Living with Pain

[chris mac]

I've got a generous assortment of pain and arthritis as well. Surgery on the 9th to fix some of it:-)
One thing that did wonders for me was seeing an orthotics specialist in conjunction with a gait assessment. Real PhD specialists, not the ones at the mall!!!
It isn't cheap, but it improved my walking, and posture. reduced pain, and limping. reduced the calluses on my feet, and ingrown nails.
I have also been able to put the orthotics in Keen sandals.
If the pain is in the back and lower, it could be worth looking into.

[OndinePLC]

Aah Pain!

Unlike marriage it really is "till death do us part".


20 years ago I spent 3 months on my back in bed without even sitting up or turning over due to a spinal column injury resulting from DUI.


I was injected with Diciclophenac 3 times a day and felt fine until it ran out. The pain was so bad I let go and started screaming at the top of my voice. It helped the pain to a surprising degree and ensured replacement injections were quickly found!


I was worried I would be addicted to it but switched to pills and eventually came off it completely with no problem.


Now I manage it with exercise, sleep and NSAIDS.


Daily exercise is essential and for dodgy knees and hips swimming and biking are excellent and less boring than gyms or machines. I find yogic swimming also calms my mind.

In the marina we have a pool and I do ten laps a day.

At anchor I swim round the boat ten times unless there is a reef nearby where I can snorkel. If I miss a day I have to do twenty the next day! I rarely miss.



Sleep is very important to repair body damage and it is easy to get in a vicious circle where the pain stops you sleeping well and the pain gets worse.



NSAIDS work and are no more addictive than ice-cream. I use pills for general pain and creams for localised pains like hip joints, and sometimes both. Most drugs will have side effects if you take enough for long enough so I try to minimise my intake. Taking a pill (now Naproxen for me) before going to bed is doubly effective as it relieves the pain and helps you sleep.


I can't give up booze entirely but keep quantity and frequency down as much as boredom permits.



All this lets me do most things except walking or running without any problem most of the time. When my body painfully warns me that I am overdoing it I lie down for the day with meds and a good book.


Speaking of which I recommend "A Small Slip" and "Desperate Deliveries" by Cris Robinson available on Kindle ebooks and paperbacks. I don't know if they are any good but they help me to pay the chemist's bills!

[LittleWing77]

Be VERY careful with ibuprofen, Pelagic. It is very hard on the stomach and liver and can provoke chronic problems over time.

Two things for the forum at large:

1. For anyone with degenerating joints or spine, there is a relatively new regenerative therapy called stem-cell PRP. In which they take stem cells from your own fat (unfortunately not enough to be a weight loss), combine it with the PRP form of your own blood (a vial of your blood spun into its concentrated form) and inject the elyxir into the joint - which stimulates your body to **regrown the diminishing cartilage**. So as long as you still have some cartilage, it can stave off things like knee replacement significantly.

I partially tore my meniscus in my R knee this time last year, had stem cell PRP on both knees in April 2018, did 6 weeks of physio to recover and now knees are functioning like normal and pain-free. As it is a new protocol, I'm not sure how long it will last, but I'm grateful for all the additional time as well as the avoidance of surgery. After my recovery, I'm back to biking almost every day and as you already know, swimming is fantastic for back pain. As a lot of people have already said, movement is key.

2. You'd be surprised how much effect can be gained from an anti-inflammatory *diet*. Reduce meat, alcohol, dairy and coffee (I haven't been able to give up the coffee, unfortunately) and increase veggies, fruit, etc. - all the advice we've been hearing for years. When you start paying attention, you'll find a regular correlation between increased inflammation/soreness/pain and what you ate the day before. It takes some experimenting over time with your own metabolism, but if you make the effort, you can dramatically reduce symptoms by diet alone. Even the football star Tom Brady says he adheres to a no-nighshades diet (eliminate tomato, potato, peppers and eggplant) which has saved all of his joints. (I've found that to be true, but pretty difficult to entirely eliminate nightshades!)

Hope this is helpful and very happy new year to all,
Fair Winds,
Little Wing

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by chris mac

I've got a generous assortment of pain and arthritis as well. Surgery on the 9th to fix some of it:-)
One thing that did wonders for me was seeing an orthotics specialist in conjunction with a gait assessment. Real PhD specialists, not the ones at the mall!!!
It isn't cheap, but it improved my walking, and posture. reduced pain, and limping. reduced the calluses on my feet, and ingrown nails.
I have also been able to put the orthotics in Keen sandals.
If the pain is in the back and lower, it could be worth looking into.

Also knees. Improper heel strike and gait are a big problem for knees. Pin on the inside, combined with flat feet, is a common indicator.


I find Chaco sandals work pretty well when I can't wear shoes with orthotics. Expensive, but very long lasting. About the only brand that provides enough support.


I started with orthotics at ~ 19. As Chris said fitting is VERY important, and don't give up if they don't help at first. There is a good chance the fit is not quite right. They probably just need adjustment, which is normal. I have different pairs for different shoe types, even my bike cleats.

