Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 05-07-2010, 20:33   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 118
Cruisers' Lack of Etiquette for Commercial Vessels

I have to vent about my day and the lack of understanding of cruisers with people who drive boats for a living. I am both. Today I was doing double hotsprings tours back to back and 11 hour day and I did one yesterday. We have a dock where my company and 4 others drop people off and pick up. There is a loading zone marked in white. While this is a public dock we pay a yearly usage fee. So when I show up to work and there is not where to drop off my passengers bc there was 2 trawlers and a fat hunter in my spot. I moved a float plane via asking nicely and when I tried to ask them to anchor and use there huge dinks they where rude and talked down to me. So I worked around them all day. docking on the 4 ft wide end by myself in 15 -20 knts. So next time you are rude to a comercial captain and think you have some right or prestige bc you have a big boat you should understand that you are a jerk.
Also I may drive a 30ft boat most days but I have delivered 100 ft yachts and am upgrading to my 200ton masters so don't talk down to the guy driving the small boat bc I prob have more miles under my belt and am out here all day and the west coast of vancouver island is nasty. I just want people to think before they act arrogant. I have "saved" some of boaters who couldn't drive there boat in 25 ft waves and I gave them a lift. I just hate that the community I love has crapped on me the last 2 days.
__________________

__________________
Finditsurfit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2010, 21:10   #2
Eternal Member
 
Chief Engineer's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: North of Baltimore
Boat: Ericson 27 & 18' Herrmann Catboat
Posts: 3,798
If you are paying for use of the dock....why isn't it posted?

The water taxi spots around here are.
__________________

__________________
Chief Engineer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2010, 21:20   #3
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 118
BC is lazy and just hasn't done it. It took a year to get the loading zone painted white. If someone that is working explains the situation and tries to be poilite then you should respect that this is that persons place of work and the take care of the area everything from cleaning up after cruisers to doing small fixes on the dock when needed. It like walking into someones office and parking there ferrari in there spot and saying I am on a touring holiday bite me... BTW its a very remote area about 30 miles from the nearest town and only by boat.
__________________
Finditsurfit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2010, 23:33   #4
Senior Cruiser
 
rebel heart's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 6,190
Images: 3
I give preference to anyone who's using the water as their job. It's hard enough to do your job most days, without having a bunch of people making it harder. I won't put up with absurd captains but in general my leisure-fun sailing schedule is happy to wait for the tug to go past.

Edit: although some ferry and tour boat skippers should take some sailing lessons because they put themselves into some bad situations sometimes.
__________________
rebel heart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2010, 23:35   #5
CF Adviser
 
Pelagic's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2007
Boat: Van Helleman Schooner 65ft StarGazer
Posts: 6,890
I understand your pain as I used to drive commercial water taxis and pilot boats in BC.

The problem is that they are Government docks, paid by the taxpayers and are meant to be on a first come basis to all.

I am sure many abuse the temporary loading area

I also imagine your yearly usage fee is quite small and allows your boat owner to overnight in an internal slip.

2 cheeky ideas…..

Put up your own official looking sign with company name and big maple leaf
“Reserved for Passenger Loading and Unloading…No Loitering!

And when you come back to the busy dock… put out you big black tires and yell..

Move over or standby boys, I’m coming alongside with passengers!

Amazing how quickly people will learn.....
__________________
Pelagic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2010, 02:04   #6
Moderator
 
Dockhead's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Cowes (Winter), Baltic (Summer) (the boat!); somewhere in the air (me!)
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 19,748
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finditsurfit View Post
I have to vent about my day and the lack of understanding of cruisers with people who drive boats for a living. I am both. Today I was doing double hotsprings tours back to back and 11 hour day and I did one yesterday. We have a dock where my company and 4 others drop people off and pick up. There is a loading zone marked in white. While this is a public dock we pay a yearly usage fee. So when I show up to work and there is not where to drop off my passengers bc there was 2 trawlers and a fat hunter in my spot. I moved a float plane via asking nicely and when I tried to ask them to anchor and use there huge dinks they where rude and talked down to me. So I worked around them all day. docking on the 4 ft wide end by myself in 15 -20 knts. So next time you are rude to a comercial captain and think you have some right or prestige bc you have a big boat you should understand that you are a jerk.
Also I may drive a 30ft boat most days but I have delivered 100 ft yachts and am upgrading to my 200ton masters so don't talk down to the guy driving the small boat bc I prob have more miles under my belt and am out here all day and the west coast of vancouver island is nasty. I just want people to think before they act arrogant. I have "saved" some of boaters who couldn't drive there boat in 25 ft waves and I gave them a lift. I just hate that the community I love has crapped on me the last 2 days.
I have a couple things to say about this:

