Who "Owns" What?

[svHyLyte]

Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate

Two situations, in the first, a CF member receives a PM (Private Message). Said member cuts and pastes parts of the post onto an ongoing thread. Original writer complains that he or she has been mistreated by the sharing of the material. So, who owns that intellectual property, the one who gave it, the one who received it, or both, to do with as they please?

Second one. Someone goes to a great deal of effort to take a picture of their boat to give the pic to their partner for a birthday present. Said pic is printed and placed on the bulkhead. Which one gets to use it for their avatar? The one who took it? The one who thought it was a gift? or????

Please add your reasons which underlie your opinion.

Thanks,

Ann

As to the first question, the answer depends upon the circumstances, content, and intentions/sentiments of the author/sender. If I were the recipient of such a communique, at the least I would inform the sender of my wish to "publish" some or all of his/her comments with or without attribution as he/she might prefer, unless he/she objects. However, the content of the communication might, in and of itself, dictate whether it is something meriting publication with or without the author's approval. As a practical matter, IMHO one should not use a public medium such as a forum--even back channels--as a vehicle for the expression of anything one would not want made generally available/known.

As to the second matter, each has ownership vis-a-vis "community property", eh? The most simple solution is a "mirror image" avatar such as the following:

[Reefmagnet]

For case #1, even though the author of the document technically has copyright the reality is that any electronically transmitted document can end up in the possession of unintended recipients whether by accident or malice. There's literally zillions of examples "out there" on the internet of exactly this. You might have legal rights, but they can be extremely difficult to enforce.

For case #2, take a picture of the framed picture and put that in your avatar!

Sent from my SGP521 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[boatman61]

Cutting and pasting a part of a PM to a post.. No Problem.. adding the Identity of the person is a whole different ballgame.. its a matter of trust.
If the PM'er wanted his view aired publicly he would have posted on the 'Board'... not in a private message.. a violation of Trust 'I' would always remember
As for the picture...
That's easy.. one use's the Positive.. the other the Negative image.. same boat but point in opposite directions.. kinda like the sexes...

[sailorboy1]

bunch of PMs being readied to send :-)

[unclemack]

Hi Ann,

seen only 3 pictures of your boat - the one on this post, another that's on your profile page and a third on Jim's.

The ones on both your profile pages are much less interesting graphically than the one on your posts here so I guess this is the one?

My decision is that if you can't agree to share, then whoever wins agrees that the other has the right to choose from all future pix, even if shot by someone like, say, Coop's wife.

It was arbitration you wanted was it? I expect you'd heard that Solomonic judgement was my speciality...

[scuba0_1]

I always got with the thought that everyone has that person they believe won't tell or
show any one. That's why your sharing it with who you are right. I remember a while back there were 2 members having a issue and one sent not nice pm and those were listed on the discussion and no one seemed to mind that. Always assume there going to show some one. As far as the pic do what you want with it.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

bunch of PMs being readied to send :-)

Just me again...?? or are you spreading the net...

[Celestialsailor]

In my experience, the answer is to realize the human condition. That no matter how well you know someone, they operate by the rules of being sometime irrational humans. Sometimes the biggest mistake we can make is thinking our friends are perfect and would never cross lines. Just the same way we believe that our personal loved ones, be it family or partners will never hurt us.
Truly, if I don't want my laundry hung out on the line, I keep things to myself. Inversely, I don't want to know what my ex's are up to and when that line is crossed too many times, I eliminate the source from my life.
As far as pictures, probably open game these days with all the social media going on nowadays.

[sailorboy1]

Well I just received this PM

" "

It will go nameless.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

Well I just received this PM

" "

It will go nameless.

See...!!
Someone... somewhere... does like ya...


Even if you do own a Hunter..

[scgilligan]

Originally Posted by 44'cruisingcat

IMO if someone sends me a letter I own it. It's in MY mailbox.


Same with a message. It's in MY inbox. I own it.

I think there are differences when the communication is electronic. Not the same situation, but when you use work email that ownership goes to the company for which you work. So, theoretically I would think that CF owns your inbox and everything in it if they chose to pursue it in that way..Same goes with your posts on any forum, you have put them in public realm, and also on someone else's server..no ownership there.
Again, I am no lawyer, just my thoughts..

Also, in the USA you don't own your mailbox. You purchase it and install it, then ownership is transferred to the US postal service..that is why it is a federal offense to steal mail from someone's mailbox.

[carstenb]

Ann

cse 1 - My thoughts go with a PM is private and shouldn't be aired. others have noted, quoting a PM without including any information identifying the author is probably OK although I wouldn't do it. In legal terms, Dockhead is a lawyer and I epect he can give you an excellent rundown the exact legal conditions that apply.
Regarding pictures and prose - well I a paid author/photographer so I've actually read up on this.

Copyright belongs to the artist/creator. NO reproductions allowed, except for personal use without permission (so you can photocopy an article from a magazine because you to keep it - but you can't sell the copy or spread it around)

Pics are the same. If you recieve a pic - you can use it but not to make copies etc. Unless you have purchased the "negative" (in olden times this meant you had purchased the copyright) If the photografer gives you the negative then they have also given you the copyright

The artist - because he owns the image can do whatever he wants with it.

This is the reason why you can't just shop pics on google if you are writing commercially - you need to get permission from the artist.

[hamburking]

Here is the rule I learned, and teach my kids:

"Never put anything on the internet you wouldn't want to see on the front page of the newspaper!"

There are no secrets on the internet. If its sensitive or private, just don't say it.

[Windsurfer]

#1. As a general rule, never write anything in an electronic message that you wouldn't want printed on the front page of the NY Times. Accordingly, everyone assumes if it's on their screen they can use it as they please. Poor behavior by the re-poster, nothing more unless the re-posting injured the OP, e.g., false light, slander.

#2. As noted by others, by definition a gift conveys all right and title, free of encumbrances, with donative intent (no intent to take it back or have any interest in it). Otherwise, it's not a true gift. Suggest asking Santa for another picture for Christmas.

[Rustic Charm]

What's Jim think?

Carstonb seems to have summed it up.

Forwarding on letters/posts/emails, intended to be 'private' without consent is a no no in my book. Though, that consent is not needed in my book if the person was being abusive, threatening, bullying or in any other way doing the wrong thing.

Using ANY picture as an avatar, regardless of copy right is pretty normal and acceptable in my book. Profiting from it, is another thing.