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Old 09-08-2013, 18:41   #91
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For anyone actually interested in more than shooting from the hip about something they have close to zero understanding of, interesting link here

http://judithcurry.com/2013/08/05/ag...ge/#more-12466

Both the latest statement fro the AGU and a very measured response from Roger Pielke.
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Old 09-08-2013, 18:48   #92
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Re: Climate Change

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Originally Posted by capngeo View Post
Guess it depends on whose data you look at....... according to THIS we are at a very low level of CO2 at the moment...

Then again some sites suggest that a single volcano can blast out more CO2 than all of mankind... when others say bunk to that.

The whole issue is a scam! How arrogant to think the we (humans) have power over the Earth... In fact, I'd bet there is a damn good chance that there were prior "human" civilizations that rose and then fell when Mother Earth shook them off... or you could believe that pyramids were built with oxcarts. Regardless, I won't be around to see it either way. So let me turn up the Air Conditioning, book a cruise on a coal fired ship, fly home on a jet, and buy an SUV...
Perhaps you should look a bit further on that website, as a few pages in from the link you provided, there is this page.

Recent Global Warming

And it obviously substantiates the issue of co2, global warming, and man's part in it.

Thanks for a great link to a good website
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Old 09-08-2013, 18:51   #93
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For anyone actually interested in more than shooting from the hip about something they have close to zero understanding of, interesting link here

http://judithcurry.com/2013/08/05/ag...ge/#more-12466

Both the latest statement fro the AGU and a very measured response from Roger Pielke.
Interesting roger pielke is not disputing man made effects on global warming , merely that the subject is more complex then stated , the accuracy of the models is questionable and the outcomes are not that clear as yet.

Dave
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Old 09-08-2013, 18:58   #94
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Re: Climate Change

Well....I wish the world would get on with it and just end to prove it's point. But in the mean time, some here should use lots of sunscreen on...their neck.
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Old 09-08-2013, 19:05   #95
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Re: Climate Change

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Originally Posted by capngeo View Post
Guess it depends on whose data you look at....... according to THIS we are at a very low level of CO2 at the moment...

Then again some sites suggest that a single volcano can blast out more CO2 than all of mankind... when others say bunk to that.

The whole issue is a scam! How arrogant to think the we (humans) have power over the Earth... In fact, I'd bet there is a damn good chance that there were prior "human" civilizations that rose and then fell when Mother Earth shook them off... or you could believe that pyramids were built with oxcarts. Regardless, I won't be around to see it either way. So let me turn up the Air Conditioning, book a cruise on a coal fired ship, fly home on a jet, and buy an SUV...
You should read the website you point to: By the year 2000 [carbon dioxide] has risen to about 367 ppmv (that is 367 molecules of CO2 for every one million molecules in the air). Thus, it is higher than pre-industrial values by one third of the pre-industrial era. (You can check the math on your calculator.)

Global Temperature Increase
While this increase in carbon dioxide has occurred, temperatures in the northern hemisphere have risen by between 1°F and 2°F (almost 1°C) since A.D. 1850, as recorded by measurements. The record only goes back 150 years because direct measurements before 1850 are hard to find. The ten warmest years on record have occurred since 1983, seven of them since 1990. Global temperature in 1998 was the hottest in the historical record. This amount of overall increase in temperature is approximately equal to the amount of increase that is predicted by raising the abundance of carbon dioxide by one third of pre-industrial values � exactly what has happened in the last 150 years.
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Old 09-08-2013, 19:10   #96
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Re: Climate Change

You are all a way too smart for me... I just stick my nose outside and, yep, it's warmer or nope, it's colder. All this scientific **** is just too much. Zee has it right buy a boat and go cruising and take 'er she comes. Two years ago I had 15 feet of snow at my place... last winter, maybe a couple of feet... go figure!
Frankly, I think the wildfires in California are a major contributor to global warming! Phil
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Old 09-08-2013, 19:28   #97
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Interesting roger pielke is not disputing man made effects on global warming , merely that the subject is more complex then stated , the accuracy of the models is questionable and the outcomes are not that clear as yet.

