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Old 09-11-2012, 13:22   #61
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Re: Obamacare = early retirement anyone?

Pete 7. In the Us you can't be denied emergency treatment. You would receive treatment and be stabilized. For follow up it would be dicey, possibly you would get treatment until they realized you can't pay. If mobile you just leave. If not you could apply for Medicaid, and if approved they would pay. If not you can negotiate the fee, or just leave.

Our experience with Medicare is that it is as easy or easier to find a dr that takes Medicare as it is to find one that takes United Healthcare. Medicare pays about the same or a little less, but the dr's get it in 3 weeks not 3 months. I still have to carry a private policy until next year.

Obamacare is still private insurance, not gov't supplied. If you believe in the free market, insurance should go down for two reasons. First, competition, they will be competing for your business just as they Are now for Medicare supplemental insurance now that we are in open enrollment until early December. Secondly, the risk factor will be spread over a larger base. Generally, younger = healthier. Older = higher risk. Also to add in is less write off of bed accounts which does add to cost just like any business.

As far as out of the country coverage, I am sure you can get it, you will be paying for it.
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Old 09-11-2012, 13:25   #62
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Re: Obamacare = early retirement anyone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by s/v 'Faith' View Post
Sure, mine too.... BUT. When you go and look at who is cruising in what, you find that a very significant number of people are sailing very expensive boats.

Priced a new Catamaran lately? They are filling up anchorages now... and they are not cheap.

Truth is that many who actually do go out and cruise are coming from a higher tax bracket then the public at large...
And those people can afford to pay the 20% tax rate that the rest of us do as well. ESPECIALLY interest and dividend income. I think it's pretty obscene that a person Like Mitt can choose whether they'd prefer a tax rate of 15 to 12%.
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Old 09-11-2012, 13:26   #63
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Re: Obamacare = early retirement anyone?

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Originally Posted by SunDevil View Post
.... US based health insurance coverage would be if I got sick in Australia, Canada, or Europe? Would they cover it? Would the state-run health insurance pay for it? In Australia, I was paying the 10% VAT sales tax that other healthy tourists are paying too.
Like Medicare and Medicaid, I expect this plan will not cover you out of country, but don't know for sure.

Related note: If you are living abroad (as I am) then you are automatically categorized as having complied regarding purchasing of insurance under the act. No coverage goes along with this of course, but at least I don't have to pay for insurance which (I assume) would not work outside the USA anyway.
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Old 09-11-2012, 13:27   #64
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Re: Obamacare = early retirement anyone : the french (very bad) experience

Hi everybody,

As a Frenchman being in a nation that has a "obamacarelike" health system since the end on WWII, i'd like to share the experience with you guys:

When I started to work in 1983 as an employee, the cost (mandatory for everybody) for the health / pension national system was 12 % of your salary each month(meaning 12% less money for you).

Nowaday it is 23% for each employee per month....and the double for the boss as the company has to pay as well (of course...).

Since decades the medicines are less and less reimburse by the system, as it is pilling-up each years billions of Euros of debts, as well as the medical services (surgery...), around 18 bilions last year...

The national health board (cal "sécurité sociale") is employing ten of thousands of agents that are considered mostly as useless as the fraud to the system is so huge that it is counted in hundred of millions of euros and nobody is trying to stop it.

The health board is having since decade a very bad side effect on citizens:

They consider health care is free and frequently ask the doctor to give them days out of work of illness (these days are paid by the health board) when they are fed-up with their work and want to have some rest.

In some public companies, civil servant are having up to 3 weeks of illness holidays each year, I am talking about more than 25000 persons...they do it because they know that they will not be controlled as the control only happen when you are stopped working for more than 3 weeks !

The doctors and the whole business men in the medical activities are sheathing on the figures, the prices, in any corner of the game increasing the debt of the health board...their lobbies are so powerful in France that nobody wants or can control them and stop them.

For example, a room in a french hospital will be charge to the health board more than 900 euros/ day for the room and the food only ! The room is a small one with 2 patient in it, the cost is not the medical service, it is charge in addition ! Nobody care as it is a cost between 2 administration !

But in the end, each french has to pay for the debt...

The reasons of all this mess:

Evrybody think the medicines are free (as they are reimburse by the health board).
There is no real control of what's happening.
"Health" is as holy as the holy grail for french and their health board is sacred as the grail, nobody wants to reform it and face the reality.

Therefore since more than 40 years that the health board has this debt none of the authorities and the unions (the management is made by both union, governement and companies owners) wants to change it !

