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Old 05-04-2010, 14:40   #46
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Hey Imagine2Frollic and Dennis,

Thanks guys!
Hey Imagine....he says "real" sailboat cuz monohull sailors like to be the kings of the water in my experience. I have raced monohulls (from 30'-mainly a 50' racing sloop) over the past ten years...I find they like to think the only "real" sailing comes from sailing a monohull (oh and a Hunter is not a sailboat only a floating condo as some of my jerky pals say). I'm with ya and hear ya!
Hey can you tell you Imagine2f....you have a rather large Cat, is her beam over 20' and assuming I can afford her, would you say it is hard to find a slip in the Sarasota (more popular FL desitinations) than if I went with a 14'beamed Gemini? Have you been on a Gemini and how would you compare their differences?
Thanks!

Dennis - thank you for the copying and pasting the laws. I see what you are trying to convey is that by law a marina cannot kick you out if you still have a primary residence on land. Would you be so bold to say for 4 months a year you stay on your boat 27 days out of the year at the marina (say I am stuck in a marina for a few months) would be OK per this law? I've gone to a main marina's website in Sarasota and they say no more than 5 consecutive days on a boat per month - that;s nuts! Would you say if you showed them this law their rules could be challenged?

Thanks guys!
Cherise
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Old 06-04-2010, 11:06   #47
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Cherise,

As far as ANCHORING goes, the state of Florida owns the ground. You can read and/or download the changes to Florida statute Chapter 327 made on October 1, 2009 here: http://www.boatus.com/gov/GA005FLAnchoring.pdf
- The key here is that you are anchoring on state ground and they loosened up the Florda state statute on how they define a live-aboard.

I don't have my Chapman's Piloting book with me here at work, but someone could probably find the reference to "5 consecutive days." I seem to recall that this was the Federal definition of liveaboard and may no longer be the case with the revisions. It defined a liveaboard as someone who spends x number of consecutive days in a week or x number of days in a month. Does someone have a reference to this and does it still apply?

Now, the marinas "rent" the land under the water from the state. You are not anchoring at the marina, but rather are moored to their dock. This is not the same thing as anchoring. I don't know the law on this, but I believe that marinas can accept tennants as they see fit and are under no obligation to keep you for any reason. Moreover, insurance for the marina to keep live-aboards is much more costly so the incentive for marinas is to kick out live-aboards (aside from the benefits that many of us know - extra eyes on the dock, extra hands for new boats arriving, good community, etc.). Stating that you are a live-aboard is not to your advantage. Recall that if you use your vessel for navigation, regardless of how infrequently, then by Florida state definition you are not a liveaboard.

Now, it is possible that you simply spend a lot of time on your boat, but it's not your primary residence? You'll have to decide your situation and what is right for you. If the marina is dead-set on enforcing a strict no-live-aboard policy, then you don't want to find yourself suddently evicted looking for a place to anchor and live. If they have the right to decide who stays and who goes for any reason, then you can't strong arm them regardless of the statute. You really want to find a marina that welcomes, or, at least, tolerates live-aboards. You can certainly ask them nicely if they would allow you to stay given your specific situation, but you'll have to rely on your powers of persuasion and not the law. If they are prohibited by their insurance from having live-aboards, then pointing out the new law may help you if they are willing to take on the risk of making the case to their insurance carrier in the event of a claim. Remember, it's their necks on the line, not your money. From what I understand, running a marina is not a highly lucrative business so it's understandable that they are cautious.
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Old 07-04-2010, 16:29   #48
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Originally Posted by jackiepitts View Post
For those of you who use AC during the summer in a marina I was wondering if you pay for electricity by the kilowatt? If so what is the rate per KW and what is your average usage during the summer months? I would like to figure the cost of AC into the budget but not sure what is the typical cost.
Thanks,
Jackie
Well, I don't see the bill but JEA does base the bill on KWH. Here is the info on their commercial rates from their website:

JEA Commercial Electric Rates General Service COM 20Rate:The charge per month shall consist of the total of the customer, energy, and fuel charges as follows:
Customer Charge $ 8.80 /month
Energy Charge 5.536 /kWh
Fuel Charge 4.416 /kWh

General Service Demand COM 30Rate:The charge per month shall consist of the total of the customer, demand, energy, and fuel charges as follows:
Customer Charge $ 80 /month
Demand Charge $ 7.97 /kW
Energy Charge 2.916 /kWh
Fuel Charge 4.416 /kWh

General Service Large Demand IND 40 </SPAN>Rate: The charge per month shall consist of the total of the customer, demand, excess kVar, energy and fuel charges as follows:
Customer Charge $ 315/month
Demand Charge $ 11.47 /kW
Energy Charge 2.204 /kWh
Fuel Charge 4.416 /kWh
Excess kVar Charge $11.47 per kVar


JEA also offers Multiple Account Riders and Time Of Day Rates. For more information call us at 904-665-6250 or email us at solutions@jea.com

Four years ago my electric bill on the boat was just over $30, but now it's more like $40 plus. I'm away all day at work, but I crank up the heat or A/C when I get home and stay comfortable !! My Cruisair water-cooled reverse cycle has done great over almost a half decade so I'm quick to recommend it for use at the dock. You'll need a hefty generator to use it cruising though ... That's my use, but folks who are at the dock all day run a bill into the hundreds ...
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Old 07-04-2010, 19:32   #49
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we liveaboard in SW Florida and we pay a flat electric rate of $35 per month
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Old 07-04-2010, 20:13   #50
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Standard charges here in Mexico at the marinas for electric is 22 cents per KWH which seems to be quite a bit higher than in Florida. If we were to run 2kw a hour for only 12 hours a day the monthly charge would be around $158 a month...ouch!
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Old 08-04-2010, 00:20   #51
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WOW you have gotten a lot of great advise here...