1. I think all cruisers should permanently keep in mind that we are amateurs out having fun, which puts us in a totally different category from professionals who are out doing their jobs. I try to never, ever, ever forget this, personally. One way I put this concept into practice is to navigate to the absolute maximum extent possible so that I don't interfere in the slightest way with shipping. I am particularly careful to avoid any situation where I might end up being technically the stand-on vessel, in order to avoid making the commercial captain even think about manuevering, which is so unfair since a commercial ship is 100x harder to maneuver than our little blow-boats are. I almost ran aground one time fleeing a shipping channel, in order to avoid that situation.

As a kind of footnote to that, I expect (but rarely receive) the same kind of consideration from small mobos and dinghy sailors. I am constrained by draft compared to them (54 foot boat drawing almost 2.5 meters) and are much slower to maneuver. With 22 tons displacement I cannot stop on a dime. It particularly irritates me when 17 foot bowriders full of beer-drinkers cut me off in my river when I'm on my way out to sea, then weave back and forth across the channel at 4 knots without once looking behind them. In order to imagine what commercial captains think about us, I remember that feeling and magnify it by 1000x. No wonder they call us "WAFIs".


2. If a sailboat is legitimately docked at a public dock in a place where he is specifically allowed to dock, and all tied up and settled in, the skipper will not immediately comprehend why he should move. No doubt the guys you were dealing with were jerks, but it sounds to me like the bigger issue is regulation of use of that public dock and signage explaining the priority of commercial vessels.
__________________
Dockhead is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2010, 02:07   #7
Moderator
 
Dockhead's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Cowes (Winter), Baltic (Summer) (the boat!); somewhere in the air (me!)
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 19,748
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pelagic View Post
And when you come back to the busy dock… put out you big black tires and yell..

Move over or standby boys, I’m coming alongside with passengers!

Amazing how quickly people will learn.....

LOL! That's a great idea. Just raft up to them! I don't know what the rules are there, but in many places you have the right.
__________________
Dockhead is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2010, 07:01   #8
Senior Cruiser
 
Captain Bill's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: On the boat
Boat: Endeavourcat Sailcat 44
Posts: 2,313
Lets see if I understand this correctly. There is a public doc with a white area painted on it, but no signs explaining what the white area means. Perhaps I'm ignorant but a white section of dock unmarked by signage has absolutely no meaning to me and perhaps not to the people using the "Public" doc on a first come first serve basis. Without appropriate notice I don't see any reason you should expect these people to devine your issue. So far as I know clairvoyance is not a requirement for operating a boat, recreational or commercial.

While I have can see your frustration it is clear to me that commercial water users have their own issues. In our areas the biggest issue is crab fishermen. Our state has clear laws that it is illegal to place crab traps in marked channels but our local boys do this all the time. Not only do they place them there, but they also use black bouys. Do you know how hard it is to dodge black trap bouys at night? Inside the marked channel of course. On top of that our local crabbers have taken to placing their traps all around the edge of our marina. When we say something to them about blocking the entrances to the marina, they make the same stupid arguement; They pay for a license and they have a right to put the traps wherever they want, and besides this is the way they make their living. This is not just an inconvience, I have actually had boat damage caused by hitting a trap float inside the channel and wrapping the line around my prop. Our channel runs east-west and when going into the setting sun it is almost impossible to see the bouys. Now technically the marina area where they are setting their traps is not a marked channel so what they are doing is not illegal, but it is terribly rude.
__________________
Captain Bill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2010, 07:04   #9
Registered User
 
svHyLyte's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Tampa Bay area, USA
Boat: Beneteau First 42
Posts: 3,434
Images: 25
Quote:
We have a dock where my company and 4 others drop people off and pick up. There is a loading zone marked in white. While this is a public dock we pay a yearly usage fee.
Perhaps you and the other vendors that pay for access to the dockside should get together, have made up, and post a few signs indicating "10 Minute Loading Zone Only--Violators will be towed". Many of the public piers that I've seen in the US have such notices and they rarely seem to be ignored. (A fellow did that to one of the piers in SoCal and the local constabulary obligingly enforced the "rule" until one of the city commissioners finally pointed out they were unofficial signs!) I did see one fellow try to ignor such a sign in Key West while we were on our last cruise. The tour boat operator pulled up next to him in his big, somewhat battered steel hulled boat, and annouced he needed to raft up with the violator to discharge passengers over his bull horn. I have never seen a Sea Ray get underway faster--accompanied by much applause from the tourists that only wanted to get ashore and into the pubs sooner than later.

