AUS. Moving from VIC to QLD liveaboard. Proving residency?

[DevoDave]

Originally Posted by RaymondR

However I will not be re-registering the vessel in Qld even if I am there more than 90 days. Australian registration is of much higher integrity in it's identification of the vessel and it's owner than the state systems and I see no reason why this should not be sufficient for vessel identification purposes.

Wow. I wonder how common this is and whether people who do this cop a whack? I too have my boat listed on the Australian Register of Ships, however my bravery would not extend to letting state Registration lapse.

I understand that if you enter a different state there is a requirement to register the boat there after a certain period of time, and obviously someone circumnavigating Australia will be spending longer than that period in the larger states at least, so there is validity to the premise.

Anyone else do this?

[Lagoon4us]

Federal and State registration are about two different issues, previously any fed registered vessel still had to be state registered..

Has this changed?

Cheers

[DevoDave]

I don't think so..

Shipping Registration Act 1981 amended 12 April 2013.

79 Preservation of State and Territory legislation
This Act is not intended to exclude or limit the operation of any law of a State or Territory providing for the recording or registration of ships where the recording or registration is for a purpose other than the establishment of title, the transfer of title or the grant of nationality in relation to a ship.

RaymondR is rolling the dice.

[casablanca]

The question for full time cruisers (such as myself) is "have I moved interstate?" If you look at the QLD licensing requirements, it says "if you move to Queensland then....". I don't have a copy of the Regulations and the list of definitions which may specify what "moving" means, but as a full time cruiser, I contend that I have not moved to Queensland as my nominal (postal) address remains in NSW.

I have some experience as a regulator, and the onus is on the Regulatory Authority to specify the regulation and conditions that are contravened if punitive action is taken. Many officials overlook this and attempt to apply "policy" or "interpretation".

If I am accused of a contravention I shall politely request a statement in writing setting out the regulation that I am supposed to have contravened. If it can be shown that I am not in compliance I will accept the outcome. For such minor regulations as we are discussing I doubt that most regulatory officers will persevere in a situation which involves written correspondence etc., They have better things to do with their time and don't want to be tied up with someone who is willing to challenge the case. Writing out a ticket is easy, but writing reports and justifying your actions (perhaps to the Minister) is a pain in the rear end and no one wants to do that.

I believe that I am doing "what a reasonable person should do" and doubt that a magistrate (if it ever came to that) would find a case to answer. Worst case is probably a warning and a requirement to comply. After all regulations are intended to provide some public benefit, so it may be argued that pursuing a prosecution of some recreational sailor who is causing no harm is a misuse of public resources.

In this case the law seems not to cover itinerants such as we cruisers so I doubt that anyone has the time to bother with us.

In any case, in 2.5 years I have yet to come across any person from any regulatory agency. So how big a problem is this?

[emmo]

Hi,
I moved to Qld from WA last year, the boat I had bought was on a harbour mooring, that was all good for establishing ID, change of ownership, getting a Qld driver licence, I use Landbase Australia as postal address. When I bought another yacht recently, my local address, C/o CMB, was acceptable because I was in the system. All far easier than I was led to believe, life as a live aboard, no fixed address is simple.

[DevoDave]

As the original poster, I thought I would update this thread with the results of my attempt to become a Queenslander without an actual land address.

The staff at the Government Agency here in Airlie Beach did not bat an eyelid when I said I had no actual address. As I was in the marina thanks to a cyclone warning, they accepted my invoice for the (short-term 10 day) berth without a drama.

Very painless. I now have a lifetime marine licence, and a QLD car/bike/truck licence with an expiry date equal to my VIC licence. They even have my postal address as my brother's address in VIC.

I'm not sure the process would be as easy away from Airlie Beach. Your mileage may vary.

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by DevoDave

As the original poster, I thought I would update this thread with the results of my attempt to become a Queenslander without an actual land address.

The staff at the Government Agency here in Airlie Beach did not bat an eyelid when I said I had no actual address. As I was in the marina thanks to a cyclone warning, they accepted my invoice for the (short-term 10 day) berth without a drama.

Very painless. I now have a lifetime marine licence, and a QLD car/bike/truck licence with an expiry date equal to my VIC licence. They even have my postal address as my brother's address in VIC.

I'm not sure the process would be as easy away from Airlie Beach. Your mileage may vary.

Well done

[haiqu]

I'm originally from Victoria and have a yacht in Sydney and another in Brisbane. The only house I own is in Wairoa, New Zealand.

Victorian car/truck/forklift licences are registered at my brother's address in Victoria, with the postal address as a PO box in North Ipswich Qld belonging to my other brother. If I ever get pulled up in another state I can claim transient status as a "grey nomad." My VW Transporter van is also registered the same way and now that Victoria has abolished the need to affix a rego sticker the annual process of re-registration is as simple as using the internet annually. They also don't require annual vehicle testing, a big reason not to change states.

The Sydney yacht is on a swing mooring and I pay both registration and mooring fees to NSW Maritime. They can be a bit officious about barnacles - and in fact threatened to cancel my mooring for this last year - but can be reasonable when you explain that finding reliable contractors to clean the hull is nigh on impossible and give them a firm date by which you'll get it done personally. Then stick to it! An annual mooring inspection is also a necessity, if they ask to see it you need to be able to supply a receipt for this immediately.

The Brisbane yacht is anchored in the Brisbane River and since it doesn't have an engine currently it doesn't even require registration, but I keep that current anyhow to ensure they can contact me if something goes wrong, which recently happened when the anchor tangled and it ran up a small creek. The papers for this again go to my brother's PO box in QLD. He scans anything that arrives and forwards them by email so I always have a current copy of any paperwork arriving for me.

I went off the electoral roll about 18 months ago as a person of "no fixed abode" but still have the right to vote in the last electorate in which I had a street address, if I so choose. I don't choose to do this, my philosophy being that voting only encourages the bastards.

There's also a trailer registered in QLD which I need to transport large items like engines around the place. Storage of this when away from QLD is one of my largest issues, although a friend in Sydney has been very helpful in letting me use garage space while cruising NZ recently.

Banking can be an issue, especially when your cards expire. I had to forego my NAB debit card for a Visa debit because the NAB couldn't deliver it to anywhere except my Victorian bank branch, whereas the Visa debit could be issued at any branch. It still took them six weeks and several visits to get it for me.

My ham and marine radio licences now also go directly to the QLD PO box. In fact if my brother hadn't offered to do this I'd have to be using some sort of mail redirection service. You'll also find that many items can't be shipped by Australia Post, and having no address means that you'll either need to arrange a local drop point or pick them up personally. This includes batteries, epoxy glues and paint especially.

For those of you considering buying property in NZ you'll find that the local council computerized systems are woefully behind the times - for instance, they have no concept of a separate postal address - but that doing stuff over the counter is a doddle and they're always friendly and willing to help.

All in all it's a bit of a nightmare, but you get it in order eventually. Keep a spreadsheet of all your expiry dates and monitor the addresses regularly to ensure everything is arriving where and when it should. Don't expect goverment departments to have workable internet interfaces for anything, and expect long delays when you email them.

Since I haven't stayed in any one state for more than 6 months in the past three years, I simply ignore the three months residential requirement as being logistically impossible to comply with.

[haiqu]

Originally Posted by Lagoon4us

Federal and State registration are about two different issues, previously any fed registered vessel still had to be state registered..

Has this changed?

Cheers

This only applies if you're continuously within the state for three months. For a cruiser on the move constantly it's irrelevant.

In practice, if you aquire a permanent mooring anywhere you'll need state registration.