Dave
Absolutely. I think you'd have to look very hard to find anyone involved in that area of science with their hands up saying human activities have had no contribution the the very rapid recent heating of their planet.

I like that site though, it does dig deeper than many.

That one and real climate

http://www.realclimate.org
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Old 09-08-2013, 19:34   #98
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You are all a way too smart for me... I just stick my nose outside and, yep, it's warmer or nope, it's colder. All this scientific **** is just too much. Zee has it right buy a boat and go cruising and take 'er she comes. Two years ago I had 15 feet of snow at my place... last winter, maybe a couple of feet... go figure!
Frankly, I think the wildfires in California are a major contributor to global warming! Phil
You are mixing up weather and climate.

Dave
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Old 09-08-2013, 19:39   #99
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Re: Climate Change

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So, which is it?! Either a) it's happening and we didn't do it or b) it is happening and we did do it. Take your pick, there is no third option!

George and I choose A!
George Carlin on Global Warming - YouTube
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If you imagine that George is in alignment with your view, your dreaming. What the man is saying is that the earth is a closed loop system. And we will perish if we don't return to the closed loop system that was human existence for the past couple hundred K years. We are out of touch with reality. We are out of harmony with the natural order of life. Sounds like a lot of hippy horse manure right? Doesn't mean it ain't the truth. Whats simple is generally true. Okums Razor. Like the man said, 'it doesn't care which side of the argument you fall on' get in step, realign, or perish. Period. Don't **** wher you eat. Don't set your house on fire in order to stay warm. Don't spend every dime you/we have on absurd misadventures to no end whatsoever and then bitch about the economy. Get aligned. for every action there is an equal reaction. Set everything on fire and you get smoke, too much smoke you get hydrocarbon haze too, much haze,,,well one can hope that you get it. Close the loop. Rejoin the club. Fit the requirement's or get terminated. It's my hunch that those who get the truism that, 'chance favors the prepared mind', are gonna get to hang around way longer than the unprepared. But then glibness is an option. As is denial.
He's also talking about the arrogance of people preaching from the alter of environmentalism. But, ya know maybe you right about being out of harmony with the nature of things. We meed to get aligned with nature and forget the glib. So what if some of the climate change scientist were fudging things and hiding their initial data from other scientists to check. They are are really doing it for or own good right? Yes back to nature. We need to unshackle our selves from all things manufactured to save our souls. Since you are so concerned and far far ahead on the issue you should go first. Let's start with your computer, followed by your car, and that bicycle is made of metal lot's of CO2 went into making that and about that IPAD and IPOD, cell phone has got to got to go too....
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Old 09-08-2013, 19:48   #100
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Re: Climate Change

LOL! You guys are proving my point! I said it depends on whose data you look at, the point being there are two camps, two sets of data, two agendas.... They can't BOTH be right!

When I have waterfront property here in Florida (I'm at 11' now), then I'll be impressed, but I'll wager my net worth that it won't be in my lifetime ( or that of my great-great grand children's either)... There are a lot more pressing issues at hand than cow farts! (Again IMHO)
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Old 09-08-2013, 19:51   #101
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Re: Climate Change

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Originally Posted by capngeo View Post
Guess it depends on whose data you look at....... according to THIS we are at a very low level of CO2 at the moment...
It is pretty much irrelevant what the CO2 levels were 300 million years ago. What is relevant is the relationship between CO2 and temperatures during the relatively brief time that hominids have existed on the earth.
Quote:
Then again some sites suggest that a single volcano can blast out more CO2 than all of mankind... when others say bunk to that...
Do volcanoes emit more CO2 than humans?
Quote:
The skeptic argument...
Volcanoes emit more CO2 than humans…

"Human additions of CO2 to the atmosphere must be taken into perspective…

Over the past 250 years, humans have added just one part of CO2 in 10,000 to the atmosphere. One volcanic cough can do this in a day..." (Ian Plimer)

What the science says...
Volcanoes emit around 0.3 billion tonnes of CO2 per year. This is about 1% of human CO2 emissions which is around 29 billion tonnes per year.