FWIW...
__________________
"It is not so much for its beauty that the Sea makes a claim upon men's hearts, as for that subtle something, that quality of air, that emanation from the waves, that so wonderfully renews a weary spirit."
svHyLyte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2010, 16:13   #10
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 118
YEah I am going up there on my day off to paint in black letters loading zone. I understand not knowing that its a loading zone. Its being rude and talking down to me after I politely explain the area and refusing to move. Just for everyone that visit the west coast of vancouver island yellow or white mean loading and usually yellow means commercial only. Thanks for letting me vent I have been working to go cruising again and somethings just get to me.
__________________
Finditsurfit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2010, 23:05   #11
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: BC Canada
Boat: 25' Coronada - Seileaster
Posts: 57
Images: 13
I have done some sailing out of False Creek (Vancouver BC) with water taxi's all around. Technically I may have the right of way, however I try to sail so they don't have to do much maneuvering. They are trying to make a living, I am out to relax. Getting into an argument over rights is not relaxing to me so I will give ground and make it obvious to them.

The yellow or white is that a standard marking... a few signs will go a long ways even if they are unofficial. If its a public wharf then I guess anyone can use it, however that doesn't rationalize rudeness.
__________________
canuck1955 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2010, 23:39   #12
CF Adviser
 
Bash's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: sausalito
Boat: 14 meter sloop
Posts: 7,260
Lightbulb

Quote:
Originally Posted by Finditsurfit View Post
Just for everyone that visit the west coast of vancouver island yellow or white mean loading and usually yellow means commercial only.
I'm sorry, but that's just completely weird. USUALLY yellow means commercial only? Usually?

And we're to understand that these rules apply to the west coast of Vancouver island, as per your post? Pray tell, what colors apply to the east coast of that island?
__________________
cruising is entirely about showing up--in boat shoes.
Bash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-07-2010, 05:42   #13
Moderator Emeritus
 
GordMay's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario - 48-29N x 89-20W
Boat: (Cruiser Living On Dirt)
Posts: 31,580
Images: 240
I suspect that if the OP reconsidered his original characterization of the offenders, he might admit that they probably weren’t really “cruisers”; but actually "recreational boaters".
__________________
Gord May
"If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?"



GordMay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-07-2010, 07:29   #14
Registered User
 
lorenzo b's Avatar

Join Date: May 2009
Location: Panama
Boat: Steel trawler 63' Eileen Farrell
Posts: 961
Excuse me, but why do you feel your job is more important that my leisure? Paying a fee to use public property to conduct a business does not mean you own that property. You may want to read you fee agreement more closely and maybe renegotiate the terms. Putting up private signage on public property is stealing and is a crime. If it irritates you to share public property with the public, why don't you build your own dock?
__________________
lorenzo b is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-07-2010, 08:10   #15
Senior Cruiser
 
Randyonr3's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Nov 2007
Boat: Beneteau FIRST 42
Posts: 1,836
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post

1. I think all cruisers should permanently keep in mind that we are amateurs
Speak for yourself.............there's nothing amateur about myself, my boat, or the way I handle it.........
__________________

__________________
Randyonr3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Volvo Penta 740 DP Lack of Power AJL1275 Engines and Propulsion Systems 12 04-07-2010 09:12
Cruiser Profiles or lack there of waverider Off Topic Forum 8 13-01-2009 17:04
Lack of Storm Prep / What Are They Thinking?? Maine Sail Anchoring & Mooring 16 09-09-2008 13:56
Multihull Capsize Due to Lack of Experience ssullivan Multihull Sailboats 125 06-03-2008 22:07
Radio Etiquette and the lack thereof... Rangiroo Marine Electronics 62 03-01-2008 18:24



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:07.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.