Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 16-07-2008, 18:44   #46
Moderator Emeritus
 
Ex-Calif's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2007
Location: Singapore
Boat: Maxi 77 - Relax Lah!
Posts: 11,514
Images: 4
pirate

And so with the simple turn of a phrase we have yet another....piracy thread - LOL

@Sandy D - Oh, sure. That's just your opinion - Ha, ha, ha
__________________

__________________
Relax Lah! is For Sale <--- Click
Click--> Custom CF Google Search or CF Rules
You're gonna need a bigger boat... - Martin Brody
Ex-Calif is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-07-2008, 19:08   #47
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2008
Boat: Designing a global explorer (full keel & steel)
Posts: 353
I was thinking, in order to assist the “psychologists” on this thread (with their over analysing), perhaps it would be most helpful for some people to post here their concerns on piracy
__________________

__________________
exfishnz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-07-2008, 19:47   #48
Eternal Member
 
Chief Engineer's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: North of Baltimore
Boat: Ericson 27 & 18' Herrmann Catboat
Posts: 3,798
I was aboard a yacht, on which the owner had an armory, .38, 357, .44. 45. 2 stainless shotguns and 2 mini-14s.....and boxes and boxes of ammo...and flare guns We never got to shoot them.....we just had to lug the locker off and on off and on off and on very time we got to another port.

It was a Royal PITA and I'm not talking bread here.
__________________
Chief Engineer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-07-2008, 20:49   #49
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2008
Boat: Designing a global explorer (full keel & steel)
Posts: 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chief Engineer View Post
We never got to shoot them.....we just had to lug the locker off and on off and on off and on very time we got to another port.

It was a Royal PITA and I'm not talking bread here.
Maybe so, but I'm a strong believer in "Murphy's Law", if you don't prepare for something then it'll bite ya in the butt It might be the fact that you guy's had those "tools" that the baddies kept away
__________________
exfishnz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-07-2008, 23:20   #50
Moderator Emeritus
 
GordMay's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario - 48-29N x 89-20W
Boat: (Cruiser Living On Dirt)
Posts: 31,582
Images: 240
Cooper started this thread, “contemplating the nature of the discussions that happen here”; and noting that “It seems that the most controversial situations amount from "opinions" as opposed to "when this happened to me”; and that he has “found very few actual, first hand accounts posted here”.

I would be pleased to hear from anyone who feels (er, thinks) they have something insightful or useful to add to the discussion.

This is not a discussion about personal or National security, guns, or pirates.
__________________
Gord May
"If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?"



GordMay is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 16-07-2008, 23:25   #51
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2008
Boat: Designing a global explorer (full keel & steel)
Posts: 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by GordMay View Post
This is not a discussion about personal or National security, guns, or pirates.
hmmm... I see. Sorry for any confusion there Gord. After all, you did discuss piracy in your post here "Opinons" is interesting, personal experience is valuable.
__________________
exfishnz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-07-2008, 23:48   #52
Moderator Emeritus
 
GordMay's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario - 48-29N x 89-20W
Boat: (Cruiser Living On Dirt)
Posts: 31,582
Images: 240
Quote:
Originally Posted by exfishnz View Post
hmmm... I see. Sorry for any confusion there Gord. After all, you did discuss piracy in your post here "Opinons" is interesting, personal experience is valuable.

Sorry for contributing to the confusion.
My submission was intended to (over) analyze general thinking skills, and forming opinions; only utilizing the specific subject of piracy as an example.
My bad.
__________________
Gord May
"If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?"



GordMay is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 17-07-2008, 00:00   #53
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2008
Boat: Designing a global explorer (full keel & steel)
Posts: 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by GordMay View Post
Sorry for contributing to the confusion.
My submission was intended to (over) analyze general thinking skills, and forming opinions; only utilizing the specific subject of piracy as an example.
My bad.
Not at all Sir. There are also others (before that post) that also touched on “piracy” etc. I was also getting a little bit confused with the asking of “opinions” (re: why subjects of firearms & piracy) & I was wondering whether or not Mr Cooper was becoming a bit of a “psychologist” Therefore, my apologies also to him for causing any confusion


