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Old 02-02-2007, 11:36   #31
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Originally Posted by Joli
Whats wrong with a 33 year old boat? It's easy to upgrade systems and if the boat is well built it'll last a long time.
Um... nothing???

Mine's 20 yrs old. It's solid and a fine boat I expect to last until I can't use it anymore. Much the same as yours.

The point is, I read John's post regarding what was going on 30 years ago and what was going on today. He talks about how in the past, the 30 footers were quite expensive to the average people, then points out that today, you can buy a 50' boat with a year's salary, illustrating that we have more access to boats... espeically bigger ones.

I found it amusing that the 50' boat you can buy today on an annual American salary is actually from the historical time period he describes in the "early days" part of his post. Meaning... that the new 30 footer people bought in the days of yore with a year's salary is comparable to a new 30 footer today that also costs a year's salary. Maybe the people of yore could have also bought a 30 year old 50 footer as an option?

Interesting, no?

Why so sensitive about your boat's age?

There's a lightship nearby to me that has been in service since 1890 or so. It's not doing much these days, but it's far more sea worthy than my boat, your boat, or probably anyone else's on this forum. So no... age has little bearing on boats at all in my opinion. It's how they are originally built and then maintained.
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Old 02-02-2007, 13:11   #32
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Originally Posted by ssullivan
is from the time period 30 years ago you mention. ha ha ha
I'm not sensitive about the age of Joli, if anything I'm proud of it, she has character. She's sailed through huricanes, raced in the Med, raced in the Pacific to Hawaii, raced on the Great Lakes, and cruised the Carribean and South America. Her sisterships are still winning major regattas around the world.

She's a better built boat then those produced today unless you buy an Oyster, Swan, or Hinkley.

Your comment was about buying a 30 year old boat, I responded.



Serious thread drift. Sorry
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Old 02-02-2007, 13:42   #33
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Dave-
"I guess that Fire, Police and Ambulance being on land is provided for all folk, whereas those at sea CHOOSE to go." One could say that those who CHOOSE to live in crowded urban quarters, have made a choice equal to that of going to sea.
In the 1600's and 1700's, no one "had" to live in the city. But if one chose to, one was exposed to great risk from fire, and unless one paid for a fire patrol (fire insurance) one's home simply burned down when the neighbor's did. The situation with common hazards from fire, outright piracy and extortion from responding companies, eventually led to the establishment of modern municipal fire departments. Funded by the tax payers, for the protection of all, even if you don't want to buy into it.
Of course, the great fires in Rome, London, New York (two of them), Chicago, and San Francisco all helped to make public fire departments a "must have" thing. And along with fire departments--fire codes, banning wood construction in the great cities, specifying electrical codes, and so on.
There's no reason to expect "public" response and funding at sea to be any different, really. If the expense becomes burdensome, the response will be regulation as it has been for city fire matters. Fortunately, mariners haven't demanded a great enough expense on rescue affairs so as to perturb the general tax base and bring in massive regulatory "solutions". At least, not commonly, not yet.
To some extent there is an unspoken policy behind this. If fools go out and drown themselves, that's all well and good from the "rescuers'" point of view. And if there are sometimes unneccessary rescues launched because of those fools, that's also not only tolerable, but to a certain extent beneficial, because it provides ongoing training missions for the responders.
People will (and here in the US certainly have) say "But a helo flight costs $10,000 per hour and this last mission wasted $100,000!" and what no one says very loudly, is that the pilots and everyone else need so many hours per month to maintain their training. Whether they spend those hours chasing fools or flying pure exercises, the hours still have to be spent, the investment still made. So as long as there's some balance...even the fools serve a purpose. (Especially if the evening Nooze footage shows others how dangerous the sea is, and keeps them off it.)
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Old 02-02-2007, 14:13   #34
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Off topic but I think that big C&C is GORGEOUS
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Old 05-02-2007, 17:39   #35
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Joli - the lines on that boat are beautiful!
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Old 05-02-2007, 18:46   #36
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Thank you for the compliments, we think she's pretty also.

The point I was trying to make with Sean is that there are good buys out there. Engines can be replaced, sails and rigging can be upgraded, and Awlgrip is some pretty awsome stuff. You can usually buy an older quality boat for about what it sold for when new.

The upgrade cost will be a percentage of new and can be as much as 10% to 20% of new replacement. We are currently at 7% and may yet install new chain plates and rigging ( ~1%) prior to leaving for a cruise. The sparmaker says we are good to go so we'll decide later. If anyone wants the list of upgrades I'll post that seperate.

