Moving to a Life Aboard

[Rakuflames]

Originally Posted by CaptForce

I'm not against the use of netting, but I never put any netting on my boats. My children remained in the cockpit when the deck was rolling or like any adult on board, they were with life vests and teathered harnesses on the high side (windward side) when going forward. We do have double lifelines and added low line at the stanchion bases, but no toe rail at all. I don't miss the toe rail, as I'm not typically on the leeward side. I had one occasion to rescue my daughter when she fell in when boarding the boat at the dock. She was two and with her mother on the day before my son was born. Nancie was not prepared to jump in for my daughter and I was called up from below. The outcome was good as my daughter had not hit the boat or dock while falling and she remained calm while I had her out in a brief moment. We did gybe and turn back to retrieve my son in the Bahamas when he was about ten. We were playing in a protected lagoon with a light breeze and smooth water and he was already a good swimmer. We picked him up with a "Jim Bouy" retrieval system,- lfie harness on a long floating line. This event would never have occurred in rough seas, because we would have been practicing a different protocol, ...vests, harnesses, teathers, etc. After our children were adults and gone, we did lose our dog without notice and sailed back on our course to look for him. Fortunately, he had been seen and picked up by another boat. We often teather the dog too, now. I had some suggest that we could put up netting for the dog, but, as we didn't net for our children, I can't see doing it for our dog. I think our dog is wiser now too, as he's been cruising with us for eleven years! Once again, 'not against netting, 'just not our choice.

Netting has all sorts of advantages *for me.* For instance, loading groceries is easier. I just put them on the boat next to netting. No chance they will slip in.

If I lived on land and had a swimming pool I would have multiple barriers and alerts for children falling in the pool, too.

It's not an inconvenience for me at all and personally I think it looks really nice. Tethering is great, and important -- like seat belts in cars. But then there's the day (back when they thought small chidren were safest in the front seat, facing front) that my 2 year old managed to unbuckle her seat belt in her car seat -- RIGHT as someone rear-ended me. She flew out of the seat and her head hit the dashboard.

Fortunately she was not hurt, but keep an eye on those kids and make sure they haven't figured out how to undo their tethers. I would treat that the same way I did unbuckling -- the car got pulled over and stopped, and didn't move again until that child was rebuckled. Kids find that very annoying and it was very effective.

[Sam Plan B]

Cruising with your children is the best education for them. Through celestial nav. they will learn astronomy, trig. and converting raw data to useful information. Through your travels they will be exposed to new places, cultures and the history of the places you visit.

I think the biggest change will be culling all the shore side stuff you have accumulated over the years. No big box of toys, for example. Numbers of clothing items are reduced as well. You can keep the little black dress for dinner ashore but only one pair of heels. In the galley, one dinner plate for each of you. All pots & pans have to fit inside the galley stove oven. And your books, keep only the essentials. Do not take your high school year books or family photo albums. Boats are very humid places and water can find its way in. Your treasured books will absorb water and rot from the inside out. You crack one open one day and it is nothing but paper pulp.

[Hudson Force]

Originally Posted by CaptForce

... not against the use of netting ............. Once again, 'not against netting, 'just not our choice.

'just to be clear, no debate, I'm not against the use of netting.

[water babe]

There is much to learn and am rather young and cheerful. I harbor no ill will. I'm am thoughtful and a quick study. my boys are 1 1/2 and 4. Their safety is top priority. If you have raised children aboard then your a good resource. I can read till I'm blue, but the real knowledge comes with experience. I am very greatful for any input I can get.

[Hudson Force]

Not as a safety concern, but more as a concern for children to find fulfilment with the adventures of cruising, be sure to include them in the operation of the boat at many levels. As they learn to sail be sure to involve them in navigation, handling lines, operating the dinghy, etc. When our children were young, the tools were different. They became wise to the simple math of dead reckoning and could find a bearing with a radio direction finder. We didn't have an auto-pilot, but my son would take a turn at the helm. He'd even play a game with a make-shift "gunsight" made by taping a paper towel roll to the bow pulpit and "shooting" clouds or stars. Once when my son was eight he took a dock line from the bow of Jacque Cousteau's "Calypso" and the French crew exclaimed surprise as he quickly belayed the line on a dock cleat. Our children lived aboard with us on a one-cabin 33' boat until they were six and eight. At that age we traded for our current 41' double cabin. We gave them the aft cabin and split it down the middle by fixing two cumputer hutches back to back with a simple plywood board between them. A draw curtain could separate the forward portion. Our children thrived with their own space that they were able to keep to their liking. Organization evolved because if they didn't stow things efficiently, they would have no space in their 7' x 4' cabins. We also enjoyed this arrangement with a "walkover" center cockpit and all of us having some private space and a bigger engine room than the more common "walk-through" center cockpit designs.

[Kettlewell]

One thing we figured out after awhile is that you have to go where there are other kids around the right ages for your kids, especially when they get a bit older. We completely changed our cruising plans in order to travel with other boats with kids, and it made a huge difference to them. Unfortunately, you will find there are very few children out there--mostly old farts like me, and older. I think that interaction with their peers is important. It's a bit better down in the Caribbean where you find a lot of European boats with children. In general, warmer water is better with children onboard so you aren't cooped up in the boat all the time, and the Caribbean is ideal in many ways. You can island hop from country to country, experiencing lots of different cultures in a relatively small area. There's a big cruising community to be part of too.