Reason for edit: My grammar was confusing 
Name:   wacko.gif
Views: 143
Size:  523 Bytes
__________________
exfishnz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-07-2008, 05:09   #54
cruiser

Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,525
Quote:
Originally Posted by exfishnz View Post
Not at all Sir. There are also others (before that post) that also touched on “piracy” etc. I was also getting a little bit confused with the asking of “opinions” (re: why subjects of firearms & piracy) & I was wondering whether or not Mr Cooper was becoming a bit of a “psychologist” Therefore, my apologies also to him for causing any confusion


Reason for edit: My grammar was confusing Attachment 4366

My personal opinion on piracy is that we should all just whatever software we want and just keep quiet about it!
__________________
ssullivan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-07-2008, 00:45   #55
Kai Nui
Guest

Posts: n/a
Quote:
My bad.
Gord, did those words really come out of your mouth?!?!?

As I see it, the question here is a two part question.
1) Are the contributors her a bunch of arm chair sailors toting theory read in books?
2) Is this knowledge valuable?
Answer to number one. I believe the most prolific contributors here are speaking from real world experience. There are stories that can not be found in books, and advise that goes well beyond basic theory.
Answer to number two. It takes many skills to go cruising. Many who have never even owned a boat have experience that benefits us a cruisers. I know of many mechanics that can keep an engine running long past it's final days, but these same mechanics would never even consider getting their feet wet. I also know several racers that can feel sail trim, and can make any boat go fast, but these same sailors have never ventured farther away from port than the local beer can race takes them.
So, yes. All accurate information is valuable. Regardless of the source.
__________________
  Reply With Quote
Old 18-07-2008, 07:08   #56
Obsfucator, Second Class
 
dacust's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Southeast USA.
Boat: 1982 Sea Ray SRV360
Posts: 1,743
Quote:
Originally Posted by sandy daugherty View Post
A PATENT ON PEDANTRY (save this for bedtime reading, its guaranteed to get you an early night's rest)

...

SO: if we are trying to use other people's opinions to help us make a decision (and not just provoke a debate for entertainment purposes) we have a few tools. The most secure responder is the least likely to pad an observation to defend his opinion. His reply is non-confrontational, unemotional, and stated like a contribution rather than thrust like a weapon. He is able to laugh at himself, and will readily admit to error. If, on the other hand, he is always confrontational, he may be throwing down the gauntlet, to fight for a better opinion of his opinion! Even his own experiences to the contrary will not turn him from the battle. The issue may be of little personal interest, but he has gathered a few facts like stones and arrows, just for a fight. There is an obvious chip on his shoulder. He will beat a dead horse until the last of his audience wanders away.

A recent buzz word has relevance; someone who has 'issues' is easy to spot. Beware someone who constantly cites his authority. He clearly needs to believe his opinion is important. Don't let someone's personality get in the way. Since absolutely no one has access to absolute truth, our humanity colors our experience. Recognize the direction of someone's bias and correct accordingly. Their personality is a clue about how to adjust.

...
OK, it was long, but I hope everyone read it. A well organized discussion.

I'd add that I have come up with a classification of discussion/arguing styles. IMO we all have parts of each and exhibit varying degrees of each depending on mood and/or subject. Note, this does not come from education, but just a way I came up with based on personal experience. But even though it is based on experience, I still maintain it is only my opinion.

Truth Seeker: They are looking for the correct/best answer, no matter where it comes from. If the person they are talking to makes a good point, they acknowledge it (hopefully out loud). They will recognize when someone has proved them wrong. And they are happy when the best answer/solution is achieved, no matter what the beginning positions were.

Goal Seeker: They want a particular outcome from the argument. If the person they are talking to makes a good point on their side, they tend to ignore it. Not only do they not acknowledge a good point, they don;t internalize it or even recognize it later. They tend to listen to the other person only until they hear something the think they have a good argument against. They are more likely to interrupt.

Win Seeker: They just want to come out the winner. They listen for ANYTHING they can argue against. This means they tend to change the subject so they can move to something they think they can win.

If you recognize this in others, you can make better decisions on how to discuss issues, and better decisions about when to just walk away.

If you recognize this in yourself, you can become a much better conversationalist.

