Visit our Popular Forums

Group9 · 05-01-2015, 07:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hudson Force

We should expand this prejudice to include people who are "campers". I believe there are people who camp out under highway overpasses and use fast food restrooms to bathe and change their clothes. Certainly another group without morals and likely involved in theft and sex crimes. Tent campers are likely less desirable than those that use trailers. What about the hikers too? They seem to be wandering about without the material ownership of more respectable citizens. There should be some authority to round up these people too!

Don't give them any ideas for "a permanent solution" to undesirables.

Julie Mor · 05-01-2015, 09:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Group9

Don't give them any ideas for "a permanent solution" to undesirables.

Yes. Just dehumanize them and then you don't have to worry about having a guilty conscience.

Group9 · 05-01-2015, 11:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Julie Mor

Yes. Just dehumanize them and then you don't have to worry about having a guilty conscience.

I don't think you got my reference. It was a take off from, and a reference to, "the final solution", which was about as dehumanizing as it was possible to be.

And, yes, I realize I just violated Godwin's Law.

Julie Mor · 05-01-2015, 13:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Group9

I don't think you got my reference. It was a take off from, and a reference to, "the final solution", which was about as dehumanizing as it was possible to be.

And, yes, I realize I just violated Godwin's Law.

Sorry I wasn't clear. I knew where you were going. And I was agreeing with you.

phipseml · 22-01-2015, 15:02

Hi,

I haven't read all of this very long thread, but from the beginning few posts I got the impression that at least in the US some people are living on boats which are anchored. If that is so, isn't that extremely stressfull in the long run? Or are you guys hanging on permanent moorings? Or am I just too careful? Or are you anchor places perfect and the weather always easy?

I also understood that there are things like specialized piers for dinghys, which even have to be paid for sometimes? Oh man, it must be really crowded where you live! Can't wait to come and visit....

Phil

**Hudson Force** · 22-01-2015, 15:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Julie Mor

Sorry I wasn't clear. I knew where you were going. And I was agreeing with you.

Put me on the list,- I'm agreeing too!

craftcorrection · 03-06-2015, 19:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by flagorio

IIRC, the anti-liveaboard movement in SF Bay was started by some rich guy in Tibouron's wife who ran off with a liveaboard from Richardson Bay. This so pissed off the guy that he started a campaign and was instrumental in creating an oversight agency for the bay. My memory fails as to names and agencies but archives from Latitude 38 may fill in the details. So we not only ruin views, poop and pollute, we run off with land lubber's wives.

I'd be likely to believe that is old wives tales. What I remember is basically tax resentment by those that pay it and those that collect it.

About 25 years ago, there was a guy in the north bay who was living aboard a very unique floating house. Most of it was below water and I believe it was hexagon in shape, with palm trees on top. I think he had a baby grand piano in it. It was a landmark much like the dome house on 280 on the northbound side below San Francisco.

The local news channels started to do stories occasionally about that guy, and the lack of taxes he paid. All that whipped up resentment, and laws and tax collection procedures were changed to where we are today.

Capt Phil · 04-06-2015, 06:10

I recall the same story when I lived in the Bay Area years ago. Tibouron became the hotbed of anti-liveaboards at the time. Not without reason, however. While there were a few really well maintained vessels in Richardson Bay, many of them were just floating trash. There were regular sinking among the fleet back in the eighties as well. When the cleanup started, a number just sank their floating home and moved ashore. It was also a hotbed of drug use and sales. The authorities went a little overboard trying to cleanup the mess but eventually got it done. From what I hear, there are still old vessels lttering the bottom of the Bay.
A similar situation developed in the south end of San Diego bay which was resolved over time back in the nineties.
It has been my experience that live aboards are generally welcome in marinas. They are there all he time, are added security and cause few problems. If problems do develop, the others who make their home aboard find ways to make the uglies unwelcome.
I lived aboard for many years from Alaska to Puerto Vallarta, lived the life style, the people and the serenity (except on weekends!). Phil

Capt Phil · 04-06-2015, 06:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wrong

Somehow we've got to get away from the 'them' & 'us' argument and focus on equal access and use issues. Whether your iconic boater is low income or rich, neither has the right to exclusive use of public waterways and anchorages.