[Hudson Force]

Originally Posted by Kettlewell

One thing we figured out after awhile is that you have to go where there are other kids around the right ages for your kids, especially when they get a bit older. We completely changed our cruising plans in order to travel with other boats with kids...........

This good point from Kettlewell reminds me that we used to cruise around the anchorage when we first came to a new place in order to take note of the boats that appeared to have children. It was common to find parents on other boats that hailed us with joy and relief to find more interaction among the children. Although we did not often match our cruising route with boats with other children, we did plan shore excursions and boat visits. Kettlewell's comment about the age of cruiser's is also noteworthy. It's true that most cruisers in the US are older retired couples like we are now. It always interests me as to how things have changed. When my wife and I first moved aboard in the early 70's, most of the cruisers and liveaboards we met were our age and as strange as it seems, over forty years later, they are still mostly our age! I have seen more younger liveaboards recently. Maybe there will be a resurgence of young family liveaboard cruisers!

[mausgras]

Originally Posted by Kettlewell

Moral of the story, is they should be playing in and getting used to the water and swimming as early as possible. We let them go out in small rowing dinghies as soon as they wanted to, even on their own, but within observation distance. Better they know how to handle things.

Several years ago I was visiting Halong Bay in Nth Vietnam. There are many floating villages beside the Karst Islands that consisted of a bamboo hut on a raft of water barrels. The kids there were real water babies. They looked barely old enough to walk let alone swim and they handled these little round bamboo coracles like they were born in them ... maybe they were.

I have mixed feelings about PFD's. Absolutely necessary when underway or in heavy weather but at anchor I think they give a false sense of security and kids should not learn to depend on them.

Moral of the story .... get them in the water as early and as often as possible.

[Rakuflames]

Originally Posted by mausgras

Several years ago I was visiting Halong Bay in Nth Vietnam. There are many floating villages beside the Karst Islands that consisted of a bamboo hut on a raft of water barrels. The kids there were real water babies. They looked barely old enough to walk let alone swim and they handled these little round bamboo coracles like they were born in them ... maybe they were.

I have mixed feelings about PFD's. Absolutely necessary when underway or in heavy weather but at anchor I think they give a false sense of security and kids should not learn to depend on them.

Moral of the story .... get them in the water as early and as often as possible.

I would just caution the admiration of those children's ability to be safe around water with the fact that unfortunately, young children in third world countries die young at an astronomical rate compared to us.

Where I live, in Florida, we are now at the point that any time a small child drowns in a pool alone, a criminal investigation is begun. If the supervising parent went in to answer the phone or put a load of clothes in the dryer, they might well be charged with some form of criminal neglect. It happens here all the time. Personally I think the state has swung too far in the direction of charging people for things that truly are accidents, but the cultural attitudes may be very different from one country to another.

When my children were young I had neighbors from another country -- European, modern, etc. They went out for the evening leaving their 5 and 8 year olds home alone and did not realize that it was the expectation here that they MUST hire a babysitter, that if something went wrong they would have been charged with child neglect at the very least.

[David_Old_Jersey]

As safety is your "first priority" then I would suggest that having two adults onboard who can handle the boat (and navigate home) if the usual skipper goes glug or becomes incapicitated.....that doesn't mean that both have to share the skippering duties day to day, but it does mean that both should be able to easily step in when needed and to do that will mean that at least now and again the other gets to act to keep their hand in.

Pressing the help button is an option - but not always the safest option, especially if climbing up the side of a rusty freighter in a gale or on a lee shore.

[Kettlewell]

Kids get very adept very early onboard. One time in Newport two kids showed up at our boat one morning in an outboard powered skiff. The older boy was 8 and the younger 6--they handled the boat better than most adults. We invited them onboard to make donuts.

[water babe]

I'm very exited to learn and teach, of course my children will be envolved, elbow deep! . I'm also happy to say, I think we've settled on the Fisher 37'. My husband is very fond of it and I think it's beautiful.

[water babe]

Both boys are good in the water, but they are still learning. My eldest is learning to swim underwater and dive and my youngest is just learning the basics. Lessons everyday when we move to the sea

[Capt Phil]

We ran the netting from the aft stanchion of the pulpit all the way aft to the cockpit but my oldest still found a way to undo his lifeline, wriggle around the netting looking for seals, dolphins or some other aquatic creature and went over board off the bow. My wife was nursing our youngest in the cockpi at the time and as the oldest came by the lee side of the cockpit, I just reached in grabbed him by the back of his life jacket and threw him aboard like a fish. I recall his eyes looking up at me through the water, a site I'll never forget!! You can't never remove all hazards when living aboard, so just do the best you can.
In reply to Rakuflames, my son being a high school teacher, I trust his judgement in the public school system in Canada and he homeschools both of his own even though he teaches in the public school system... go figure!!? Phil

[Rakuflames]

Originally Posted by water babe

I'm very exited to learn and teach, of course my children will be envolved, elbow deep! . I'm also happy to say, I think we've settled on the Fisher 37'. My husband is very fond of it and I think it's beautiful.

Another little thing to pass on to you. This is done by a family I know. They don't homeschool, but they spend a lot of time on the water and take advantage of what they see.

They keep a saltwater aquarium on the boat ready for anything. One time the kids caught a little octopus. They put it in the aquarium and studied it, watched it for a while, and then set it free. They gathered up bioluminescent water and put it in the aquarium -- and turned out the lights. They had a lot of fun.

It doesn't have to be big -- but secure it well.