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Old 28-04-2012, 14:24   #121
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Re: Rules & Etiquette for Visitors Aboard Your Boat

So are we talking about taking friends or chartering. Eight pages is OK maybe if we are a commercial charter, but not for friends in my opinion. Friends I decide who will be on board and we communicate about what is needed, commercial I guess you do need to have eveything written down and agreed too.
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Old 28-04-2012, 14:42   #122
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Re: Rules & Etiquette for Visitors Aboard Your Boat

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Originally Posted by Tom Hildebrandt View Post
After ten years and more than 80 guests, crew and family, I have a 8 page summation of what I expect.
Nice, can you post/attach a copy of it, I'd be very interested.
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Old 28-04-2012, 15:46   #123
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Re: Rules & Etiquette for Visitors Aboard Your Boat

I will try to keep this response brief, regardless of how difficult this is for those who are as loquacious as I,

The set of protocols is not given to dinner guests or folks out for a day sail, I thought I had mentioned that in my prior dissertation. But someone hoping to spend 24 hours or more on Juno, I expect them to spend the 10-20 minutes, or an hour if you have a lower level of education, to read the protocols. It saves me a lot of time in the walkarounds. It also sets the standard for expectations. I expect guests/crew and family to assist in sailing and operating Juno, if they just wish to be eye candy or have a margerita trip, fine, that is a day trip thing. Otherwise, read the protocols, and if you have questions, ask. If you do not agree with how I operate my boat, fine, we can have a beer and agree like adults that it won't work. And off you go to your next adventure. And Juno and I go on with our adventure. No big deal!

I will confide that this exodus happens more often than one might think, but in roughly 10% of the prospective guests/crew/family decide that their expectations about the trip would not be met. This vary rarely happens the first day, but some where in the second day or so everyone sort of realizes it is just not going to work. As adults, we talk about it and have a beer and go our separate ways.

Still not a single one has said to me the writing/reading of the protocols was a bad thing. They have said that they did not like various bits of the rules.


Remember, the protocols set the minimum level of expectation for those who may be complete strangers, from varied cultural backgrounds, whom I may be living with for one month or more.

Each of you can operate your boat as you see fit, that does not bother me, this is just what has worked for me.

The protocols do not discuss per diem or reimbursement. That is covered separately in the discussions prior to the folks arriving on board. There is no written contract.

Cheers to all

Tom

For those who are curious, I played very poorly at tennis today, it was still good fun and great exercise, but argggghhhh!
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Old 28-04-2012, 15:47   #124
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Re: Rules & Etiquette for Visitors Aboard Your Boat

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Originally Posted by Tom Hildebrandt View Post
After ten years and more than 80 guests, crew and family, I have a 8 page summation of what I expect.

At the beginning, I did not have such a set of protocols, but about the third time I was told, "you never told me that" I started keeping a list of such events. Juno's protocols evolved from that list, and include what behavior I expect on topics like watchstanding, safety, cleanliness, head use, tidiness (or as I put it, living in your own space) and etiquette ( it always amazes me that some folks need to be reminded that my boat is my home and that standing on the salon cushions is not acceptable, nor is lounging on said upholstery without a shirt irksome to those who have to clean sweat stains and sunscreen)

This set of protocols is given to everyone, ( fellow seamen who have circumnavigated, family members and the complete stranger who is a novice) if they are on board for more than a day trip, they read the protocols or at least tell me they have read them! Not one person has complained about me providing such a list. However, a few have complained about some of the protocals, if they did not accept my explanations, I politely suggest they find a boat that will meet their expectations.

Any person who comes on Juno for more than a daysail is expected to pay a per diem, with two exceptions. If it is a day sail, they bring food and drink for themselves and the skipper. The other exception is one reserved for us skippers operating solo, if I invite a lady to be a guest as a date, she does not have to contribute for the first week. Should the date develop beyond merely a casual adventure, and a longer, more permanent relationship is desired, the subject of contributions towards the operation of Juno is discussed. (Realistically, don't most people have such a discussion with someone with whom they plan sharing an residence?)

Each of us can manage these things as they wish, but this system has worked very well for me over the past 8 years.

Cheers

Tom
Hey Tom, you really made my day. I would say "Deutsche Gründlichkeit"

For my beloved guests I made the best investment ever: I bought an electric operated toilet. My guests love it, but i KNOW I love it more, never with my hands.................. again.

And please not give me money, the Admiral loves chocolate....

PS. For future guests, those big balls wrapped in gold..........

CeesH
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Old 28-04-2012, 15:58   #125
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Re: Rules & Etiquette for Visitors Aboard Your Boat

Ceesh, I now have a compost toilet, but have not yet had guest aboard since it was installed. However, I am hopeful that it will take a truly inspired and vindictive person to manage to mess this new system up!

I had to look up the expression "Deutsche Gründlichkeitve" but you are correct, my last name is Hildebrandt if that helps your analysis of my writing technique!

Where exactly are you in Brazil? I spent a delightful 6 months off Jacarre several years ago!

Tom
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Old 28-04-2012, 16:21   #126
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Re: Rules & Etiquette for Visitors Aboard Your Boat

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Ceesh, I now have a compost toilet, but have not yet had guest aboard since it was installed. However, I am hopeful that it will take a truly inspired and vindictive person to manage to mess this new system up!

I had to look up the expression "Deutsche Gründlichkeitve" but you are correct, my last name is Hildebrandt if that helps your analysis of my writing technique!

Where exactly are you in Brazil? I spent a delightful 6 months off Jacarre several years ago!

Tom
Hey Tom, my last name is also given by a far away German ancestor. Gives the jokes.

