Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 01-12-2011, 20:18   #16
Senior Cruiser
 
Vasco's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Toronto
Boat: CS36Merlin, "La Belle Aurore" Ben393 "Breathless"
Posts: 7,138
Re: Anchor Light Problem

Hellosailor,

Again I ask, are you required to have an anchor light when not anchored. I'm presently in Florida but I do not show an anchor light when not anchored.
__________________

__________________
Rick I
Toronto in summer, Bahamas in winter.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/beneteau393/
Vasco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2011, 20:30   #17
Senior Cruiser
 
skipmac's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: 29° 49.16’ N 82° 25.82’ W
Boat: Pearson 422
Posts: 12,379
Re: Anchor Light Problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vasco View Post
Hellosailor,

Again I ask, are you required to have an anchor light when not anchored. I'm presently in Florida but I do not show an anchor light when not anchored.
It will depend on where in Florida you are and what the local authorities require. Ever locale seems to make their own rules.

I was anchored in the St Johns River and displayed a legal anchor light. The local water police came by all the boats anchored in the area and informed them that due to the active night time fishing all boats had to have two anchor lights. Only place in the world I was ever told that.

Regardless of whether you are "required" to show an anchor light or not in a designated mooring area, I would be tempted to show one just in case.
__________________

__________________
The water is always bluer on the other side of the ocean.
skipmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2011, 17:26   #18
֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 13,039
Re: Anchor Light Problem

Rick, from Coast Pilot v.4
United States Coast Pilot®

"
Part 110–Anchorage Regulations
§110.1 General.


(633)
(a) The areas described in subpart A of this part
are designated as special anchorage areas for purposes
of 33 U.S.C. §§2030(g) and 2035(j). Vessels of less than
20 meters in length, and barges, canal boats, scows, or
other nondescript craft, are not required to sound signals
required by rule 35 of the Inland Navigation Rules
(33 U.S.C. 2035). Vessels of less than 20 meters are not
required to exhibit anchor lights or shapes required by
rule 30 of the Inland Navigation Rules (33 U.S.C. 2030).
(634)


(b) The anchorage grounds for vessels described in
Subpart B of this part are established, and the rules and
regulations in relation thereto adopted, pursuant to the
authority contained in section 7 of the act of March 4,
1915, as amended (38 Stat. 1053; 33 U.S.C. 471)."

If your vessel is under 20 meters, the USCG apparently doesn't care if you are lit. Florida Statutes may also have bearing, and local statutes may also have bearing. You'd need to check both to be sure. If you are in a mooring field or anchorage which is under local control, they get to set rules in addition to the USCG rules.

What's the harm of leaving an anchor light on in any case?

__________________
hellosailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2011, 17:53   #19
Senior Cruiser
 
Vasco's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Toronto
Boat: CS36Merlin, "La Belle Aurore" Ben393 "Breathless"
Posts: 7,138
Re: Anchor Light Problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
What's the harm of leaving an anchor light on in any case? [/SIZE][/FONT]
[/LEFT]
That's not the issue. The issue is getting fined if you do not have one on a mooring. Being on a mooring is not being anchored.
__________________
Rick I
Toronto in summer, Bahamas in winter.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/beneteau393/
Vasco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2011, 17:58   #20
Marine Service Provider
 
AnchorageGuy's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Wherever the boat is!
Boat: Marine Trader 34DC
Posts: 4,618
Re: Anchor Light Problem

The Coast Guard designates a "Special Anchorage" on a chart and boats are not required to have an anchor light withing these anchorages. Note that this only applies to Inland Rules. The anchorage in Boot Key harbor, including the moorings, requires an anchor light because Boot key harbor is not inside the Colregs so is not considered for Inland Rules. The Special Anchorage designation for the Ashley River in Charleston was recently removed and all boats within that anchorage are now required to display and anchor light. Chuck
__________________
Chesapeake Bay, ICW Hampton Roads To Key West, The Gulf Coast, The Bahamas

