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Old 17-05-2013, 19:14   #16
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Re: Hobos Afloat

Nobody is riding for free. There are taxes attatched to everything. Period! I can't remember but I think the sales tax in monroe county is 7.5% Don't even get me started with fuel. Everybody, including Ken and Babs does what they can to cut their tax bill. To think somebody isn't paying their fair share is ridiculous. Mitt Romney and Barack Obama both pay smaller % of taxes than me and I am just a working man.
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Old 17-05-2013, 19:36   #17
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Re: Hobos Afloat

In WA state we got rules about this sort of thing. No more than 30 days in a row/90 days in a year are you allowed to anchor in one harbor. Longer than that and you have to pay to tie up.

It's somewhat randomly enforced and some places are rarely checked - but they're the places with no access to anything. Anchorages with access to food, transportation, fuel, etc are pretty regularly checked.
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Old 17-05-2013, 19:52   #18
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Nobody is riding for free. ... To think somebody isn't paying their fair share is ridiculous.
Is sales tax enough?

Talked to a guy today who hasn't filed a tax return in 25 years. He's a captain and a repair guy who lives in the anchorage and is generally broke. I think he's not paying "his fair share". I presume he pays sales tax like we all do. I think he tried to get food stamps but couldn't without showing a tax return.

That's OK with me.

And Catinhand, my only point was those rules, which seem reasonable to me, would be unnecessary without the derelicts. If only the powers would have handled these issues on a case-by-case basis rather than how it was handled. Again, we all suffer for the acts of a few.
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Old 17-05-2013, 19:54   #19
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Re: Hobos Afloat

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What pray tell does this mean?
It's from the "Please turn off your AIS if you're not using it or are in your berth" discussion.
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Old 17-05-2013, 19:59   #20
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Re: Hobos Afloat

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The video/posts of the Homeless in the Florida Keys guy posted in the last couple of days was fun to see especially noting he's been there 30 years! The comments seemed mostly positive. And some municipality has also made note and I presume is trying to get him to move. My guess is the videos are meant to be seeds for an upcoming public response of support, unless I missed the point.

As friendly and harmless as his lifestyle seemed, this is how the anchor wars got started in Miami and Key West. There were many more folks aboard in Miami and Key West, of course, hundreds really, and we see the result now in mooring fields and legislation and water cops and dye packs.

I lived in the anchorage off Dinner Key, Miami, for years and years. Many of us were liveaboards with jobs ashore, and decent boats. Many more, in my memory were folks living like this. With one isolated old fart, it's quaint. With hundreds, it's a public health issue.

I noted that he mentioned hauling trash and sewage ashore and water back. I'll take him at his word about sewage but I know from experience that most will not make that effort. He called himself a hobo but "hobos wander" to quote Wickipedia.

Current Florida law seems to be if the boat moves around a bit, no problem. This seems very reasonable to me as a way to ease the "problem" of liveaboards on derelicts.

2 cents adjusted for inflation.

That's right. If you use your boat, you're not a "live-aboard" in Florida. However, marinas, as private parties, can use the term differently. Gulfport Municipal Marina does not currently allow "live aboards," or people whose boat is their only residence.

They're working on changing that, but what I *heard* was that their restrictions would be so onerous that virtually no one would be able to meet them. For instance, one requirement suggested that live-aboard boats should have 80 gallon GRAY water tanks. Boats that big wouldn't be able to navigate the channel and canal into the marina. Clever, that. Gives everything and nothing to all and no one at the same time.
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Old 17-05-2013, 20:12   #21
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I'm anti-hobo. Waste of resources, makes everyone else look bad.

Bums who don't know a thing about the water and who walk around like captain bob at the local bar.

You can be a mariner on a budget, I love that group. But piss drunk dirt bags have dirt bag friends who steal outboards and f up the environment.
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Old 17-05-2013, 20:16   #22
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In WA state we got rules about this sort of thing. No more than 30 days in a row/90 days in a year are you allowed to anchor in one harbor. Longer than that and you have to pay to tie up.

It's somewhat randomly enforced and some places are rarely checked - but they're the places with no access to anything. Anchorages with access to food, transportation, fuel, etc are pretty regularly checked.
That seems pretty legit. I'm sure anyone with a seaworthy boat and a good attitude is getting enforced against less often as well.
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Old 17-05-2013, 20:18   #23
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Re: Hobos Afloat

I'm in complete agreement the with wise Blue Crab. Keep 'em movin' seems to be the answer. We live at anchor 6 month/year, bring earned money to each new port of call and contribute to the seaside community by purchasing products, services and groceries along with eating at local diners. We keep moving, we don't stop and sponge off the locals and create an eyesore.

