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Old 07-02-2011, 10:16   #46
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I sense a thread lock coming.

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Old 07-02-2011, 10:20   #47
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This thread is now locked...in a metaphysical way.
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Old 07-02-2011, 10:26   #48
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This thread went HORRIBLY religious.
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Old 07-02-2011, 10:31   #49
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How, in God's name, could a discussion of metaphysics NOT get religious?
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Old 07-02-2011, 10:40   #50
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I sense a thread lock coming.

Maybe if we sacrifice a chicken (or a Goat? ) the Mods will leave us alone?

WOO!
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Old 07-02-2011, 10:58   #51
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in my hedonistic days allways felt sacraficing virgins was far more effective.......
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Old 07-02-2011, 11:01   #52
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We are always watching ... and not in the mythical, metaphysical sense ... though the bribery idea is a good one
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Old 07-02-2011, 11:54   #53
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Excellent posts folks.

When I hear the term "primitive cultures" I think, (atol, I know this doesn't apply to you saying it), how does one define primitive?

Typically living in harmony with nature, sometimes believing "god" is defined "sharing" with everyone all things at all times, are very laudable characteristics. Not primitive in any way, but I guess not having the goods and services the 1st world requires is a more defining mechanism.
"on the planet Earth, man had always assumed that he was more intelligent than dolphins because he had achieved so much -- the wheel, New York, wars and so on -- whilst all the dolphins had ever done was muck about in the water having a good time. But conversely, the dolphins had always believed that they were far more intelligent than man -- for precisely the same reasons." - Douglas Adams, So Long and Thanks for All the Fish
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Old 07-02-2011, 12:17   #54
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Remember to play nice folks and the thread can stay open.
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Old 07-02-2011, 14:41   #55
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That's interesting, this thread wasn't here a few minutes ago. In my stats I couldn't find any post I had made, or the thread either. I posted a message to atoll that I was glad to see the post about leaving Thailand just in time. As that is the kind of the I thing atoll was wishing to discuss.

Now it's back and my posts are in the stats on my profile.

I must apologize for bringing up climate change, it was just an example, for me, how science can be corrupted yet people still use the false info to support their own agenda. To Mark Johnson, I agree with your long post on the subject. I want to know the truth about the subject and have an open mind.

Personally, I don't hold to any particular religious belief system. I cringe at ritual and dogmatic rules. But I don't squirm in my seat when the subject comes up, even if someone thinks they need to enlighten me. I can take it stride without feeling put upon.

More importantly, I think we make our own destiny by our actions and interactions with and toward others. Much like atoll's account on the previous page of leaving Thailand just in time.
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Old 07-02-2011, 15:18   #56
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I would be willing to lay bets that most of us who have had some sort of "epiphany" that it occurred when we were somehow relating to nature in some way or another.

I guess it makes sense that so many ancient or 2000 year old and some not so ancient organized spiritual communal structures would either directly or indirectly reflect natural phenomena.

It is the organized communal structure that free-minded souls often rail against, but reality is like attracts like. Spiritual thinking, anglers on a lake or cruisers.
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Old 07-02-2011, 16:29   #57
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..... if it hadn't been for this chain of events,my wife and kids and some of the crew would definitely have been on the beach......................
Ironically Atoll, I also had a near miss in Phuket.

That year I bought SG in Phuket and I told my sister that I enjoyed Thailand and may leave the boat there for a while.

Instead, took her to the Philippines, but December 14th, my sister emails to say they have impulsively booked Xmas week in a nice hotel on Phi-Phi…. Would I care to join them?

Their Hotel was booked and the lesser ones limited, so I suggested they change their plans and come visit me in the Philippines, where we could do some sailing around Puerto Galera.

They did and if not, I am sure my 8 and 11 year old nieces would have been on the beach that terrible morning.

Was back in Phuket last December for a week and spoke to many Thais and expat friends about that time. So many with amazing stories of near misses.

Getting back to the philosophical discussion of metaphysics’ what you ascribed atoll to some form of divine intervention is really only an emotional attempt to justify an unknown. It is a self fulfilling prophecy!

If things had gone different, we may not have been around for this discussion, but the fact that we are…is no proof!

Chance, near misses have always been interesting to me from my early days when I studied parapsychology and the investigation and tests being done at the Rhine Institute.

Reports of higher than average numbers of people interviewed after a public transport disaster, who changed their daily schedule because of an unexplained feeling of danger seems to give some credence to a sixth sense awareness. But it is too much dependent on an emotional test subject and the desire to explain.

Also, they were unable to interview those who made last minute decisions to get on board the transport.

As a sailor, I listen carefully to my instincts and even in my dream state, I analyze for clues or messages about my decision process.

I think that is a good thing, but not any proof of some larger order or plan
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Old 07-02-2011, 16:53   #58
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good points pelegic,and i agree that devine intervention,was probably not the case,though spending long times on passage,then arriving in many new places over a period of many years there is definitely some sort of rhtym and flow on an subconcious level.

perhaps it is instinct,intuition, but have learned to trust it if viable and possable.....,though not allways,generally to ones detriment!
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Old 07-02-2011, 19:45   #59
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How, in God's name, could a discussion of metaphysics NOT get religious?
Likewise, spirituality, metaphysics and religion are definitely NOT the same thing. You can be spiritual without the indoctrinations that come with most religions and the conflict that inevitably follows. Some too can be "religious" by simply following their own beliefs?

It is a pity we cannot sensibly discuss threads like this without them somehow becoming characterized as the indoctrinated type of religion that typically causes arguing. To me this was much more an interesting debate about somewhat conflicting personal philosophies and even psychologies.

Should we just go back to a superficial one sided discussion about the latest over the top production boat with all the bells and whistles to impress even the most discerning hedonist?
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Old 07-02-2011, 19:48   #60
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Or we could start a Thread asking if Cruisers are really just retarded closet Masochists....
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