The Trawler Beach House
Voyages Of Sea Trek
AnchorageGuy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2011, 18:26   #21
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,949
Re: Anchor Light Problem

The dockmaster at the Ft. Myers City Yacht Basin is very helpful and professional. I would contact him first. Florida is one of the few states that is paranoid about anchor lights. Unless you are in a Special Anchorage Area marked on the charts (very rare) use an anchor light whether or not you are at anchor or on a mooring when in Florida. If it were New England nobody would ever expect you to have an anchor light up when on a mooring. In fact, when I have accidently left my anchor light on when on a mooring I have had people contact me to tell me I left my light on! But, when in Florida do as the Floridians do and always use an anchor light.

By the way, it is international law that you should have one on unless in a Special Anchorage, even if they don't enforce it most places.
__________________
Kettlewell Cruising
Kettlewell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2011, 22:08   #22
֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 13,039
Re: Anchor Light Problem

Rick-
From the folks at Merriam-Webster, who claim to be part of the Encylcopedia Britannica brainpool:
"
anchor ...

Definition of ANCHOR

transitive verb
1: to hold in place in the water by an anchor <anchor a ship>

2: to secue firmly : fix <anchor a post in concrete>


...

Synonyms: ... moor, secure, set "

You'll note the MOOR is considered a synonym for ANCHOR. (Much moitted here for brevity.)

Now, as to how that affects you as a sailor? Somewhere, there are international, US, and Florida State definitions of "anchored" and again, it doesn't matter what you or I or the dictionary writers think. If the folks who wrote the statute governing your waters did a merely competent job--they've defined at as it applies in their regulations.

Ooopsie, FS327 seems to have been written by less than competent scribes, it doesn't define "anchored".

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes :->2010->Chapter 327 : Online Sunshine

Which would leave the definition open to court process. Of course if you've been given a summons, in general it is required to cite specific code violations. Are you accused of violating a specific municipal code that required a light?

COLREGS is also apparently silent, using the terms "anchored" "aground" and under way, but not mentioning the word "moored" even though it is obvious that lighting patterns for freighters moored in major harbors MUST be covered by these definitions. To me, that suggests a mooring is just anchoring, with a float on the rope and an anchor belonging to someone else.

Then there's
33 CFR 82.5 - Lights for moored vessels.

Finally, a citation in US Federal law for moored vessels! While it appears to be limited to barges...it does say such vessels shall be treated as anchored.

Title 33: Navigation and Navigable Waters

CHAPTER I: COAST GUARD, DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY

SUBCHAPTER D: INTERNATIONAL NAVIGATION RULES

PART 82: 72 COLREGS: INTERPRETATIVE RULES

82.5 - Lights for moored vessels.

For the purposes of Rule 30 of the 72 COLREGS, a vessel at anchor includes a barge made fast to one or more mooring buoys or other similar device attached to the sea or river floor. Such a barge may be lighted as a vessel at anchor in accordance with Rule 30, or may be lighted on the corners in accordance with 33 CFR 88.13.

Guess it is going to depend on the code you are cited for violating.
__________________
hellosailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2011, 00:28   #23
Senior Cruiser
 
rebel heart's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 6,190
Images: 3
Re: Anchor Light Problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vasco View Post
That's not the issue. The issue is getting fined if you do not have one on a mooring. Being on a mooring is not being anchored.
I don't think the separation works like that. If the water is navigable and you're stopping your boat in it, you need to have your vessel illuminated (unless for other reasons in colregs it doesn't need to be).