So my first thought when I heard about Obama care in USA was "I hope they'll not create the same mess than our, sincerely!"...

Good night and good luck guys.
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Old 09-11-2012, 13:31   #65
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Re: Obamacare = early retirement anyone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by xymotic View Post
And those people can afford to pay the 20% tax rate that the rest of us do as well. ESPECIALLY interest and dividend income. I think it's pretty obscene that a person Like Mitt can choose whether they'd prefer a tax rate of 15 to 12%.
Guess you just don't understand rationale behind the reduced tax rate for capital gains. You don't have to agree with it just try to understand it.
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Old 09-11-2012, 13:34   #66
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Re: Obamacare = early retirement anyone?

The July 2012 Congressional Budget Office (CBO) healthcare premium estimates are considerably higher than the OP is quoting, $12,000/yr per couple and $5k/yr individual coverage. Still looking for anything that explains what is covered and excluded.

Link to the source I found did not work.
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Old 09-11-2012, 13:35   #67
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Re: Obamacare = early retirement anyone?

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Originally Posted by LakeSuperior View Post
Guess you just don't understand rationale behind the reduced tax rate for capital gains. You don't have to agree with it just try to understand it.
That's a pretty amazing statement. I understand a lot of the lies (rationale) used to perpetuate unfair practices. Income is income, except when it isn't.
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Old 09-11-2012, 13:36   #68
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Re: Obamacare = early retirement anyone : the french (very bad) experience

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric50 View Post
Hi everybody,

As a Frenchman being in a nation that has a "obamacarelike" health system since the end on WWII, i'd like to share the experience with you guys:

When I started to work in 1983 as an employee, the cost (mandatory for everybody) for the health / pension national system was 12 % of your salary each month(meaning 12% less money for you).

Nowaday it is 23% for each employee per month....and the double for the boss as the company has to pay as well (of course...).

Since decades the medicines are less and less reimburse by the system, as it is pilling-up each years billions of Euros of debts, as well as the medical services (surgery...), around 18 bilions last year...

The national health board (cal "sécurité sociale") is employing ten of thousands of agents that are considered mostly as useless as the fraud to the system is so huge that it is counted in hundred of millions of euros and nobody is trying to stop it.

The health board is having since decade a very bad side effect on citizens:

They consider health care is free and frequently ask the doctor to give them days out of work of illness (these days are paid by the health board) when they are fed-up with their work and want to have some rest.

In some public companies, civil servant are having up to 3 weeks of illness holidays each year, I am talking about more than 25000 persons...they do it because they know that they will not be controlled as the control only happen when you are stopped working for more than 3 weeks !

The doctors and the whole business men in the medical activities are sheathing on the figures, the prices, in any corner of the game increasing the debt of the health board...their lobbies are so powerful in France that nobody wants or can control them and stop them.

For example, a room in a french hospital will be charge to the health board more than 900 euros/ day for the room and the food only ! The room is a small one with 2 patient in it, the cost is not the medical service, it is charge in addition ! Nobody care as it is a cost between 2 administration !

But in the end, each french has to pay for the debt...

The reasons of all this mess:

Evrybody think the medicines are free (as they are reimburse by the health board).
There is no real control of what's happening.
"Health" is as holy as the holy grail for french and their health board is sacred as the grail, nobody wants to reform it and face the reality.

Therefore since more than 40 years that the health board has this debt none of the authorities and the unions (the management is made by both union, governement and companies owners) wants to change it !

So my first thought when I heard about Obama care in USA was "I hope they'll not create the same mess than our, sincerely!"...

Good night and good luck guys.
Thank you for your honesty in this, Eric. How very interesting.

Folks, my hubby is a retired hospital CEO. He has read the entire bill and understands it well. It does NOT bode well, for numerous reasons. But he will have to jump in here and tell y'all that.
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Old 09-11-2012, 13:36   #69
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Re: Obamacare = early retirement anyone?

