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Old 22-07-2012, 19:28   #31
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Re: Live-aboard or Survive-aboard

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Originally Posted by zeehag View Post
shipshape and seaworthy are two entirely different realities.
one can be ship shape and yet very unseaworthy..
i would worry about seaworthiness before i would even begin to worry about being ship shape.
I can think of some extremely sea worthy boats that are far from shipshape...as well as some impeccably shipshape boats that are far from seaworthy.
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Old 22-07-2012, 19:32   #32
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Re: Live-aboard or Survive-aboard

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My neighbor has a "pretty" Hunter, except it has no backstay, which is hilarious to me.
It's called a B&R rig. It's sturdy in the same way a tripod is sturdy, a concept that goes back to the pyramids.

Look it up--you may learn something.
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Old 22-07-2012, 19:45   #33
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Re: Live-aboard or Survive-aboard

My boat was originally rigged with no back stay and running back stays.
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Old 22-07-2012, 19:50   #34
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Originally Posted by Bash

It's called a B&R rig. It's sturdy in the same way a tripod is sturdy, a concept that goes back to the pyramids.

Look it up--you may learn something.
They don't build them that way to increase the rig's strength. No one sat around and said: "Hey I really want to make a better sailboat with a strong rig, so let's start with removing the backstay." I'm assuming it's for a bimini and a cockpit full of folks enjoying cocktails without the nuisance of a wire in their face. The lowers come so far back you can't even swing the boom out that much.

I have more stainless in my stem fitting than that entire boat has in all its chain plates.

My point is simply that what looks pretty has little to do with what keeps a rig up. I did a delivery on a mid 40's catalina and it bucked and thrashed all over the place. I can't believe people take those things offshore. It sure is "pretty" though.
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Old 22-07-2012, 19:51   #35
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Re: Live-aboard or Survive-aboard

Maybe it's because Im Old but to me ship shape go's hand in hand with Sea worthy !!Ship shape has nothing to do with BRISTOL FASHION !! It means she is in shape to go to sea Where as Bristol Fashion means shes shines and is picture perfect, but that do not mean that vessel is ready to go to sea ! Now this is My own understanding, and is what I was taught as a youngster, but if you look around at the boats in your area you might see what I see maybe ! just my 2 cents
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Old 22-07-2012, 20:12   #36
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Re: Live-aboard or Survive-aboard

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They don't build them that way to increase the rig's strength. No one sat around and said: "Hey I really want to make a better sailboat with a strong rig, so let's start with removing the backstay." I'm assuming it's for a bimini and a cockpit full of folks enjoying cocktails without the nuisance of a wire in their face. The lowers come so far back you can't even swing the boom out that much.
Wrong again. First of all, the B&R wasn't designed by Hunter. It was designed by Bergstrom & Ridder (get it, B&R?) who were trying to increase strength while reducing weight aloft.

Here, read something Bob Perry wrote about this. You'll find the rig has nothing to do with cocktails or cockpits. Bergstrom & Ridder 38

But you knew that, right? Just a bit of gratuitous Hunter bashing?
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Old 22-07-2012, 21:26   #37
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Re: Live-aboard or Survive-aboard

To keep from falling into the rut that so many cruisers do by settling into one place for to long, We keep our boat opperational and ready to go at any moment.. and we do just that..
At a moments notice we'll head out .. this way we know all systems work, including electronics..
We live on the boat, and keep her tyed to a private dock so we've broke free of the marina and we keep from bringing items aboard that would keep us land based.. totally self contained, including hot water on demand, and 12 volt entertainment system..
We believe in keeping our lives active, inshape and mobile..
We've seen to many cruising boats that have put out the pink flamingos and those crazy tomato plants that grow upside-down all over their boat or on the docks and have dug into stay..
Its not hard to spot the difference between thos going no-where and those on the move.....
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Old 22-07-2012, 22:25   #38
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Re: Live-aboard or Survive-aboard

As I see it there are two types of live aboard...those that live on a boat in a slip and those that live on a boat while cruising.
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Old 23-07-2012, 05:15   #39
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Re: Live-aboard or Survive-aboard

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Get off the dock... I don't understand people that buy a boat just to live on... If you don't plan on using it, sell it and rent an apartment for $500 a month, buy a waterbed for the wave action you desire. As for marinas they are like the game Monopoly you either want to stay at Baltic Ave or Park Place. Myself I would prefer to stay on a rail road atleast I'm moving.
Just looking nearby in Kemah texas apartments are $735/ mo a slip for my Ericson 32 are $135/ month. I know where I could get another 32 foot boat for 7K. Seems like a better deal to me. But then I'd probably go out sailing when I could.
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Old 23-07-2012, 05:46   #40
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Re: Live-aboard or Survive-aboard

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Many of the disappointing vessels are occupied by people who are living aboard for the purpose of low income housing. Most of the well found vessels are occupied by those with a passion for boating and cruising.
Which I never understood, because it's not really cheaper. If you buy a boat, you've already paid up front or are making monthly payments. Until a month ago, I was paying $1000/month. Then slip fees - mine are $5600/year + $135/month liveaboard fee. Then there's the two storage lockers at the marina I need (or feel I need) - another $600/year. So, that's a bit more than $1,600/month. How is that substantially cheaper than living on dirt?