My location, Garmin claims is 002 27.8924 S 043 29.8097 W approx. 80 miles away from Sao Luis. The Admiral comes from this little island.

We are here for the last 15 month and planning a departure early next year.

CeesH
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Old 28-04-2012, 18:12   #127
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Re: Rules & Etiquette for Visitors Aboard Your Boat

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Funny, my wife and I just finished a Colgate sailing course off captiva island. I think the contract, waivers, and general instructions ran four pages.

I'm with the sailors who think of their boats like their houses. Next time Mom comes to dinner I'll present her a dossier of rules and a bill for her share of the evening's expenses (including a pro rata share of utilities of course) and see what she thinks.
If your mum is anything like my mum was she will smack you around the head and tell you to stop smoking that stuff.
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Old 28-04-2012, 18:25   #128
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Chill folks - I don't think Tom is inviting most of you onboard anyway . Well, at least not now....... as most of you are probably covered on Page 8 .

FWIW, on my boat Rule #927 says that any female who is over 18 and "fit" must dance naked around the mast. For me that rule is obvious - for others it has come as a surprise.......

....that possibly also something to do with Rule #928 - where I expect them to be showering me with dollar bills .

My boat. My rules .
Rile #1 - don't hog the pole...



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Rule #2 - dont forget the polka music.



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Old 28-04-2012, 18:36   #129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Hildebrandt
.

Still not a single one has said to me the writing/reading of the protocols was a bad thing. They have said that they did not like various bits of the rules.

Remember, the protocols set the minimum level of expectation for those who may be complete strangers, from varied cultural backgrounds, whom I may be living with for one month or more.

Each of you can operate your boat as you see fit, that does not bother me, this is just what has worked for me.

The protocols do not discuss per diem or reimbursement. That is covered separately in the discussions prior to the folks arriving on board. There is no written contract.

Cheers to all

Tom

For those who are curious, I played very poorly at tennis today, it was still good fun and great exercise, but argggghhhh!
Tom - live and let live. I hope you dont take offence at anything I posted. Your boat, your rules. I do not intend to attack your strategy but rather get the community discussing the appropriate levels of instruction.

A 10 minute briefing works for me on 1 day through 5 day charters, and of course there are rules. I just probably couldnt think of 8 pages of them.

Tennis was fun in the day. Wish I still had time...
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Old 28-04-2012, 18:47   #130
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Re: Rules & Etiquette for Visitors Aboard Your Boat

My drill is safety, head instruction and sailing instruction...sheet, halyard and tiller.

My guests do not pay for anything....if they want beer or booze, byob

Extended cruising requires addition instruction....I wouldn't insult my guest with a freaking list
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Old 28-04-2012, 20:38   #131
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Re: Rules & Etiquette for Visitors Aboard Your Boat

Rules? We don't need no stinking rules!
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Old 29-04-2012, 05:40   #132
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Re: Rules & Etiquette for Visitors Aboard Your Boat

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FWIW, on my boat Rule #927 says that any female who is over 18 and "fit" must dance naked around the mast. For me that rule is obvious - for others it has come as a surprise.......
Could you PM me the rest of your rules? I might not implement them, but reckon they'll make for a great laugh... (I would suggest you post them to share with everyone, but as a mod I have to protect our dear, gentle members )

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I gave away the scrambled egg hat for Christmas. I didn't fit my giant head and ego. I kept the double breasted blazer with anchor buttons...
Yeah, thanks for that. It has its uses:
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Old 29-04-2012, 06:03   #133
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Re: Rules & Etiquette for Visitors Aboard Your Boat

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Could you PM me the rest of your rules? I might not implement them, but reckon they'll make for a great laugh... (I would suggest you post them to share with everyone, but as a mod I have to protect our dear, gentle members :
See rule #925.......

#918 Smoking is compulsory - that's why God gave you a spare lung.
#919 An Extra beer ration if you set fire to a Penguin
#920 don't drink from the open beer can that has ash on top
#921 No brown stripes on the upholstery
#922 if in doubt, deny it
#923 If no one puts you in jail it never happened
#924 when you have Beer running out of your eyesockets, it's probably morning. and the Skipper is probably still thirsty. It's time to pour breakfast.
#925 Don't tell the Mods.
#926 no peeking at my webhistory, unless a) you are a butt naked fit female and b) are looking for ideas.........
#927 any female who is over 18 and "fit" must dance naked around the mast.
#928 naked dancing females must shower the Skipper with dollar bills


My boat. My rules .
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Old 29-04-2012, 07:22   #134
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Just a little defense of Don..I think having details you should know written down would be good. In fact I think getting a copy to them a day or two early would let them plan better for the trip. What clothing to bring, how watches work, etc. I assume some are rules and most are this is how it sailing is. I strongly support detailed instructions on head usage and clear rules on smoking. Please post your list and watch your back...
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Old 29-04-2012, 07:36   #135
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Re: Rules & Etiquette for Visitors Aboard Your Boat

My rules are simple -
1) show how to operate the head, and tell men to sit (not stand)
2) nothing goes into the head other than human waste and TP
3) you wear a PFD if you leave the cockpit (or at night, or of conditions otherwise warrant)
4) one hand for the boat, and general MOB instructions
5) don't park hands or body parts on the winches or in the way of the traveler
6) show them the ropes and teach them sailing if they have interest (and what's different about sailing a multihull if they have mono background)

Longer term guests get the following
7) VHF radio instructions and how to activate the MOB marker on the CP, location of flares (in case skipper goes OB)
8) how to short-shower and save fresh water
9) how to operate engine and drop sails

I don't have a list, except head operation instructions are printed in p-touch labels on the seat lid.
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