Tookish1, I agree with you. In 1991 at age 40 we went cruising. My wife had some mobility problems due to being hit by an uninsured drunk driver in 1971. We knew her condition would deteriorate with time. Her deciding statement was "I want to be sitting in my rocking chair saying remember when...", not "I wish we had ". Problems have occurred so we will be coastal cruising, and even then she thi is we should have crew if it is more than over night. Unless you can charge up that crystal ball's batteries, do it if you can. You can always make more money, can't make more time.
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Old 09-11-2012, 13:37   #70
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Re: Obamacare = early retirement anyone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tookish1 View Post
Early retirement for us means 55-56 instead of 62-65. My wife has had breast and bladder cancer and although is cancer "free" now, there is incentive for us to go sooner rather than later. I have never made a six figure income and our boat will be something seaworthy and modest (Tayana 42CC?)
Maybe we are just lucky, but after working 30+ years, paying off the house and having some modest rental property income - we can now make some serious plans.
If that sounds like I expect someone else to foot the bill, you misunderstand.
I understand your possition clearly. My situation is perhaps not too different. My wife is uninsurable through no fault of hers or mine, and she is a bit younger than I which means I retirment would need to wait until I am 72 for her to be covered under Medicare. I have paid substancial taxes due to substancial income throughout my life; though perhaps the average shmoe is hoping to get a free ride, I'm quite certain that I have been paying my way and far more. The aforementioned healthcare costs have also inhibited my ability to sock away as much as I would like. My wife's health may not be robust for long and I would very much like to spend some free time with her. I doubt she will be with me when I can finally retire. World cruising? No, but to retire at 62, for example, would be delightful. However, I also realize that re-entering industry at 65+ after a sabatical is a long shot at best. I don't think I'm lazy, I think I've toted that bale for a good many years.

I just lstened to a talk at a trade confrence (not healthcare related), and the PO's comments seemed acurate. Unfortunate that no knowlegable person addressed them dirrectly (or I missed it).

This is the ONLY thing I want from the government. I've never drawn unemployment. I've never accepted any assitance or even tried to work the tax code. I'm not looking for a morgage bail-out; I played is square and paid of my morgage 15 years ago. I've taken a licking in the market once or twice and never cried "foul." I accept that SS payments may be less than we had thought. I can live with that.

I guess only folks that have lived with long-term heath care responsibilities can really understand the trap.
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Old 09-11-2012, 13:40   #71
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Re: Obamacare = early retirement anyone?

The whole system is a mess.

US health care: It's officially a mess, institute says - Vitals

American health care system "a dysfunctional mess" | syracuse.com

Where were the plans from people about how to improve what we have or how to improve Obamacare? Why isn't there a thousand page bill that outlines the GOP's ideas about how to improve the care for the average person, not just the bottom line for banks, hospitals, and insurance companies? I expect it to be long and have lots of medical details because of the nature and complexity of the issue

Foreign travel coverage for US citizens is a big unknown, why doesn't this get reported on? The costs are way too high, and the insurance company will try and get out of paying if they can I'm sure. And it's not like I am trying to get sick. But I guess the best plan is the "Don't Get Sick" one.
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Old 09-11-2012, 13:42   #72
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Re: Obamacare = early retirement anyone : the french (very bad) experience

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric50 View Post
Hi everybody,

As a Frenchman being in a nation that has a "obamacarelike" health system since the end on WWII, i'd like to share the experience with you guys:
[snip]
Except... Obamacare is NOTHING like european socialized medicine.

In the US we still have the debt, we spend even more than you do, but we do not have any actual health care. We are not getting any return on the money we are ALREADY spending.
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Old 09-11-2012, 13:47   #73
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Re: Obamacare = early retirement anyone?

By the way, my wife read me something that everyone who is older and has private insurance will need to consider. We are not sure how accurate it is.

Obama care has "standards of treatment". Even if you have private insurance, the doctors can only provide the services that has been stated approved by the government. Even if you can afford the extra services, the point is moot. The doctors will not be able "legally" to render those services.

Even being rich will not get the care you need. Only being a Senator or Congressman would get you the treatment, as they are "exempt" from the "standards".

http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/arc...0/apr/10040115

Scroll down to "other issues".

Sorry to burst bubbles here......I think purchasing that boat just got moved to the top of my list.

James L
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Old 09-11-2012, 13:52   #74
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Re: Obamacare = early retirement anyone?

[QUOTE=tookish1;1080234...
Whether we like or don't like Obamacare, the economic reality for us, is that retiring and cruising is now possible and I'm wondering if it has had the same effect on anyone else??[/QUOTE]

Tookish: relevant question raised by another poster...will your insurance under Obamacare cover you outside of the USA? If so, at what levels and/or limitations?

I know that one provision of the Act, is that if you already have coverage then you can keep it as is. Presumably, then if your existing policy covers you outside the USA then your good to go?
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Old 09-11-2012, 13:55   #75
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Re: Obamacare = early retirement anyone?

Another relevant question: If you purchase insurance from a non-USA company are you considered compliant with the required participation provisions of the Act?

This is relevant to cruisers because many cruisers have policies issued by non-USA companies that provide coverage only outside of the USA.

Anyone know?
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