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Old 18-09-2015, 13:14   #31
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Re: First Mate or Admiral

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Originally Posted by Browning View Post
In a book that my Wife and I am reading to prepare her for sailing with me over horizon one day, there is a very strong statement that, if the wife is not the skipper, one should never call her "First Mate". I don't understand this statement. What is derogatory in calling her first mate?
-n".
Its the fastest way to divorce being derogatory to your wife. And the fastest way to end a cruise by being insulting.

Why can't you just be equal? What's wrong with equality? Why do you need a title? What legal requirement says one part of a couple needs to be suppressed?

On my registration papers there's a place to name the Master. I put both our names, me and my girlfriend. BOTH of us were Master.

There is also a good legal reason to bury the inequality: if you get sick and save the boat then the other Master can sail it. But if you subjugate your wife in some countries where women are not liokeed favorably upon she may not be allowed to get your boat to a better location.

Finally, let me reinforce: a couple on a sail boat is a COUPLE.


Mark
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Old 18-09-2015, 13:19   #32
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Re: First Mate or Admiral

Absolutely, the titles are silly.
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Old 18-09-2015, 13:32   #33
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Re: First Mate or Admiral

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I mean really, calling me a Captain, doesn't make me one. In actual fact I dislike being called that as I'm not an actual Captain , I didn't earn it.
I'm a Warrant officer, I earned that, call me Chief if you like

But calling her the Admiral is a pure joke is all.
Okay, it's Chief now kimosabe
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Old 18-09-2015, 13:37   #34
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pirate Re: First Mate or Admiral

To me its chauvinistic and insulting.. bordering on the 'Blonde Bimbo' remarks..
Everyone knows Admirals are senile old bastards who don't know their arse from their elbow.. unless it happened 50yrs ago..
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Old 18-09-2015, 13:41   #35
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Re: First Mate or Admiral

When I first heard someone referring to his wife as the Admiral, I thought it was a bit sexist and demeaning---and there is that part of it.

However, it also acknowledges a real truth: the wives who support their husband's sailing efforts are respected as one might an admiral. Not all admirals are meanies, but they do have to have a core of practicality.

As to what Mark J wrote, about listing both as Masters, there is great wisdom in that.

In Mexico, when we were there, only the First Mate, other than the Capt. was allowed to move the vessel.

So how you refer to each other in private is your business, but how you deal with the outside world must be ruled by your wisdom. This certainly includes making sure that if something happens to one of you the other can take care of you and the boat.

Ann
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Old 18-09-2015, 15:33   #36
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Re: First Mate or Admiral

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Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
When I first heard someone referring to his wife as the Admiral, I thought it was a bit sexist and demeaning---and there is that part of it.

...
Ha, sexist & demeaning to who? The lower ranking Captain?
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Old 18-09-2015, 15:50   #37
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Re: First Mate or Admiral

Its all fun and should not be taken so seriously. My wife will be the first to tell you she is "The Admiral" of ASD. I am the boat boy, until she promotes me to captain, because she wants to go somewhere. Upon our arrival, I am quickly demoted to "Boat Boy"

Here she is with drink in hand enjoying a cruise and I am the captain....
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Old 18-09-2015, 16:13   #38
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Re: First Mate or Admiral

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Originally Posted by MarkJ View Post
Its the fastest way to divorce being derogatory to your wife. And the fastest way to end a cruise by being insulting.

Why can't you just be equal? What's wrong with equality? Why do you need a title? What legal requirement says one part of a couple needs to be suppressed?

On my registration papers there's a place to name the Master. I put both our names, me and my girlfriend. BOTH of us were Master.

There is also a good legal reason to bury the inequality: if you get sick and save the boat then the other Master can sail it. But if you subjugate your wife in some countries where women are not liokeed favorably upon she may not be allowed to get your boat to a better location.

Finally, let me reinforce: a couple on a sail boat is a COUPLE.
Always feels weird and a bit scary when I find myself agreeing with Mark J . But all I can said is: Right on Mark
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Old 18-09-2015, 16:38   #39
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Re: First Mate or Admiral

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Its all fun and should not be taken so seriously.
Are you suggesting that there are a couple of unused senses of humor lying here on the dock unused. How did that happen?

We gauge our boats by their hull thickness...stiff and strong is so much better.

Skin thickness should be measured similarly...

Isn't this thread a re-run? When does the new season start? (TV analogy)
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Old 18-09-2015, 17:32   #40
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Re: First Mate or Admiral

We have had to file a Crew List in dozens of countries where we have to list the position that each person on the boat holds. Years ago, we were advised to list both my wife and me as co-captains, for if something happened to me and I was listed as 'Captain' and she was listed as 'crew', authorities might not allow her to move the boat with hiring a licensed 'captain'. Some immigration officials don't recognize two captains in which case we list me as the captain and my wife as the pilot. She actually likes the title of pilot (she's a damn good navigator) but she resents the term 'admiral' as it's too facetious.

As far as command of the boat goes, I'm the Boss and she's the Decision Maker.

Fair winds and calm seas.
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Old 18-09-2015, 17:40   #41
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Re: First Mate or Admiral

My wife does about as much of the sailing as I do, if not more. I think that's probably the case with any cruising couple.

Here in So Cal the Harbor Police, Navy, Coast Guard, and Sea Tow will all refer to you as "Skipper" if you're on a pleasure vessel and Captain if you're on a commercial vessel over VHF. It's my opinion that an owner/operator should be called "Skipper" and "Captain" should be reserved for licensed or military Captains.

So we're both "Skipper", depending on which of us answers the VHF. If I'm holding a beer, she's definitely the skipper.
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Old 18-09-2015, 17:56   #42
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Re: First Mate or Admiral

We use titles on board, almost exclusively.

I'm daddy, she's mommy.



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Old 18-09-2015, 17:58   #43
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Re: First Mate or Admiral

In my book, it is all up to the context and the way we use the phrases, any phrases.

I have been called a captain, a master and a handful of other funny names, at times by serious maritime authorities. I was never quite sure what they meant as I am none. I found their terms of endearment vain and cold.

I was also called a white faggot by a black gas station worker in Martinique (the worker was black, not the gas). In this case I did not now why either. Somehow, we later became best friends.

So, to me, it is not what name we use but much more how we say it.

With love,
b and the admiral of his heart (aka first mate)
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Old 20-09-2015, 23:33   #44
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Re: First Mate or Admiral

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Its the fastest way to divorce being derogatory to your wife. And the fastest way to end a cruise by being insulting.
This was exactly my point. I do _not_ want to sound derogatory, that's why I am asking the question.

Quote:
Why can't you just be equal? What's wrong with equality? Why do you need a title? What legal requirement says one part of a couple needs to be suppressed?

On my registration papers there's a place to name the Master. I put both our names, me and my girlfriend. BOTH of us were Master.
That's good for you. The German regulations however say there must be ONE person responsible.

Quote:
There is also a good legal reason to bury the inequality: if you get sick and save the boat then the other Master can sail it. But if you subjugate your wife in some countries where women are not liokeed favorably upon she may not be allowed to get your boat to a better location.
I thought it is quite normal that the first mate can be acting captain in case of captain's (temporary) disability, provided both have the necessary licenses.

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Finally, let me reinforce: a couple on a sail boat is a COUPLE.


Mark
That's true, this is why I don't understand the theme "she decides where we go", but this is another topic.
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Old 06-10-2015, 15:49   #45
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Re: First Mate or Admiral

Get divorced
Then don't worry about it
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