One thing I would like to add is you may want to consider grooming your dog for the warmer weather.
I know collies have that long beautiful fur but in the summer you know it has to get hot for them, not to mention the shedding. If you keep her hair trimmed it's more comfortable on her and less hair in the boat to pick up.
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Old 08-04-2010, 06:41   #52
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Imagine is 23'3" on her beam, but she is easy to maneuver.......i2f
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Old 10-04-2010, 09:28   #53
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Cherise,

We both love dogs but don't have one and will avoid the temptation to get one! We see lots of people with dogs aboard because the had the dog and certainly were not going to give up the dog to go cruising. No question it causes them some problems and limits where they can go. Too much for us so we just get to pet and hug their dogs and they get to take the dog ashore in the rain or high winds while we watch from the comfort of our boat! <BIG GRIN>
Our we talking about dogs in general or just nautically impaired canines?



Real sea dogs don't need shore leave!



We may need to discuss this, Zorro (Aythya crew)
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Old 11-04-2010, 07:56   #54
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Standard charges here in Mexico at the marinas for electric is 22 cents per KWH which seems to be quite a bit higher than in Florida. If we were to run 2kw a hour for only 12 hours a day the monthly charge would be around $158 a month...ouch!
That is extremely high! Up here in Weehawken (just on across the river from NYC) it's 35 cents and people were screaming about it.

Better option is to eliminate as many of the toys as you can, convert everything to LED, and take what you would have paid in just a few months to add/upgrade the solar...maybe even a wind genny.
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Old 02-05-2010, 16:20   #55
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Hey Tropic Cat.....sailing friends don't suggest Cat's because, well it's different, but they say mainly for sailing issues, such as in light winds when it is hard to tack or jibe in light winds and that can be dangerous.
Forgive my purloined response... I've been busy...

When you buy a boat, you learn how to sail her ... Cats are no different. Your mono friends are referencing the fact that cats don't have those tons of lead their boats have in our keels. Upon tacking, all that lead creates momentum which glides a mono through a tack. On Cats, you develop different techniques which in the end perform the same.

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Also, what kind of cat do you have?
I sail a Catalac Catamaran. Click on the link in my signature to learn about these boats.
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It seems cat's are made to in teh 14'-15' beam and then jump to 18'-22'.
Why is that?
Over time, catamaran design gravitated towards a 2 to 1 ratio (length to beam) as a good compromise between safety and performance.

The bigger the boat, the beamier she will be. Slips in my part of the world are at least 15 feet wide. Most marinas have larger slips to accommodate larger boats. Especially Sport fisher type power boats. It is very probable to locate marinas that can handle a cruising catamaran, however, wider than 15', there's a chance the slip will cost more.
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Old 23-07-2010, 13:16   #56
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I've been living aboard two months now and cruising both coasts and the keys. I agree that the east coast is cooler, between the cooler water and stronger breezes. That being said, the time I spent in Napels, Ft. Myers, Sanibel....during the day ( I was both anchored out and at a dock), while under the bimini, and staying hydrated, I was fine, then again, I was in a t-shirt and shorts...not working per se. My problem was the lack of breeze in the evening....it got so hot, I put my mattress in the cockpit and put up my mosquito netting over it. I've adjusted pretty well to no A/C...but have not been able to give up cold drinks, so I am still supporting the South FL Ice industry! lol
I say, go for it! You can do it and adapt to the challenges!!!
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Old 23-07-2010, 16:05   #57
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It's been 90+ for 6 weeks here on the Chesapeake and many, perhaps most of them, have been 95+ (tomorrow will be 101F), so I think if heat is a concern, it's probably too hot to liveaboard anywhere.
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Old 23-07-2010, 20:48   #58
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It's been 90+ for 6 weeks here on the Chesapeake and many, perhaps most of them, have been 95+ (tomorrow will be 101F), so I think if heat is a concern, it's probably too hot to liveaboard anywhere.
I second that, its been in the 90s in the Greek islands , but we have the wind most of the time and that helps a lot
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Old 24-07-2010, 03:15   #59
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It's hot as h*ll in Sarasota on land, but on the water it's not all that bad. I've spent a lot of time sailing in those waters. The boat had aircon, but no generator, so we could only use it in marinas. We spent 90% of the time at anchor, so the A/C mostly went unused, but we did not feel oppressed. I think with an awning you might be comfortable enough.

If you decide to air condition, you can put in a first-rate Cruisair or similar system for probably something like $8k to $12k depending on how you spec it.

But as someone said, you need power for it. If you plan to live in marinas all the time then there will be no problem, but if you want to use the A/C at anchor then you will need a generator, which is another $10k to $15k depending, again, on how you spec it.
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Old 04-08-2010, 06:52   #60
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One thing I would like to add is you may want to consider grooming your dog for the warmer weather.
I know collies have that long beautiful fur but in the summer you know it has to get hot for them, not to mention the shedding. If you keep her hair trimmed it's more comfortable on her and less hair in the boat to pick up.
I've been told many a time we should shave our collieX in the summer heat. So we had her shaved.

Then people told us we shouldn't shave her, it's her protection from the sun, and insulation against too much heat. SO I stopped shaving her.

Then people told us we should shave her. SO I checked online, and it turns out, she's because a collie, we shouldn't shave her!! A good grooming will do the trick.

It depends on the type of dog you have - but if you don't normally have to cut her hair, then you probably shouldn't have to just because of the heat.
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