Preparation Classes/ Training for Liveaboards

[justakiss]

Greetings!
My wife and I will "shove off" in about 7 years to become full time liveaboards. We spend a lot of time planning our exit strategy, and an area we're currently working on is what type of classes, training, etc we should try and complete in advance.

Some ideas we've come up with are:
- medical/ offshore emergency
- marine systems (diesel, electric, fiberglass, plumbing, etc)
- advanced navigation techniques
- SCUBA

And to provide some better context, we plan on working full-time till about 6 months before we leave. Between rental income and a pension, we will have a decent amount of passive income coming in. We currently have a 1984 30' Catalina which is our 'practice' boat to keep up our knowledge and experience. We plan on keeping her before we 'upgrade' to a catamaran, which will be our future home. By the time 2024 rolls around, we will both be in our mid-50s. For the first few years, our plan is to stay primarily in the Caribbean and East Coast before considering a trans ocean passage.

We would greatly appreciate input on what type of classes, training, etc other's have done in preparation for becoming full time liveaboards. Even something you realized you should have done once underway, or ended up doing after you left.

Thanks

Dennis and Ann

[CatNewBee]

I think, the best preparation is to maintain and repair your good old boat yourselves, so you will have a lot of training in the next few years on all technical and maintenance issues.

to medical / offshore emergency: there are some good books out there especially for boaters and globetrotters that describe the contents of your "board pharmacy" needed for various regions, a good global healthcare insurance could also help, this books are greatly structured and give you for any circumstance good advice - also you can use your VHF / SSB / Sattelite phone to get medical advice remotely. Of course you can join medical college classes, but this would be to much. You can ask your doctor for advice and needed vaccines too (e.g. Malaria)...

Advance navigation techniques: there is GPS and you will have several on board + autopilot and / or a wind vane and should already know how to use them on the one hand and on the other the good old navigation techniques: hourglass, a log line, a compass, paper charts maybe a sextant and star navigation tables + a globe
Also some general ideas about golf stream and passat winds and global weather is a good help to reach the next continent just in case all technology breaks.

SCUBA PADI OWD is also a good idea, if you plan to dive deeper than with a snorkel.

And an advanced cooking course for pasta, rice and other food.

Some knowledge about edible fish and other monsters of the sea + what gear you might need for ocean fishing would be nice - so you can survive long passages.

Maybe a visit to a psych to get some advanced techniques to survive the uninterrupted presence of your partner alone all day and night on high sea without getting the urge to kill each other...

[justakiss]

Cat,
Thanks for the feedback!

I like the idea of cooking classes centered around foods we are most likely to find in the areas we are sailing. Same goes for learning about edible foods (land and marine). Learning to use alternative cooking methods would be handy too.

I love technology, but my years in scouting and the military have it ingrained in me that knowing how to use a map and compass is critical. I suggested to my wife we should consider a celestial navigation class, and I got the "wtf!?" look. Sometimes it's ok to be a Luddite.

Great idea about weather patterns, ocean currents, etc. I'll add that to our list.

Regarding your last comment, that's why we're getting a catamaran... we each get a hull...

Thanks!

[john61ct]

Consider buying your "final" boat (no such thing) well before the full-timing break comes.

Making it your own takes time, and lots easier to do at a civilized base with all the available resources.

And maybe save a lot of money taking your time looking for the right deal, be willing to take on some non-major fixer-upper stuff.

All of which also helping you gain more relevant hands-on experience with **that boat** long before traveling far from shore

[dwedeking2]

Depends on how you learn. For the most part I don't learn well in classes. I did do a live aboard 101, 103, 104 course in La Paz a few years back before I bought my first boat. I read a lot, so had read all the course materials years prior. I aced the written tests but was really there for the hands on training. I'd never sailed so the hands on stuff was really important.

The mechanical stuff I learn as I fix up my project boats. I can read the mechanic books (Nigel Cader's stuff) but it really doesn't stick for me until I fix something.