OK, so this was a little bit of thread drift. Not directly about "opinions", but it was a little something about one technique I keep in mind when I read the threads. How it DOES relate to opinions is this. The above is my opinion about discussion/arguing styles. It isn't fact. But you can read it with an open mind and form your own opinions about it. What is said above doesn't matter if it comes from years of education or years of experience or just a flash of inspiration. The only thing that matters is, when you read it, is there something you can learn from it as it fits in with YOUR education/experience/inspiration. I try to read all threads this way.

I gotta run, otherwise I would probably edit/expand on a few things. This is the first time I have put the above theory in writing, so it's not as well stated as I'd like.

-dan
__________________
dacust is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-07-2008, 07:25   #57
Moderator Emeritus
 
GordMay's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario - 48-29N x 89-20W
Boat: (Cruiser Living On Dirt)
Posts: 31,582
Images: 240
Quote:
Originally Posted by dacust View Post
OK, it was long [referring to Sandy’s Patent on Pedantry] , but I hope everyone read it. A well organized discussion...
... This is the first time I have put the above theory in writing, so it's not as well stated as I'd like.
-dan
Well said, both of you.
__________________
Gord May
"If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?"



GordMay is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 18-07-2008, 08:25   #58
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Ohio, USA
Boat: Fastback 43
Posts: 79
opinion of a new poster

Very interesting discussion. To bring it back to the original post, I may be able to shed some light on the concern about how opinions may affect people who are interested in cruising, but have no experience.

I have been reading posts here for months and I was initially concerned about pirates (I hope to circumnavigate some day) and my first readings here did not allay that concern. However, I quickly came to the conclusion that a little forethought would keep the threat to a very low level. I am no longer concerned. I think that the same thought process applies (for me at least) to a wide range of topics from laptop use to which kind of auto steering device to use; reading many opinions is very helpful, but the decision is mine. To conclude, I am very happy with the opinions expressed here even though I eventually disregard many of them as not applicable to my situation or sometimes just silly (IMHO).

Ron
__________________
bix85 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-07-2008, 08:49   #59
jzk
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 639
I learned quite a bit about sailing and how to drive a stick shift car just from reading and thinking about it. Of course, when I actually started driving a stick shift car and sailing, I was able to use my experience to tune the theory that I had earlier learned. But without knowing the theory, my experience would have been much different!

There are many things in sailing that I won't get to experience until I need them and it will be too late for trial and error. If I were going to go to sea in a catamaran I would chose a Jordan series drogue over a parachute anchor soley based on what I have read about each and applying what I know about the laws of the universe to each of them. Just because this one person survived a storm just fine in a parachute anchor doesn't mean that it is the better choice. Were they even in a breaking sea?

I have a couple of guns in my home, but have never been in a firefight. However, if I ever do get into a firefight, theory tells me that I would be better off with a gun than without!
__________________
jzk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-07-2008, 09:03   #60
Senior Cruiser
 
sandy daugherty's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2008
Location: near Annapolis
Boat: PDQ 36 & Atlantic 42
Posts: 1,178
Dacust: I like that concept. Three distinct, exclusive categories that are self evident in a few posts. While there may be other, lesser motives, such as peace seeker or attention seeker, you have nailed it!

exfishnz: for some people, "psychologist" is a paycheck rather than an epithet. there was a saying that partially explained the profession: "a PSYCHOLOGIST wants to find out what's wrong with himself. a SOCIOLOGIST wants to find out what's wrong with everybody else. Someone who doesn't want everybody else to know whats wrong with him is a CLIENT."
__________________

__________________
sandy daugherty is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
'Pirates' and 'Pirate Attacks' Euro Cruiser Health, Safety & Related Gear 24 20-08-2010 15:06
Sir Peter Blake's "Seamaster," Now "Tara," Still Hard at Work TaoJones Monohull Sailboats 5 15-12-2009 15:40
Experience with Samson "Deep Six" 6-plait anchor rode? Bill Hoffman Anchoring & Mooring 3 29-07-2008 00:49
Living on the Hook in Santa Barbara - personal experience? windsaloft Liveaboard's Forum 0 05-04-2008 18:31



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:02.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.