I hate it when some bum decides to plant his or her sorry ass on my porch at home, why should I dislike it any less when they do in on the water.

A few years ago in this town, a woman bum would make the rounds and crap in a different doorway each night. God only knows what shorted out in her brain to cause that sort of behavior... But no local resident should have to put up with that.

I see no difference between her behavior and what the bums on boats are doing to the locals.
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Old 17-05-2013, 20:56   #24
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Re: Hobos Afloat

So I'm hearing anti hobo and not in my back yard. Personally I don't think a hobo or bum makes me look bad any more then Bill Gates or the queen of England makes me look good. Though it might not hurt if I stood a little closer to the queen.

It seems in the US anyway there is no where for the homeless/ hobo / bum boater to go. Everyone says something needs to be done, but yet nothing is done and for most there is no where to go when your down and out. I see homeless out and about everywhere. Some camping under bridges or yes in boats that barely float.

Everyone says not in my back yard, but the reality is that there is no place or help for the vast majority of the homeless.

So any idea's on how to help these people raise themselves up. Oh I know, some are too far gone with drugs or drinking. But that can be said for many well to do too.

So should the bums and hobo's be banned from society, moved to a island away from view, put into group homes, tossed in jail or what.
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Old 17-05-2013, 21:17   #25
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"Bums" should not be living on boats. Boats require a high degree of maintenance to keep floating, safe & pollution free.
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Old 17-05-2013, 21:28   #26
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So I'm hearing anti hobo and not in my back yard. Personally I don't think a hobo or bum makes me look bad any more then Bill Gates or the queen of England makes me look good. Though it might not hurt if I stood a little closer to the queen.

It seems in the US anyway there is no where for the homeless/ hobo / bum boater to go. Everyone says something needs to be done, but yet nothing is done and for most there is no where to go when your down and out. I see homeless out and about everywhere. Some camping under bridges or yes in boats that barely float.

Everyone says not in my back yard, but the reality is that there is no place or help for the vast majority of the homeless.

So any idea's on how to help these people raise themselves up. Oh I know, some are too far gone with drugs or drinking. But that can be said for many well to do too.

So should the bums and hobo's be banned from society, moved to a island away from view, put into group homes, tossed in jail or what.
I've worked in the homeless world before. There is a very large group of people, hobos is the right term, who don't want to assimilate into a healthy society.

They have no desire to "right" their situation because to them it's great. These people, exclusively, are the ones in street corners with signs.
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Old 17-05-2013, 21:31   #27
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Be it a well maintained cruiser or a bum in a old boat people will complain because of feeling cheated. People cannot stand that they have to pay a large amount of property taxes to get that view and the live aboard doesn't.

What they fail to think about is the live aboard doesn't have a large piece of property or a big house with a tub and all the amenities. But the live aboards do pay their fair share in taxes for their boat, income, car, sales, etc.

Yes there are a few that don't but majority do. But the argument of jealousy or being cheated doesn't sit well so the Ken and Babs use the excuse of taxes.
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Old 17-05-2013, 21:33   #28
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Re: Hobos Afloat

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"Bums" should not be living on boats. Boats require a high degree of maintenance to keep floating, safe & pollution free.
Well there are a whole lot of bums on boats in the US. Some maybe even many have some skill in repairing boat systems. Met a guy a few days ago who's been living about for over 20 years. So many do somehow make do with very little.

This bum-ette having that 30+ years of engineering, find boat systems pretty easy to maintain.
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Old 17-05-2013, 21:41   #29
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That's not a bum
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Old 17-05-2013, 21:50   #30
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Re: Hobos Afloat

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Well there are a whole lot of bums on boats in the US. Some maybe even many have some skill in repairing boat systems. Met a guy a few days ago who's been living about for over 20 years. So many do somehow make do with very little.

This bum-ette having that 30+ years of engineering, find boat systems pretty easy to maintain.
Your sentiments seem very well placed but there are some real complications with the derelict boats and boaters, sewage discharge being a major one.

Im all for live and let live but keeping your rig presentable and not soiling the environment seem like reasonable and minimal requirements. Its what good neighbors do ashore. I'm guessing that's what you do afloat.
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