So for me the classes have less value which is why though I'm on the same schedule as you I've bought the boat now. Save a little on the upfront purchase price and get schooled by fixing it up.

[justakiss]

Originally Posted by john61ct

Consider buying your "final" boat (no such thing) well before the full-timing break comes.

Making it your own takes time, and lots easier to do at a civilized base with all the available resources.

And maybe save a lot of money taking your time looking for the right deal, be willing to take on some non-major fixer-upper stuff.

All of which also helping you gain more relevant hands-on experience with **that boat** long before traveling far from shore

John,
We plan on doing exactly that. Excellent point you make regarding knowing our boat long before we head out. We figure we have at least a year we can buy ahead of our departure. It'll allow us time to do a good shakeout cruise(s), learn the systems specific to our boat, along with her 'quirks'. The marina we're in now is great because of proximity to marine services and the DC metro area. If we do buy a year in advance, we may move up our timeline when we start renting the house since we could liveaboard at that time.

Thanks!

[justakiss]

Originally Posted by dwedeking2

Depends on how you learn. For the most part I don't learn well in classes. I did do a live aboard 101, 103, 104 course in La Paz a few years back before I bought my first boat. I read a lot, so had read all the course materials years prior. I aced the written tests but was really there for the hands on training. I'd never sailed so the hands on stuff was really important.

The mechanical stuff I learn as I fix up my project boats. I can read the mechanic books (Nigel Cader's stuff) but it really doesn't stick for me until I fix something.

So for me the classes have less value which is why thought I'm on the same schedule as you I've bought the boat now. Save a little on the upfront purchase price and get schooled by fixing it up.

Dwede,
Thanks for the tip about saving on the upfront purchase price. It's something we keep needing to remind ourselves about as a reality check. Sure we can afford the $xxx boat, but the $yyy boat gives us more flexibility. And something other than rice, beans and fish on our plate.

We're both hands-on and visual learners. YouTube has been a gift from the gods for us!

What did you learn from the liveaboard classes? Or are those the ASA sailing classes?

Congrats on already having your boat!

[dwedeking2]

It's was the physical feel of operating a larger boat. I had only been on small fishing skiffs so the "feel" of how much to turn a larger boat's wheel to point the right direction. You can read about how to tack all day long but until you know how it feels to tack... (as a simple example). So to have another person there to say "more" or "less" or "do it this way" was helpful. All of this was very basic stuff but since I had zero experience it really helped my confidence, especially around docks.

Yes it was the ASA courses.

I don't think I'm saving money overall, but it allowed me to get in sooner. When I'm done with the all the project items I'll be at probably the same cost as if I bought the same year / model at market costs. But, for me anyways, this allows me to fix all the stuff and that's how I learn.

[zeehag]

learn to sail. all follows easily after that.
oh yeah learn to be independent of others or services. includes electricity water, propane, everything.
learn to sail and how to handle a boat
practice what you have learned.
practice a lot

[SV THIRD DAY]

A good starting point would be Boat Show Seminars.
They are usually included for FREE with the cost of admission and the larger boat shows attract some very good and well known speakers on everything from Circumnavigating, to pressure cookers, to cruising gear. You can really learn quite a bit from the Boat Show Seminars.

Next....join the SSCA and take advantage of their Mentoring and Webinar education programs.

www.ssca.org

[belizesailor]

Do you just plan to liveaboard or go cruising?

If just liveaboard then developing maintenance skills will be most important. If cruising, which I would imply from your list, then add Marine Weather to your already good list.

Starpath has a VERY compreshensive on line marine weather class. Dont just buy the book by David Birch...sign up for the full on line course. ASA also offers a marine weather class (119) based on the StarPath class, but its not on line.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...CX5_1D0sarbkyg

[estarzinger]

Couple suggestions:

#1 actually make some passages as crew. It is way way different than any coastal sailing you might do, and you would learn a ton. There are structured school boats that do this like Mahina Expeditions - Offshore Cruising Instruction, Sailing Expeditions, Expedition Brochure (many others but John particularly is vastly experienced). Our you can hop on people's boats just as crew - there are various ways to organize that like https://www.sailopo.com/.

