Live Aboard in Hawaii ... (MISERABLE, help? :-)

[prof_mariner]

I don't care what school you went to - haole is an insult just like gweiloh and farang.

Sometimes that's true, but in my experience most of the time "haole" is used simply instead of calling someone "caucasian" or even in jest. Heck, some of the most popular comedians in the state base their entire act on teasing the many different races that make up Hawaii's population. Don't get me wrong, I'm not defending racism by any means. But I think blanket generalizations about any one place or people is just as wrong as what those people are being accused of doing.

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by savoir

Gwei - loh has nothing to do with soul. It is two words meaning " white devil ".

I don't care what school you went to - haole is an insult just like gweiloh and farang.

No idea on haole or gweiloh - but "farang" is an interesting one.....

Started off (and still litterally?) means foreigner (with a non-perjorative meaning), kinda morphed into being applied principally to westerners and also says "Not Thai" (which does mean "someone with the bad luck not to be Thai" / "Not worth as much as a Thai!" - a nationalistic attitude rather than racist)......nowadays seems to also mean "Only a foreigner" and whilst I would not say it is openly derogatory (it's certainly not in the category of nig nog), it tends towards the dismissive, whether used openly in that sense or not (same way as many visitors use the word "Thai" as a dismissive explanation of someone / something )......to be fair, the locals often do have a point ....Farang in Thailand not always the best of Ambassadors .

Anyway, that's my take - right or wrong .

[savoir]

Great detective work Holmes. No one else picked up on the " farang " bit.

BTW keep a look out around September 10, got the boat, talking to the registrar and it's all happening.

[Celestialsailor]

Originally Posted by dofthesea

Whats up with all the Hawaii haters? I have loads of fun sailing and enjoying what the islands have to offer.Looks like everyone needs a little dose of Aloha!

Strong words. Maybe your experience is different. Dosn't negate others experiences. I lived there for 7 years. I know what I experienced...thanx.

[Celestialsailor]

Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey

No idea on haole or gweiloh - but "farang" is an interesting one.....

Started off (and still litterally?) means foreigner (with a non-perjorative meaning), kinda morphed into being applied principally to westerners and also says "Not Thai" (which does mean "someone with the bad luck not to be Thai" / "Not worth as much as a Thai!" - a nationalistic attitude rather than racist)......nowadays seems to also mean "Only a foreigner" and whilst I would not say it is openly derogatory (it's certainly not in the category of nig nog), it tends towards the dismissive, whether used openly in that sense or not (same way as many visitors use the word "Thai" as a dismissive explanation of someone / something )......to be fair, the locals often do have a point ....Farang in Thailand not always the best of Ambassadors .

Anyway, that's my take - right or wrong .

Hey DOJ, I'm in LOS right now. A Farang was walking thru BTS in BKK and was clubbed for carrying a bunch of ballons on the BTS. Apparently its illegal. The next day home made signs saying..."no farang on BTS. Go figure!

[savoir]

There are things that a tourist does not see, nor is meant to see.

[gpshephe]

Originally Posted by dofthesea

Whats up with all the Hawaii haters? I have loads of fun sailing and enjoying what the islands have to offer.Looks like everyone needs a little dose of Aloha!

Good post, it is what you make of it. I was stationed in Hawaii in the Army. I loved it, but the guys I was stationed with thought it was a rock. Everyone is different. And thus have different needs.

[tropicalescape]

they told me the term Farang was used for the scum that go to Thailand to explot the child sex trade...In Guam haloe was not a bad word ,it was used by the locals and the whites to describe white statesiders...the word in Hawaii was definetly derogatory(?sp)...My mothers people(indiginous american) just call us fork tongued lie'un devils...DVC

[SkiprJohn]

I've lived in Hawaii off and on since 1963. I don't think the racism is much different than LA or NY. Its just the target of the racism is a bit different.

Haole's true meaning is without breath. Taken from the color of your skin when you die. It doesn't have anything to do with being a visitor and has everything to do with the color of your skin.

The real problem is that the attitude of government officials, mostly Japanese-American, consider you less than human if you are a boater, don't pay real estate taxes, don't spend a ton of money and don't fly to the islands and stay in a hotel. They just plain don't like anyone who wants to liveaboard a boat.

The state government likes to hire thugs who will enforce their rules without regard to assisting those they serve. And, once a state worker has been hired they are there for life. Can't get rid of them so no matter what they do or how ridiculous they are they are allowed to continue whatever bad behavior they display.

Hawaii is truly a beautiful place and the weather is great. It could be a sailing mecca except for politicians and their workers. It's marinas are junk.

