Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 25-06-2014, 05:54   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: NC USA
Boat: Bingham custom cutter rigged 35 loa 28 lod
Posts: 40
Send a message via Skype™ to Dean Samuels
Owner refuses to pay crew, need advice

Just stepped off a delivery in NC the owner/cap was highly intoxicated and screaming up and down the docks. He has refused to pay me for the time I put in. He tried to sabotage my ride to Norfolk where I could get a bus home etc... I spoke to the previous crew and they had a similar experience but it became physical. What recourse do I have? He owes me over $2000.

Sent from my C5215 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app
__________________

__________________
Dean Samuels is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-06-2014, 06:01   #2
Sponsoring Vendor
 
Tellie's Avatar

Community Sponsor

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Hollywood, Fl.
Boat: FP Athena 38' Poerava
Posts: 3,046
Re: Owner refuses to pay crew, need advice

What was your agreement from the start?
Tellie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-06-2014, 06:02   #3
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Abaco, Bahamas/ Western NC
Boat: Nothing large at the moment
Posts: 820
Re: Owner refuses to pay crew, need advice

Jones Act Time! Get in touch with an Admiralty Lawyer, it is easy to file a claim against the boat, sounds like he needs the US Marshals to tell him his boat has been siezed and he has 15 minutes to get off.
__________________
Tingum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-06-2014, 06:11   #4
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: NC USA
Boat: Bingham custom cutter rigged 35 loa 28 lod
Posts: 40
Send a message via Skype™ to Dean Samuels
Re: Owner refuses to pay crew, need advice

The agreement was that I would be paid a specific amount per day, as well as air fair home. He told the people with the boat that took me to Norfolk that I had swatstika tattoos and I can't be trusted... I'm Jewish lol. I Dont have those tattoos! He was trying to strand me 25 miles from the nearest town.

Sent from my C5215 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app
__________________
Dean Samuels is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-06-2014, 06:24   #5
Freelance Delivery Skipper..
 
boatman61's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: UK/Portugal
Posts: 20,210
Images: 2
Send a message via Skype™ to boatman61
pirate Re: Owner refuses to pay crew, need advice

Have you anything in writing to back your claim.. e-mails, sms messages or.. even better.. a signed agreement on paper..
I had this happen when I got a boat to OZ.. ended up getting a lawyer and taking legal action.
Ended up with some change after covering expenses/crew flights etc.. but at least I stayed in the black.. most owners are great folk but every now and then one comes across an *******..
Good luck..
__________________


Born To Be Wild
boatman61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-06-2014, 06:38   #6
Registered User
 
tomfl's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Florida
Boat: Seawind 1000xl
Posts: 1,959
Images: 10
Re: Owner refuses to pay crew, need advice

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dean Samuels View Post
SNIP

What recourse do I have? He owes me over $2000.
Problem is that not many lawyers will take a case if the damages are at the $US2,000 level. If the lawyer's fee is more than the damages courts often view the damages as de minimus.

Most small claims courts (where you don't need a lawyer and judges often don't like lawyers there) have an upper limit of $US3,000 or even more. But the problem with small claims courts is there is really no enforcement if you win the case.

I am not even sure what jurisdiction you could seek relief in. If the trip started out side of NC and the boat is ever moved out of NC it would make enforcement of any judgement a problem.

I am not trying to minimize your problem and I know two thousand dollars is a chunk of change to many folks. But the courts view it as small peanuts.
__________________
tomfl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-06-2014, 06:49   #7
Registered User
 
Delancey's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Miami, FL
Boat: sunk by irma
Posts: 3,462
Re: Owner refuses to pay crew, need advice

Just throwing it out there - any chance you can wait for the guy to sober up and then try and reason with him?

Obviously there were some personality conflicts, and maybe the guy is just a total dick who envisioned creating some conflict with you to use as an excuse later to not pay. However, most non-psychopaths don't wake up in the morning and decide to go out in the world and be evil.

He knows he agreed to pay you and that you did the trip.

Whatever the nature of the conflict, I would like to think if you allowed the needed time for things to cool off and approached him in a level-headed manner, that perhaps you could achieve a more favorable resolution. Even if you were only able to get partial payment, it would be better than nothing.

But who knows, perhaps things are too far gone at this point.
__________________
Delancey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-06-2014, 06:52   #8
Marine Service Provider

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: St Augustine, FL
Boat: Woods Vardo 34 Cat
Posts: 2,827
Re: Owner refuses to pay crew, need advice

You screwed, sorry to hear it. In the US you'll never collect on that small an amount. I know boat brokers that get screwed out of 10k and don't fight it as they know it will cost too much.

