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Old 18-02-2014, 04:19   #211
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Re: Australia approves dumping in Great Barrier reef

The poll is from Essential Research. What interest do they have in misrepresenting the opinions of Australians on the GBR dredging issue?

I dunno, the poll results in that paper generally pass the smell test for me. Hard to make a 66% disapproval rating up.

I do not agree with most Australians on other issues surveyed. On the car industry issue I say cut the cord! On the GM crop issue I say GM ag is good! Just because I don't agree doesn't make the poll results wrong,

Now if you just polled Aussie CFers, I am sure the result would be different!
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Old 18-02-2014, 04:59   #212
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Re: Australia approves dumping in Great Barrier reef

Well, what makes our subsidised car industry any less worthy than the subsidised (by their respective governments) brands imported here. They rent seek, our car makers have to rent seek too. All of them do it, the Germans, the Koreans..
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Old 18-02-2014, 05:06   #213
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Re: Australia approves dumping in Great Barrier reef

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The poll is from Essential Research. What interest do they have in misrepresenting the opinions of Australians on the GBR dredging issue?
Ah essential Research, a "research" company that exists to promulgate a particular political line, lets just put it this way, their clients are the ALP and Unions, nothing wrong with that - but again hardly unbiased. Their research is geared to their clients. Essential Research is in fact a subset of essential media.

You want to know how to get the polling answer you want, have a look at Yes Prime Minister "leading questions" episode, says it all really

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Old 18-02-2014, 05:57   #214
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Re: Australia approves dumping in Great Barrier reef

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... their clients are the ALP and Unions, nothing wrong with that - but again hardly unbiased. Their research is geared to their clients. Essential Research is in fact a subset of essential media.

You want to know how to get the polling answer you want, have a look at Yes Prime Minister "leading questions" episode, says it all really
Yes, Essential Media works for their clients, in this case: WWF-Australia and the Australian Marine Conservation Society.

Fight For The Reef
Essential Media Communications

However, I don’t see much leading bias in their question on Abbot Point.

Q. Do you approve or disapprove of the decision to allow expansion of the Abbot Point coal port in the Great Barrier Reef?
Results ➥ Essential Report

Interesting poll on Media Trust ➥ Trust in Australian media: Essential Research poll on media | Crikey
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Old 18-02-2014, 06:05   #215
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Re: Australia approves dumping in Great Barrier reef

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However, I don’t see much leading bias in their question on Abbot Point.

Q. Do you approve or disapprove of the decision to allow expansion of the Abbot Point coal port in the Great Barrier Reef?
Whereas i see a large bias, the question indicates to the person being polled that abbot point is in the great barrier reef, it is no more in the great barrier reef than your house Gord. It is however within the Great Barrier Reef Marine Park. Implicit in the question is the contention that Abbot Point is smack bang on top of THE REEF and that the REEF will be trampled over by the expansion of the facility, when in fact the nearest coral is a day's sail away
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Old 18-02-2014, 06:10   #216
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Re: Australia approves dumping in Great Barrier reef

Great discussion fellas. Time for me to head back to the sailing threads.

Thanks to everyone for keeping it thought provoking but respectful. A good reflection on Australians I think.
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Old 18-02-2014, 06:37   #217
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Re: Australia approves dumping in Great Barrier reef

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Whereas i see a large bias, the question indicates to the person being polled that abbot point is in the great barrier reef ...
I see your point.
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Old 18-02-2014, 19:11   #218
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Re: Australia approves dumping in Great Barrier reef

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At the end of the day the the dredging will take place. The scare mongers will move on to another perceived issue, exaggerate and misrepresent the facts, hoodwink the gullible folks who consider themselves conservationists. But who rely completely on the very prossess they protest.

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Exactly - the conservationist protest movement is now an industry in its own right providing jobs for 1000's. Been watching the "professional activists" set up camp here in the south west for their campaign against the shark drum lines for the last few weeks. Been enlightening. Many were up at james price point to stop the gas hub. Its a career these days.