#2 It is some travel, but if you have vacation time for it, the RYA courses in england are (usually) vastly superior to the US ASA courses. When we were getting ready we took a 1 week and then a 2 week 'skipper course' along the south coast of england. They have serious weather and tides and traffic (which give you real challenges to encounter), they (Generally) take seamanship more seriously, and there are some quite lovely cruising/sailing locations there. We also took courses in the US and the Caribbean and got by far the most out of the UK RYA courses.

3. Yea, learning about weather is important. However quite honestly I am not aware of any really good 'cruising weather' courses. There are two (in the US) which get the most attention but I personally don't think the content is really very well suited to a practical cruising sailor - it is more met/desk/office oriented. My best advice here is read several books, and then get some weather tools you will use offshore on your computer (a grib viewer and a weather routing program like expedition or Adrena and real time reports from buoy weather, I would suggest). Then every single day, pretend you are at sea on a passage, look at the weather, try to predict what it will do, plan where you want to be tomorrow and over the next 5 days, then tomorrow do again looking at how things changed.

4. International Offshore Safety at Sea with Hands-on Training - this is another area where the US courses are less good than the international standard, but you can now get the international courses here (scroll down a bit) Safety at Sea Courses – United States Sailing Association. Again, I have some concern about the actual content of these courses - I personally dont feel they really focus on the right/best things - but they are better than nothing.

5. Languages - you will be going to foreign country's. It really really helps to be able to speak at least a little of their language. Given normal cruising destinations french is probably the most useful. But that might change depending on your intended route - some Spanish for instance is pretty much required for Chile.

6. You have to learn to maintain and repair your boat. It is just part of the life. So, right now, stop hiring people to work on your current boat. Start doing it all yourself. Get knowledgeable dock mates and friends, or par a pro to talk you thu a job but he does not touch a single tool, to help if you dont know something. Structured diesel course would be great but with the engine shop manual you can in fact do everything you need to do if you can read and be patient.

I will comment that almost no-one, no matter how they prepare, is actually prepared/ready/aware of what it is actually going to be like. It is just a whole different thing than any books or classes prepare you for.

[sy_gilana]

I would charter, or rent, or beg a cabin on a boat owned by a couple, who are long term cruisers, and spend minimum 2 weeks with them on board.

A million questions will be answered, or completely voided, and new ones arise. You will be well set to then know the answers to the questions you raised in your first post.

All of this invaluable learning will seep in over meals and relaxing, and during day to day life. The cost of the charter will be recovered in multiples by the savings you will make down the road.

Best of luck to ya!

[justakiss]

Originally Posted by zeehag

learn to sail. all follows easily after that.
oh yeah learn to be independent of others or services. includes electricity water, propane, everything.
learn to sail and how to handle a boat
practice what you have learned.
practice a lot

Thanks! We're able to get out to our boat most every other weekend. This summer has been mild on the Chesapeake and winds have kept up, so we've gotten lots more sailing opportunities.
Completely agree about becoming independent of other services.

[justakiss]

Originally Posted by SV THIRD DAY

A good starting point would be Boat Show Seminars.

They are usually included for FREE with the cost of admission and the larger boat shows attract some very good and well known speakers on everything from Circumnavigating, to pressure cookers, to cruising gear. You can really learn quite a bit from the Boat Show Seminars.



Next....join the SSCA and take advantage of their Mentoring and Webinar education programs.



www.ssca.org

We're going to the Annapolis Boat Show in less than a month and will check out the various seminars.
Thanks for the good tip about SSCA. we had heard about it through one of our dock neighbors, and will check it out as well.