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GothVanhellsing · 15-09-2013, 10:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by CatInHand

But the owner of the property pays rent. If you want to live somewhere without paying for the services you use, feel free, but do it away from the community. If you want to anchor in a harbor and be part of a community, that includes contributing to the functioning of the community. For most people that means financial contributions. My bf was able to extend his stay by volunteering. It just depends on if you are demanding something for free, or being part of the community.

I am the one guy who doesn't demand, anything other then to be treated like a decent human. Look up Milk jug flag some time. here in oriental I helped build it for the big crocker fest shindig the town has every year. I have supported many projects, and other things to help the community.

Boatguy30 · 15-09-2013, 10:48

Ok, we're straying a bit into 47% territory here, but lets just agree a certain amount of a tenants rent passes thru the landlords hands directly to the local taxing body. Someone on another forum suggested you shouldn't be allowed to vote if you didn't own property a week or so back.

goboatingnow · 15-09-2013, 10:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boatguy30

Someone on another forum suggested you shouldn't be allowed to vote if you didn't own property a week or so back.

Boy that would be a rich suggestions given the history of denying voters rights.

All I see here is begrudgers and the politics of envy.

Dave

CatInHand · 15-09-2013, 10:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by GothVanhellsing

I am the one guy who doesn't demand, anything other then to be treated like a decent human. Look up Milk jug flag some time. here in oriental I helped build it for the big crocker fest shindig the town has every year. I have supported many projects, and other things to help the community.

Then go to a town meeting and ask them what the problem is and how you can work together.

ShaktisBoy · 15-09-2013, 11:17

Why should he have to ask. The arrogance here never ceases to amaze me. He' not doing and hasn't done anything illegal. The town restricted access in favor of profit. In the process all of our collective rights were diminished. What part don't you guys get? Why should you have to ask my permission to visit for a day? A week? A month?
You shouldn't have to ask period. The water is a natural resource belonging to everybody. Don't misconstrue my meaning here. I think there should be a mechanism for removing abandoned derelict boats. But the minute you interfere with a lawful users access you have crossed a line. The town by selling the anchorage is to blame. You should be able to sell what doesn't belong to you. Oh and for Morgan. I'd be proud to have a neighbor like Goth here in Florida. Shame on you for not being proud to. Perhaps you think you are more worthy somehow?

svseachange · 15-09-2013, 11:18

So the town filled the harbor with an over priced marina and now is blaming three poor liveaboards for the lack of space in the harbor for cruisers?

Sounds like they killed the golden goose and are now using the OP is a convenient scapegoat.

Captain Bill · 15-09-2013, 11:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by GothVanhellsing

My Behavior? What when after 4 months of a smear campaign someone in this very small town finely politely asked if I would move and I agreed to move? How does that constitute bad behavior? If someone had thought of that really insane idea of asking me nicely 4 months ago my boat would have been moved back then. See a pattern there? I am not going to get into an argument that has me defaming EMT's Nurses or anyone else for that matter. You know there are other threads you can troll right?

I don't see what you mean by a smear campaign. I have been all over the Towndock web site and find only vague references to your boat. It would seem almost all of the coverage revolves around the french boat. Can you post specific links to pages where you were "smeared", because I couldn't find them. There were a few references to the other boats in some of the coverage of the french boat, but I saw nothing specifically mentioning you or your boat.

Wrong · 15-09-2013, 11:53

This whole debate has devolved into an effort to compare very different things to one another. Real estate is fixed, boats are mobile. Property owners during normal economic times enjoy a return on their investments. People who's homes are boats enjoy no such return but are still assessed taxes. The way both people and things are discussed here is irrelevant to whether boaters priveleges are being wrongly sidelined by people with totally different obligations, priveleges and benefits determined by where and how they live.

Also, if you are an American you are entitled to the same rights, priveleges and protections under the law. Regardless of social, political and economic standing. Regardless of ethnicity, race and sex. Where and how you live are of no consequence.

There is one community comprised of all citizens called the United States of America. It is pure folly to suggest an American citizen is any less a member of every other community, whether located in a State, County, city or town. A persons liabilities and priveleges may change, requiring certain licensing and fees are paid in order to access or benefit services - but these cannot be a prerequisite of membership in the community any more than licensing and payment of fees would be prerequisites of American citizenship. The exception might be if one is foreign born applying for American citizenship and is paying administrative fees.

The point is, landbound people are discussing boaters as if they are not members of the community, entitled to equal protections against abusive treatment by individuals or government - unless they pay for it. It is one thing to establish local policies that treat everyone equally, bestowing equal obligations, priveleges and rights to everyone. But, to implement policy in knee jerk fashion to complaints from a relatively small group that deprives others a way of life is abusive. And to assert payment of some type is necessary before one is considered a member of the community conflicts with the principle of citizenship and what it means to be an American.