Onto the next protest please....
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Old 18-02-2014, 19:40   #219
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Re: Australia approves dumping in Great Barrier reef

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Exactly - the conservationist protest movement is now an industry in its own right providing jobs for 1000's. Been watching the "professional activists" set up camp here in the south west for their campaign against the shark drum lines for the last few weeks. Been enlightening. Many were up at james price point to stop the gas hub. Its a career these days.

Onto the next protest please....

Yep, but without those protesters and people willing to challenge industry, your rivers would be burning just like the Cuyahoga did in Ohio, U.S, and so many other rivers where the fish are inedible due to heavy metals and PCBs. Onto the next protest...
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Old 18-02-2014, 19:51   #220
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Re: Australia approves dumping in Great Barrier reef

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Yep, but without those protesters and people willing to challenge industry, your rivers would be burning just like the Cuyahoga did in Ohio, U.S, and so many other rivers where the fish are inedible due to heavy metals and PCBs. Onto the next protest...
Sorry maybe not made myself clear - yes there are useful protests as you mention but there are also increasingly more and more sensationalised protests that exist for little more than to provide an income and something to do for the "professional activists"

Looking into how these guys here in the southwest now are funded has been enlightening as i said.
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Old 18-02-2014, 21:43   #221
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Re: Australia approves dumping in Great Barrier reef

To Barra, Last time I checked there was no money in beeing green, any discussion by Climate change deniers stating that anybody who has a tinge of green is a "professional activists" and statements like “the conservationist protest movement is now an industry in its own right providing jobs for 1000's”. is a bit rich when you compare that against the vested interest of people who want to make a fast buck off the environment where ever they can.
Look I think this dumping battle is not worth the fight, trouble is we are a gradual slope and its all downhill towards habitat destruction and we got Buckleys chance of getting a emotional handle that’ll sway general public, till its too late. Mean while please refrain from sticking the boots in/misrepresenting what is happening in the broader world.
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Old 18-02-2014, 21:49   #222
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Re: Australia approves dumping in Great Barrier reef

Perhaps also the tarnishing of all the folks that do not agree with the climate change proponents as "deniers" should stop also. Those who do not particularly believe, or even care, do not start threads about their views and try and push it on others.

If it's fair for one side it is fair for the other.

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Old 18-02-2014, 21:54   #223
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Re: Australia approves dumping in Great Barrier reef

Gee Coops that was quick, thought I may be pushing limits but thought also this thread had a special dispensation. Still its been good, I think we are sorta muddling to get concensus.
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Old 18-02-2014, 22:09   #224
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Re: Australia approves dumping in Great Barrier reef

No threads have special dispensations, except the joke thread which does allow some profanity if it is part of the joke.

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Old 18-02-2014, 22:30   #225
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Re: Australia approves dumping in Great Barrier reef

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To Barra, Last time I checked there was no money in beeing green, any discussion by Climate change deniers stating that anybody who has a tinge of green is a "professional activists" and statements like “the conservationist protest movement is now an industry in its own right providing jobs for 1000's”. is a bit rich when you compare that against the vested interest of people who want to make a fast buck off the environment where ever they can.
Look I think this dumping battle is not worth the fight, trouble is we are a gradual slope and its all downhill towards habitat destruction and we got Buckleys chance of getting a emotional handle that’ll sway people like you, till its too late. Mean while please refrain from sticking the boots in/misrepresenting what is happening in the broader world.
Sorry mate but im not a climate change denier??? (why does anyone who does not automatically and unthinkingly bow down to the latest green issue get labelled this???)

In fact until recently i worked in renewable energy where I came face to face with a tonne of fast buck merchants hiding behind the cloak of doing something for global warming.

In your book they might be climate change heroes but from the inside of that industry its really little different to mining in terms of mistruths and opportunism (though far less regulated)
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