I enjoy living aboard and would never be able to afford a house (or apt.) and the boat, which is why I'm living aboard. It's not about cheap housing.
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Old 23-07-2012, 12:15   #41
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Re: Live-aboard or Survive-aboard

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Which I never understood, because it's not really cheaper............. It's not about cheap housing.
Sure, it's not about cheap housing in the Magothy River and what you describe is not cheap. The people I'm speaking of are anchored in Florida waters aboard boats that were purchased or reclaimed salvage at a price of $500 to $2,000 and are anchored near a public access location for a rowed dinghy and possibly a bicycle or in a marina that charges $5/ft/month without added fees. I personally know a man living aboard a 22' Catalina with no rig and no motor on the St. Johns River in Jacksonville who is several months behind on his $110/month marina bill. I have met people living on small boats in areas if the Florida Keys who row to shore in small dinghies from anchored out boats that are totally unseaworthy. They walk or ride bikes to limited employment and are living on less than $400/month. I'm not promoting such a life, but I can't deny it.
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Old 23-07-2012, 14:16   #42
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Re: Live-aboard or Survive-aboard

I suppose even the back lot trailer parks are getting expensive these days. To me the Florida keys always felt like a movie set for a ghost town. As soon as you got behind the facade you were into some very poor housing and living conditions.
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Old 23-07-2012, 14:44   #43
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Re: Live-aboard or Survive-aboard

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Originally Posted by sneuman View Post
Which I never understood, because it's not really cheaper. If you buy a boat, you've already paid up front or are making monthly payments. Until a month ago, I was paying $1000/month. Then slip fees - mine are $5600/year + $135/month liveaboard fee. Then there's the two storage lockers at the marina I need (or feel I need) - another $600/year. So, that's a bit more than $1,600/month. How is that substantially cheaper than living on dirt?

I enjoy living aboard and would never be able to afford a house (or apt.) and the boat, which is why I'm living aboard. It's not about cheap housing.
people on low income are able to live on a boat in a marina when necessary , as they have already DOWNSIZED. they havent need for lockers and car parks nor much of the rest of the materialistic items which keep many on land. surprise--many do not have tv. or phone. or internet. yes--there are still holdouts. i know one who only spends 200 dollars per month on food and beer. wow--but then this is mexico.

long distance travellers do not keep land based storage nor items needing monetary output when travelling is their only life.

anchoring during high season is a must, as is travelling, as marinas are beyond belief, price-wise--
i carry my shirt on my back, as it were, move in low season and spend 250usd on food, and 600usd on diesel...no rent. telcel is whatever i want to pay whenever i wish to pay it, so is covered. i use wifi in mom /pop and and family restaurants, and i get to know locals.
is important to know local weather and cultures.
high season i spend about 500 dollars monthly or less, depending on boat repairs.
high season, la cruz--rent--600 dollars us, per month, so far--foods 300usd, and fuel--we see how much i will need--mebbe 300usd to go to another more south village with a good anchorage and excellent food and ancilllaries.



uhoh. bubba daboatkat said to remember to let ye know is no good cat foods here--now they have fancy feast in gold cans--no green ones. the bites(dry food) is kaka, and he isnt pleased that there are NO salmon flavored greenies for him.
and he is not pleased with the litter, either----(big sigh)
here in mexico, he is another 50us dollars for supplies for him. per month.(was 200 usd, monthly, in san diego)
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Old 23-07-2012, 18:30   #44
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Re: Live-aboard or Survive-aboard

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Which I never understood, because it's not really cheaper. If you buy a boat, you've already paid up front or are making monthly payments. Until a month ago, I was paying $1000/month. Then slip fees - mine are $5600/year + $135/month liveaboard fee. Then there's the two storage lockers at the marina I need (or feel I need) - another $600/year. So, that's a bit more than $1,600/month. How is that substantially cheaper than living on dirt?

I enjoy living aboard and would never be able to afford a house (or apt.) and the boat, which is why I'm living aboard. It's not about cheap housing.
Marina slip (30' boat) + live aboard fee and other misc fees and taxes cost me $287/mo + metered power (middle of winter w/electric heat $50...$10 in summer), mini storage $47...in this town you would e lucky to find just a room to rent for $350+util....that said I just gave up my slip.
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Old 24-07-2012, 04:29   #45
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Re: Live-aboard or Survive-aboard

I'm not saying there aren't cheaper liveaboard alternatives, there are. I'm only saying that when you look at the whole spectrum of liveaboards, the (marina-based) vagabond end of that spectrum is perhaps 10-20 percent. I have a job, I need a car and a few, quite small storage lockers. That's not unusual.
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