Volcanoes emit CO2 both on land and underwater. Underwater volcanoes emit between 66 to 97 million tonnes of CO2 per year. However, this is balanced by the carbon sink provided by newly formed ocean floor lava. Consequently, underwater volcanoes have little effect on atmospheric CO2 levels. The greater contribution comes from subaerial volcanoes (subaerial means "under the air", refering to land volcanoes). Subaerial volcanoes are estimated to emit 242 million tonnes of CO2 per year (Morner 2002).

In contrast, humans are currently emiting around 29 billion tonnes of CO2 per year (EIA). Human CO2 emissions are over 100 times greater than volcanic CO2 emissions. This is apparent when comparing atmospheric CO2 levels to volcanic activity since 1960. Even strong volcanic eruptions such as Pinatubo, El Chicon and Agung had little discernable impact on CO2 levels. In fact, the rate of change of CO2 levels actually drops slightly after a volcanic eruption, possibly due to the cooling effect of aerosols.



Figure 1: Atmospheric CO2 levels measured at Mauna Loa, Hawaii (NOAA) and Stratospheric Aerosol Optical Thickness at 50nm (NASA GISS).


The Mount Pinatubo eruption emitted 42 million tonnes of CO2 (Gerlach et al 1996). Compare this to human emissions in 1991: 23 billion tonnes of CO2 (CDIAC). The strongest eruption over the last half-century amounted to 0.2% of human CO2 emissions in that year.

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Old 09-08-2013, 19:57   #102
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Re: Climate Change

...But just in case...would it hurt any of us to buy a less polluting car that gets better gas mileage? Car pool once in awhile? Or do a little recycling? Not in the name of climate change but in the spirit of being a better person.
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Old 09-08-2013, 20:12   #103
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Re: Climate Change

I need to retro fit my boat with an ice breaker now

Major Danish Daily Newspaper Warns: ‘Globe May Be On Path To Little Ice Age
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Old 09-08-2013, 20:21   #104
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Re: Climate Change

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Its very unfortunate there are attitudes like this , pollution is pollution , irrespective of anything to do with climate change. Te planet isn't here for humans to crap all over it.


"The whole issue is a scam! How arrogant to think the we (humans) have power over the Earth"

Sadly we do. We have fished out its seas , torn down its forests , polluted its waterways. Anyway who has sailed can see the damage done.

We are truely our own locusts.

To say the issue is a scam, is to dismiss , millions of man hours of dedicated scientific work, simply because you beleive your lifestyle might be affected , really ...

Dave
Dave

No one is saying to crap all over the planet. In fact from what I'm seeing things are much better now than when I was a kid. The waterways are cleaner, the air is cleaner and life is good! There was no recycling in my youth now whole towns and cities do it. It's a good thing as it saves money and resources which is good. Things like aqua culture allow fish to be farmed and natural stocks to start being replenished. IMO the world is not a glass that is half empty or heading for doom anytime soon. There are still some things that could make a big difference in regards to man's impact on the earth but, I am not hearing it from the environmentalist movement these days as global warming seems to be the only mantra these days.
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Old 09-08-2013, 20:27   #105
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Re: Climate Change

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He's also talking about the arrogance of people preaching from the alter of environmentalism. But, ya know maybe you right about being out of harmony with the nature of things. We meed to get aligned with nature and forget the glib. So what if some of the climate change scientist were fudging things and hiding their initial data from other scientists to check. They are are really doing it for or own good right? Yes back to nature. We need to unshackle our selves from all things manufactured to save our souls. Since you are so concerned and far far ahead on the issue you should go first. Let's start with your computer, followed by your car, and that bicycle is made of metal lot's of CO2 went into making that and about that IPAD and IPOD, cell phone has got to got to go too....
Ding, ding. Myth #2. "Climate gate" was debunked: PostPartisan - Surprise! 'Climategate' wasn't the scam skeptics claimed
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