Not sure why but this post reminded me of a guy who lived aboard in Sunroad Marina in San Diego back in the mid nineties. His boat was really just trash, no maintenance at all, covered in junk he collected. He drank heavily, smelled bad and was really an eyesore and pain in the backside! They finally evicted him from the marina but he just anchored off the marina entrance and would row to the marina at night for water. One night another live aboard ran into a young girl about eight years old who had rowed in to pick up water from the hose on the dock. She was filthy dirty and had clearly been sexually abused as well as physically. The police were called and they hauled the guy off his boat and dropped him in jail. The girl was passed on to CPS. Not a pleasant recollection but there is a dark side to some live boards. Phil

Wrong · 04-06-2015, 08:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by phipseml

Hi,

I haven't read all of this very long thread, but from the beginning few posts I got the impression that at least in the US some people are living on boats which are anchored. If that is so, isn't that extremely stressfull in the long run? Or are you guys hanging on permanent moorings? Or am I just too careful? Or are you anchor places perfect and the weather always easy?

I also understood that there are things like specialized piers for dinghys, which even have to be paid for sometimes? Oh man, it must be really crowded where you live! Can't wait to come and visit....

Phil

On the U.S. West Coast many reasonably well sheltered anchorages have either been closed or restrictions on anchoring imposed. In the case of restrictions they prevent anchoring for more than a set number of days and require permits. Most will require you to stay away for 30 days before returning to apply for another permit. So, it's become nigh impossible to live aboard and move between anchorages month to month.
As recently as 2009-2010 if you are a cruiser it was possible to drop your anchor in Sausalito, Ca. for a short to long stay. Now, both sides of the main channel are stuffed to near maximum capacity by 'illegally moored' boats of every description and size. When I say maximum capacity, the standard was met years ago for anyone wanting to drop the hook. Now, it's approaching the point that there's little room for additional illegally moored boats too.

Most boaters realize the swing of an anchored boat around it's anchor with adequate scope is incompatible with moored boats. So, anchoring anywhere but in the channel is not possible. Which is where transient cruisers end up anchoring...

The illegally moored boats are on moorings consisting of multiple anchors connected with seperate chain lengths at a swivel. If there is no mooring ball in the mix they appear to be anchored... So, good luck anchoring near boats you believe are at anchor.

Otherwise, boats that are genuinely 'at anchor' - or so you think - are on all rope with a short length of chain with some sort of weight below tentatively keeping the boat in place. A rock? 10# anchor for a 30' boat?

The Richardson Bay Regional Agency has a pretty sizeable budget for disposing of abandoned, sunk and boats that drag in winter storms causing damage to shoreline property and other boats. Quite a spectacle watching Coasties round them up during a storm.

Which is precisely why I pay the port to use their mooring.....

Dingy docks are clogged with oversize runabouts, john boats and every other kind of inappropriate type of floating piece of crap imaginable. Properly securing a painter to a cleat is a lost art.

Don't get me started...

Nicholson58 · 07-06-2015, 18:46

Its not just boaters in Florida. Its anyone who manages an independent life, free of dependence on infrastructure.

Â» Florida Court Rules â€œOff Gridâ€ Living Illegal Alex Jones' Infowars: There's a war on for your mind!

Terra Nova · 07-06-2015, 20:20

58--good post.

Stu Jackson · 07-06-2015, 20:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by craftcorrection

About 25 years ago, there was a guy in the north bay who was living aboard a very unique floating house. Most of it was below water and I believe it was hexagon in shape, with palm trees on top. I think he had a baby grand piano in it. It was a landmark much like the dome house on 280 on the northbound side below San Francisco.

Still floating on The Bay.

At Pier 39, where the sea lions hang out, west side.