[Hesti]

When you are beyond 50 and wake up in the morning and nothing hurts ...


Alcohol is not a solution, pain killer also not over any length of time.

[Waterford]

You have a lot of good advice in this thread. I too had debliltating knee and back pain. Once I retired I knew I didn't want to live with such pain so I lost 50 pounds over three years, then did a total knee replacement. Both helped a lot, but it took me another year to become friends with my new knee. I've been doing Pilates for about two years now and it has made a huge difference in my daily life. It has increased my strength, flexibility and balance plus reduced my daily pain significantly (but not completely). As many others have said, keep moving!

[danielamartindm]

Alcohol is not an analgesic and at night, when pain tends to be front and center to our attention, alcohol interferes with sleep- not falling asleep initially, but staying asleep.

[dannc]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

Embrace the drugs, befriend ice and heat packs, get yourself a tens unit, stretch, cry
...

Surprised more people did not jump in with using ice.

Once upon a time I hurt my back. The wife wanted me to go to a chiropractor but I went to an MD instead. I was in immense pain and the MD put me on some serious pain meds, steroids, and ibuprofen. This killed the pain and allowed my injury to sorta knda heal but I was a zombie on the couch for a week.

A couple of months later, I injured the back again. This time I went to a chiropractor. I saw him on a Friday and my pain was building up. I knew I would be in the ER this weekend if something was not done. The chiropractor did his exam, took X-rays, and then told me to go home and take ibuprofen, use ICE/cold pack every hour for seven minutes and come back on Monday when treatment can began after the X-rays are evaluated. The look on my face must have mirrored my thoughts which were, "Is he NUTS? I am in serious pain and he wants me to go home an use ice and ibuprofen!!!!???"

He read my mind and said if I was in pain over the weekend to give him a call.

Using an ice pack every hour for seven minutes for as many hours as I could a day, along with the ibuprofen, dramatically reduced my pain. It was far better than the drug cocktail the MD had me on which turned me into a non functioning zombie. The ice and ibuprofen reduced my pain to a manageable level and I could still function. Ice and ibuprofen is also CHEAP.

Eventually I got a TENS unit and that helped as well.

Various family members have had knee and shoulder surgeries where a big part of the recovery and pain management was being on ice machines. Amazing that ice reduced pain as much as it does.

Heat has to be used correctly though. Part of my pain problems when I was taking the drug cocktail was because of using a heat pad or taking a hot shower. Ice reduces inflammation which reduces pain. Heat can cause inflammation which can increase pain. A long hot shower sent me to the ER at 2:00am.

Later,
Dan

[scarlet]

Try curcumon, It's Tumaric which is a natural and powerful anti-inflammatory. My husband broke his knee into 9 pieces, and has it put back together with plates and screws. This has resulted in pain, as well as arthritis. Taking curcumon everyday has made a HUGE improvement. It's an herb/spice... it is not a drug.. it's non-addictive, and low-carb.

It is worth a try... you do need to take it everyday for it to build up in your system and to provide long term relief.

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by dannc

Surprised more people did not jump in with using ice.

Once upon a time I hurt my back. The wife wanted me to go to a chiropractor but I went to an MD instead. I was in immense pain and the MD put me on some serious pain meds, steroids, and ibuprofen. This killed the pain and allowed my injury to sorta knda heal but I was a zombie on the couch for a week.

A couple of months later, I injured the back again. This time I went to a chiropractor. I saw him on a Friday and my pain was building up. I knew I would be in the ER this weekend if something was not done. The chiropractor did his exam, took X-rays, and then told me to go home and take ibuprofen, use ICE/cold pack every hour for seven minutes and come back on Monday when treatment can began after the X-rays are evaluated. The look on my face must have mirrored my thoughts which were, "Is he NUTS? I am in serious pain and he wants me to go home an use ice and ibuprofen!!!!???"

He read my mind and said if I was in pain over the weekend to give him a call.

Using an ice pack every hour for seven minutes for as many hours as I could a day, along with the ibuprofen, dramatically reduced my pain. It was far better than the drug cocktail the MD had me on which turned me into a non functioning zombie. The ice and ibuprofen reduced my pain to a manageable level and I could still function. Ice and ibuprofen is also CHEAP.

Eventually I got a TENS unit and that helped as well.

Various family members have had knee and shoulder surgeries where a big part of the recovery and pain management was being on ice machines. Amazing that ice reduced pain as much as it does.

Heat has to be used correctly though. Part of my pain problems when I was taking the drug cocktail was because of using a heat pad or taking a hot shower. Ice reduces inflammation which reduces pain. Heat can cause inflammation which can increase pain. A long hot shower sent me to the ER at 2:00am.

Later,
Dan

Yes, this. Many of us have made the mistake of overusing heat. Heat feels so good... until the swelling begins. Often ice can break the pain in minutes, but it doesn't sound so inviting.

[donradcliffe]

My go to drug these days is CBD oil, the best anti inflammatory drug I have ever taken without the side effects of NSAIDs or alcohol. A combination of CBD, regular excercise, and losing 15 lbs has eliminated my chronic knee, finger and shoulder pain.

