sales tax, and if I order from them I get it without paying for shipping.

It is a real convince and often actually cheaper.

Remember when LL Bean sold real hunting and fishing stuff?

Abercrombie and Fitch?

Or Eddie Bauer?