Remember you are buying replacement items in todays dollars. Just because you find a deal on an older hull don't think your gonna get by cheap on replacement parts or labor. Always look at the cost of new parts on a similar size boat to get a real idea of what your total fitted cost will be. Go get bids for engines, rigging, sails, hull and deck paint, and any other areas you think you'll need to fix (electrical, pumps, cushions, batteries, instruments, ,,,). Add it all up, you'll be close to a total refit cost then. Chances are you'll still be way way under the price of a new comparable boat.

Anyway, lots of good quality boats to be found but also lots of junk to avoid.

OK, back to the thread, sorry about the drift.
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Old 05-02-2007, 19:49   #37
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you can buy a 50' boat with a year's salary,
You have to be Kidding me!! Please! you are kidding me right?!?!?
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Old 05-02-2007, 21:28   #38
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Oh Wheels, didn't folks in NZ ever hear the saying "Making your age" ? Not so long ago, "making your age" meant you were well paid. Amazing how things change.
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Old 05-02-2007, 22:05   #39
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"you can buy a 50' boat with a year's salary, ".......................maybe a ferro boat................!!
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Old 06-02-2007, 03:14   #40
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I recently read the exploits of an English sailor who came to Ft Lauderdale and bought an older Gulfstar 50. He was stunned by the number of boats for sail very cheap in the US. He did a quick refit in Florida and sailed it home alone. When I have time I'll try to find the link.

Yea, you can buy a used 50 for a years salary in the US.
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Old 06-02-2007, 03:40   #41
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Some Gulfstar 50 prices (USD): Gulfstar Boats For Sale
ie:
$79,000: Gulfstar CC 1976 Boat For Sale
$255,788: Gulfstar 50 1980 Boat For Sale
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Old 06-02-2007, 04:40   #42
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Originally Posted by Joli
I recently read the exploits of an English sailor who came to Ft Lauderdale and bought an older Gulfstar 50. He was stunned by the number of boats for sail very cheap in the US. He did a quick refit in Florida and sailed it home alone. When I have time I'll try to find the link.
Part of me wishes I had found this website a couple of years ago, I had done more research on the US S/h market, the exchange rate had been USD2 to the 1 back then..........and I hadn't been on holiday quite so long............

But I still fancy one of these:-




YachtWorld.com Boats and Yachts for Sale


Albeit it is impractical for me for the forseable future, plus I would have to keep her in a Marina (!!).........would have to take "a knock" on the Seadog and would probably have to come up with a "work around" on import / the tax issues, instead of cash..........doesn't stop me thinking / dreaming though!
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Old 06-02-2007, 04:43   #43
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Originally Posted by GordMay
Some Gulfstar 50 prices (USD): Gulfstar Boats For Sale
ie:
$79,000: Gulfstar CC 1976 Boat For Sale
$255,788: Gulfstar 50 1980 Boat For Sale
One of these would mean I had robbed a bank during the year...........
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Old 06-02-2007, 07:13   #44
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Originally Posted by Alan Wheeler
You have to be Kidding me!! Please! you are kidding me right?!?!?
Sorry Wheels... didn't visit this thread until just now. While going along with what people were saying on this thread, I did not assert a couple of realities they probably missed. I have asserted them in other threads, but:

Males, 25 yrs of age or older have a median income of $39,403 in the USA. This is before taxes are taken out, which average 25% in some states, to 33% in others.

Image:American Income.png - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So, no.. it is not even close to possible to buy one on an American yearly median income. We are talking about an income that only the top 20-25% of all wager earners make in order to buy this 50 footer from the 70's. Don't despair. I looked at your photo gallery recently. Noticed your anchorages. Those are priceless!
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Old 06-02-2007, 11:32   #45
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Pheww!. I was really stunned for a moment. You US folks were about to lose all respect from me as far as bleeding hearts about costs of boating equipment goes. :-) :-)

It bugs me the way the Medium is reached. We have a small handlful of CEO's in the country that earn unrealistic amounts of money for there jobs. A few in the millions a year. When you set that against the rest of the country, our medium wage is unrealisticly offset. Although I would say about on par with you guy's. Many are lower ofcourse. It depends where you live. Aucklan will have higher wages, but higher living expenses, Christchurch will have lower wages and lower living expenses, here in Blenheim we have low wages and high living expenses, but that is the price you pay to live in the place you love. Freight is what lifts living expenses here in NZ.
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