[Seymore]

This is for hip and knee pain.

If you're sleeping on your side, try this. Roll up a solid cylinder about 6 or 8 inches in diameter X about 3 feet long out of corrugated cardboard or foam sheet or something. Sleep on your back with this under your knees (adjust your pillow).

I did this. I took la few nights to get used to. After a week there was some improvement. After two weeks the pain was pretty well gone andI could walk fairly normally.

It's as if your knees and hips are not made for the weight of another knee on their side.

[zeehag]

you pooor dear. i am 70. i have endured pain since age 7. i have reynauds DISEASE not the phenomenon. i was told my pains were imaginary, they were growing pains, they were normal...hahahahahahahahaha
and so it goes. yes i am 70 and have known pain for 63 years. sucks dont it.
what do i do for it??? when i worked i used ibuprofin 2 gm twice daily until it made me puke. that took about 10 yrs. but i could work.
i drifted south and westward with warmth and for warmth. body pillows also work ..
there is a magical nsaid called ketoralac, and it is sublingually delivered. no ulcer, no puke. magic. works well. i use it INfrequently when i cannot manage any longer. 1 little sublingual tablet under tongue and 30 min later i am ok.
i live in tropics for a reason.
i have bubba daboatkat for a reason...his body is perfect temp to alleviate pain in my hands.he is cooperative. he is maine coon mix., perfect hand warmer.
when this evil gene hooked condition makes my guts hurt i drink more water. magic.
i learned first hand that dehydration also makes arthritis worse.
ok water. electrolite... drink water. alcohol makes arthur worse, btw....
so. you have new onset pain. ok. drink water and stock up on ketoralac and move south.
you may also want to do the work outs needed to strengthen your back--i broke mine in 2008, and rowing helps a lot for strengthening.
walk a lot. kayak. be active. the more active you are the less your pain will be. i know this personally.
try it.
goodluck. many i have watched flop into uselessness as soon as pain is felt. oh my that doesnot work. i tried that when my brother died in 2014.. i am just now becoming less of a slug and more of a mover.
must continue to move or you lose function.
row row row...

[Pelagic]

Thanks Zee,....
Both practical and inspiring advice.

Attitude is everything!

I guess I was a lucky one that never got seriously sick or hurt all my life till just a couple of years ago and when living ashore, I had become a slug

Now adjusting to chronic pains living on board and physically working the boat, while rebuilding disused muscles is a new thing to me.

ROW, ROW ROW, is my new mantra!

[Octopus]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

Any advice or suggestions?

I have three suggestions. Feel free to treat them with disdain, but with chronic pain, you are probably willing to try anything.

My experience with whiplash neck injury may help you with your lower back pain. I'll try to keep it brief.

I've had two whiplash injuries from car accidents. The first left me with chronic neck pain for twelve years, before mysteriously disappearing. The second left me with chronic neck pain for nearly six years, before, in 2013, I read about some research that indicated that chronic lower back pain was successfully eliminated in 40% of cases by a simple course of antibiotics.

The suggestion for the most likely cause was that a bacterial infection got into the bloodstream, typically through gum disease, and from there into the spinal chord following soft tissue damage, where the bacteria was able to survive without being attacked by the immune system and in some way interfered with the pain receptors in the area.

Wondering if the same mechanism might be happening with my neck injury, I took a course of antibiotics and miraculously my neck pain disappeared. Of course, I can't say for certain that this was due to the antibiotics or that it wasn't coincidence, or the placebo effect, or better quality sleep (my second suggestion - see below), or something else. However, it's also possible that the pain from my first neck injury disappeared due to taking antibiotics, as my medical records showed that I took them at approximately the right time.

My second suggestion concerns sleep. A nursing friend of mine was, coincidentally, involved in some research that showed that pain from whiplash injuries was closely related to the quality of sleep experienced by the sufferer. This makes sense, if you think about it. Poor quality sleep causes stress and stress exacerbates tension in the neck muscles, which causes pain, etc. etc.. Clearly others think this too:

Originally Posted by OndinePLC

Sleep is very important to repair body damage and it is easy to get in a vicious circle where the pain stops you sleeping well and the pain gets worse.

So, at the same time as I persuaded my doctor to prescribe antibiotics I also persuaded him to prescribe Mirtazapine, which is an antidepressant that causes extreme drowsiness. The first time I took Mirtazapine I slept for 36 hours without interruption! Prior to that I hadn't slept for more than three hours without interruption.

The funny thing about pain is that you don't notice when it goes, you just suddenly realise that it's gone, but you cannot say with certainty when it went.

My third suggestion is courtesy of my wife and has already been mentioned by Dan:

Originally Posted by dannc

Eventually I got a TENS unit and that helped as well.
...
Dan

My wife used only a TENS machine for pain relief during her five experiences of childbirth and in some cases was able to sleep through her contractions. TENS didn't work for me, but clearly it works for others.

I hope something works, as chronic pain is a real drag. Good Luck

Chris