Someone mentioned marinas on the Big Island. There is only one on an island the size of the state of Connecticut surrounded by the Pacific and it doesn't allow liveaboards. It is located just north of Kailua-Kona. So, what does that say about how well boaters are liked?

kind regards,

[roverhi]

I'm a haole living in Hawaii for nearly 40 years. Haole is just a Hawaiian descriptive term for caucasian as Pake is for Chineese. You have to add an adjective to it to make it a slur such as f*****g haole. Yes, there can be racial tension but it's quite often deserved especially by those newcomers (malahini) who say to everyone who will listen, "They don't do it that way back where I come from." I've not had any problems, first being a Sailor stationed at Barbers Point on Oahu and for the last 35 years here in Kona. Granted the Waianae coast of Oahu and Molokai seem to have a lot of the locals who blame the Haole for everything that's gone wrong in their lives. I lived in Makaha for awhile and only problem was I didn't have the stamina to party every night like our local neighbors. They thought we were stuck up because we didn't drink with them every night.

It did take a bit of adjustment to live on the rock. When I first got here was single and blowing all my money in Waikiki chasing tourist chicks and not really liking the place. Had a come to Jesus moment and said to myself, "Self, people pay a lot of money to come to Hawaii and have a great time. Something must be wrong with you if you aren't enjoying it." Started spending a lot of time snorkeling, hiking the mountains, and eventually getting a sailboat that I sailed the crap out of because I couldn't afford to do anything else after making the monthly payment. We've raised our boys and lived the bulk of our lives here. May not stay forever but it's getting pretty close to that.

Anyway, Hawaii isn't LA transplanted to the middle of the Pacific. It's the most racially diverse State in the Union. It's made up of immigrants and their descendants from everywhere in the world with a high percentage from Asia. There cultures have been amalgamated with the Hawaiian and Haole culture that they found here. You just can't barge in with a mainland US mentality and expect not to be resented a bit. For the overwhelming number of the Malahini, they eventually catch on and become Kamaaina (long term resident) and fit in. For those that don't, they usually leave fairly quickly.

Back to marinas. Honokohau Harbor here in Kona has a lot of open slips at the moment. Don't know what the official liveaboard policy is but there have been a bunch of cruisers taking advantage of the 3 month temporary mooring policy and staying here on their boats. There are also a small number of slip holders who seem to always be on or around their boats. If you time it right, you get can get six months in a State Marina because it's 3 months in a calendar year. You can do October, November, December in one year and January, February, March in the following year. For the cruiser who wants to hang out, that gets you through the fall and winter months when high surf pretty much precludes anchoring out. A cruiser can pretty much move around the Islands, if there are open slips, from State Marina to State Marina in three month intervals.

Kawaihae Harbor is probably a non starter. It's a commercial harbor with a few pleasure boat moorings. I believe the State Harbors Division is not renewing the moorings as people give them up. Very limited, if any, possibility of getting an open mooring. You aren't allowed to anchor in Kawaihae or the aborted small boat harbor to the south of the commerical harbor. It can also be a nasty place as the winds often exceed 30 mph. When we had our boat there, the winds blew 30 gusting to 50 for three weeks straight. It's seasonal but you can get short periods of high winds year around and holding is a thin layer of mud over lava.

[SkiprJohn]

I was hoping Peter would respond. He is more familiar with the Honokohau state marina (only marina on the island) and knows the happenings since he lives on that side of the island.

[Aussiesuede]

Originally Posted by JKEMP

That left me with what I think are two options for Oahu... Ala Wai, (I'm there now but there's a 4 month limit and I'm coming close to needing to move) and Keehi State...

Keehi is a non starter for obvious reasons. Your only realistic solution is right where you are @ Ala Wai. You can get temp moorage at a number of small Marinas for short term, but that's no real solution. I'd suggest you start spending some evenings over at the Harbor Pub & Shooters, and start striking up conversations at the bar to try to find out if anyone is about to leave their slip and head out cruising. You can sublet while you keep reupping on the wait list. Other than that, liveaboard in Hawaii is a pretty bleak picture if you want to do so legally, as you're no doubt starting to find out.

[denverd0n]

Originally Posted by roverhi

You just can't barge in with a mainland US mentality and expect not to be resented a bit. For the overwhelming number of the Malahini, they eventually catch on and become Kamaaina (long term resident) and fit in. For those that don't, they usually leave fairly quickly.

I think that's pretty much true no matter where you go.

I live in Florida. Like a huge percentage of residents, not a native. Grew up in Nebraska. I did not come here looking for "Nebraska, only better weather." Came here expecting there would be differences, and knowing that I was going to have to make adjustments. Looking forward to the differences and the adjustments, in fact.

I'm amazed at the number of folks, however, who come down here and then get annoyed because Florida isn't just like wherever they came from. Instead of making adjustments, though, they seem to think everyone ELSE should be the ones adjusting. They want it to be "home, only better weather." (They're the ones who get referred to as "damn yankees.")

I don't doubt there are plenty of folks in Hawaii with that same sort of attitude. They're only there for the weather, and it annoys them that the weather isn't the ONLY difference between Hawaii and wherever they're from. And, yeah, I'm not surprised that--just like Florida--the majority who move there end up moving back home within 2 years, when they realize that it is never going to be home, only better weather.