Captain Bill · 15-09-2013, 12:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by GothVanhellsing

They anchor all the way out to the channel that goes under the bridge. One thing I gotta say about Oriental is the holding here is like being superglued to the bottom.

I notice that this beautiful photo was taken on a flat calm day. That area outside of the breakwater is untenable in any kind of strong southerly wind. Those cats on the seawall would be being slammed to death against that seawall. Perhaps once your anchor has sunk down through several feet of silt after being there for a while it does hold well. My experience behind the breakwater has been that I could not back down on my anchor as it would not set in the silt. Outside of the breakwater the holding is fine, but like I said untenable in certain wind conditions. When was this picture taken, as I don't see any of the "resident" boats that have generated the controversy? Again in calm conditions like this when you can set a hook on a short rode there's no problem, but when the wind is blowing there's a problem, especially with boats being bow and stern anchored and not swinging with the rest of the boats.

Wrong · 15-09-2013, 12:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain Bill

I notice that this beautiful photo was taken on a flat calm day. That area outside of the breakwater is untenable in any kind of strong southerly wind. Those cats on the seawall would be being slammed to death against that seawall. Perhaps once your anchor has sunk down through several feet of silt after being there for a while it does hold well. My experience behind the breakwater has been that I could not back down on my anchor as it would not set in the silt. Outside of the breakwater the holding is fine, but like I said untenable in certain wind conditions. When was this picture taken, as I don't see any of the "resident" boats that have generated the controversy? Again in calm conditions like this when you can set a hook on a short rode there's no problem, but when the wind is blowing there's a problem, especially with boats being bow and stern anchored and not swinging with the rest of the boats.

It's relative. I could park my Nor'Sea27 in at least 4 spots among the boats in the photo. Sailors who choose deep draught, larger boats should expect to reduce their anchoring possibilities as a consequence of the choice they make in choosing a boat. They should not as a consequence try to limit or control other boaters in order to accommodate the larger boat. How many boats have both bow and stern anchors deployed? This should be prohibited as long as it is an open anchorage without mooring balls.

SkiprJohn · 15-09-2013, 12:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boatguy30

Thanks for that, here in Florida "veterans" seem to be handled with kid gloves and you are always seeing articles about them in Southwinds or local papers regarding anchoring. Always implying they have some extra special right to anchor. whilst a grateful nation appreciates their service War Pensions is the only special allowance awarded under the constitution.

My grandfather was a WWII veteran, my father on active duty in SE asia in the early 60s. I myself had "better things to do" like the last 3 generations of Romney males. Whilst my father is technically a Vietnam vet he never saw any action and has never attempted to get any special recognition in society. My grandfather was truly disabled in WWII and died young related to his disabilities. He was to proud to even get a handicapped tag for his truck.

These days, you see plenty of folks with permanent handicap tags park right next to the store and casually stroll right on in. I guy was at a recent county meeting claiming anyone with a handicap tag is guaranteed free parking in the local (pay to park for honest rubes) city garage during concerts. He seemed to imply he would be parking his car in the garage all weekend to prove a point even though he lived nearby and wasn't attending the concert.

Does being a veteran have anything to do with having a permanent handicap tag in your area? It doesn't where I live.

I think its great that some stores give veteran discounts and people are thanking you for your service. Very much different from when I returned from Vietnam. If you are not a veteran you have no idea what sacrifices have been made.

Strange how this is a thread drifted area. I see that boaters rights are being diminished daily. Government is regulating more and more and/or allowing commercial enterprises to regulate and our freedoms are less and less.

ShaktiGurl · 15-09-2013, 12:22

Wrong has it right, at least to my thinking! Very well said.

GothVanhellsing · 15-09-2013, 12:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morgan3820

I was anchored at Oriental for the CroakerFest this past July so I was able to view the boats in question. My thoughts at the time were, "wow what a pile of crap". Maybe I'm getting old but all these boat do is give the regular cruisers a bad name and invite legislative solutions that screw everyone up. The same thing is happening in Taylor's Creek, Beaufort, NC. I can't anchor there for all of the derelicts.

So, while you suck up the free internet at the Bean opining about your rights to be a freeloading bum on a derelict boat perhaps you should consider that when everyone around you thinks that you are the problem maybe they are the smart ones. Or at the very least go be a bum in private.

Sorry i don't bum money or go to the bean too many judgmental people there.

Radarhouse · 15-09-2013, 12:34

When I move my boat to a different area that's not in my home range, I become part of that community. I spend my money there. I take interest in the local community and become,again, a part of that community. Just because someone's been there longer than me only gives them a say in what directly affects them seems to be the norm.