Been working boats for nearly 30 years. Didn't get paid once. Be more careful next time.
__________________
Check out my MoJo: Facebook.com/mojomarine1
Boatguy30 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-06-2014, 07:03   #9
Registered User
 
ShaktisBoy's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: West Palm Beach Florida
Boat: 07 Leopard 40 / 93 Hunter 30T
Posts: 344
Re: Owner refuses to pay crew, need advice

File in small claims court. Win judgement , file lien on the vessel, accrue interest send bill to owner every week. Do not let him walk away regardless of the lousy advice to walk away. The process is time consuming and frustrating but just on principal you should hold his feet to the fire. If we all did this every time maybe owners would stop and think before they tried to screw anyone out of what is due. Here is a link. It is not in the same county or state
but it pretty much works the same everywhere in the us. By the way you have 10 years to collect and interest accrues the whole time so file now.

http://www.riverside.courts.ca.gov/s...llectjdgmt.pdf
__________________
ShaktisBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-06-2014, 07:10   #10
Freelance Delivery Skipper..
 
boatman61's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: UK/Portugal
Posts: 20,210
Images: 2
Send a message via Skype™ to boatman61
pirate Re: Owner refuses to pay crew, need advice

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShaktisBoy View Post
File in small claims court. Win judgement , file lien on the vessel, accrue interest send bill to owner every week. Do not let him walk away regardless of the lousy advice to walk away. The process is time consuming and frustrating but just on principal you should hold his feet to the fire. If we all did this every time maybe owners would stop and think before they tried to screw anyone out of what is due. Here is a link. It is not in the same county or state
but it pretty much works the same everywhere in the us. By the way you have 10 years to collect and interest accrues the whole time so file now.

http://www.riverside.courts.ca.gov/s...llectjdgmt.pdf
+A1... the more of us make a stand the better.. he's also likely pulled this stunt before.. nail him..

Should add.. a few here said walk away in my case.. glad I heeded those who said I should fight.
__________________


Born To Be Wild
boatman61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-06-2014, 07:20   #11
Registered User
 
BigBoater917's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2013
Boat: 1973 Jacobsen 110'
Posts: 112
Re: Owner refuses to pay crew, need advice

Have the US Marshalls do it. It's very effective. You will need either the contract between you guys or a court judgement in your favor.
__________________
20 years and too many miles to count under the stern.
BigBoater917 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-06-2014, 07:26   #12
Registered User
 
ShaktisBoy's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: West Palm Beach Florida
Boat: 07 Leopard 40 / 93 Hunter 30T
Posts: 344
Re: Owner refuses to pay crew, need advice

If you win you judgement in small claims you can have the vessel seized and sold if the owner doesn't pay you.

" he cant use it or even move it" How is that for justice?

http://boatinglaw.com/maritimearticl...timeliens.html
__________________
ShaktisBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-06-2014, 07:27   #13
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Full time cruisers
Boat: Krogen 42
Posts: 252
Re: Owner refuses to pay crew, need advice

So what's the name of the boat and skipper? You need to protect the next unfortunate crew.
__________________
meridian28 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-06-2014, 07:27   #14
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 50
Re: Owner refuses to pay crew, need advice

You say that he has done this to other crew in the past. If you join with them to sue the owner you have three advantages. You can split the legal fees with other claimants, you can increase the amount of the suit making it more attractive for a lawyer to take the case, and even without a written contract, you have much better chance of winning since your fellow claimant(s) can testify that he has done this before. Under the Uniform Commercial Code, oral contracts are enforceable.

Do us all a favor and pursue this vigorously; don't be too proud to ask Legal Aid for help. Also, talking to the police is an option, I believe that failing to pay wages is a crime in many states. Additionally he may have violated some tax laws by failing to report employer taxes.

Please don't just roll over and say, "Well, I guess I just got screwed."

Good luck to you.
__________________
dougdaniel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-06-2014, 07:50   #15
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: NC USA
Boat: Bingham custom cutter rigged 35 loa 28 lod
Posts: 40
Send a message via Skype™ to Dean Samuels
Re: Owner refuses to pay crew, need advice

His name is Lars Lindquist. The boat is a Hardin 45 from Miami. Its named joie de vie III.

Sent from my C5215 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app
__________________

__________________
Dean Samuels is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
crew, fuses

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Womanship - Worldwide Sailing Company - Refuses To Refund Girl Scout Money moorephun Our Community 13 09-09-2012 05:40
Cost-Sharing Crew ? What Should You Pay ? Dondon462 Commercial Posts 23 30-04-2012 07:11
To Pay or Not to Pay ... Crew brishear Our Community 56 04-03-2012 19:20
How Much Did You Pay, or Are Willing to Pay, for Your Cruising Vessel ? sailorboy1 Dollars & Cents 44 13-04-2010 07:48
Crew Available: East Med to West Indies - Willing to Pay SeaCow Crew Archives 8 25-11-2009 14:02



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:13.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.