You would establish a special anchorage area in concert with installing moorings. Who cares if you're tied to a tree, anchored, or secured to a mooring? It's the fact that your vessel is stopped in an area that charts say should be safely navigable. Stop your vessel in one of those, and you need to illuminate it.
__________________
rebel heart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2011, 04:50   #24
Senior Cruiser
 
Blue Stocking's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: St. Georges, Bda
Boat: Rhodes Reliant 41ft
Posts: 4,115
Re: Anchor Light Problem

Stand your ground. If you think you are right to not show a light, even though the local authority require it, don't show it.
And if the boat gets run down, and sunk, you can decide if you use your last 100K to buy another boat--or pay the lawyers.
__________________
so many projects--so little time !!
Blue Stocking is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2011, 06:27   #25
Senior Cruiser
 
Vasco's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Toronto
Boat: CS36Merlin, "La Belle Aurore" Ben393 "Breathless"
Posts: 7,138
Re: Anchor Light Problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
Then there's
33 CFR 82.5 - Lights for moored vessels.

Finally, a citation in US Federal law for moored vessels! While it appears to be limited to barges...it does say such vessels shall be treated as anchored.

Title 33: Navigation and Navigable Waters

CHAPTER I: COAST GUARD, DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY

SUBCHAPTER D: INTERNATIONAL NAVIGATION RULES

PART 82: 72 COLREGS: INTERPRETATIVE RULES

82.5 - Lights for moored vessels.

For the purposes of Rule 30 of the 72 COLREGS, a vessel at anchor includes a barge made fast to one or more mooring buoys or other similar device attached to the sea or river floor. Such a barge may be lighted as a vessel at anchor in accordance with Rule 30, or may be lighted on the corners in accordance with 33 CFR 88.13.
First although not being a lawyer I would think that under the rules of interpretation because it specifically states "barges", the statute or rule therefore excludes other vessels.

On the matter of synonyms I do not think that applies to vessels. An anchor is an anchor, there is no dispute as far as vessels go as to what an anchor is or when one is anchored. Now in the olden days, when I was at sea we would show an anchor light or ball, even if made fast to a wharf, if the anchor was down. Many times when going alongside an anchor would be let go to ease the bow alongside and to assist in getting the bow off the dock when departing. No bow thrusters in those days.

My point (getting a bit belaboured now) is that, from what I understand, the requirement of an "anchor light" in a mooring field is not a safety issue but a bureaucratic device that a jurisdiction uses to gain revenue similar to requiring sidelights on dinks in some jurisdictions.

As for compliance, off course I would comply in such a jurisdiction. One of the few mooring fields in Florida I go to is in Vero Beach. No one shows an anchor light there. It would be interesting if the OP could cite the Ft. Myers regulation.
__________________
Rick I
Toronto in summer, Bahamas in winter.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/beneteau393/
Vasco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2011, 07:51   #26
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,949
Re: Anchor Light Problem

It has long been established in international maritime law that what we are calling a mooring has no legal distinction from what we are calling an anchor. After all, a mooring is just a very heavy anchor. In Ft. Myers Inland rules apply, period. There is no dispute on this. There is no local regulation that matters on anchor lights. Sure, there is different enforcement of this, but the rule is unless you're in a Special Anchorage you are supposed to have an anchor light up. Follow the rules of the road and you will be legal.

Shapes and Lights
To alert other boats of conditions that may be hazardous, there are requirements to display lights at night and shapes during the day.
Figure 7

Anchored Boats
Motorboats and sailboats at anchor must display anchor lights. An anchor light for a watercraft less than 50 meters (164 feet) in length is an all-around white light, visible for 2 miles exhibited where it can best be seen (see Figure 7).

Watercraft at anchor shall exhibit forward where best seen, a ball shape (see Figure 8).
Figure 8

Boats less than 7 meters (22.96 feet) are not required to display anchor lights or day shapes unless anchored in or near a narrow channel, fairway or anchorage, or where other boats normally navigate. Anchor lights are not required on boats less than 20 meters (65.62 feet) anchored in special anchorages in inland waters designated by the Secretary of Transportation.
__________________
Kettlewell Cruising
Kettlewell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2011, 10:14   #27
Registered User
 
Sailor g's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Southern California
Posts: 1,137
Did the OP get someone to help him? I'm not sure if we heard back from the person in need of help...
__________________

__________________
Sailor g is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
anchor

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Battery-Charging Regulator Problem ? MasterVolt Problem ? RJV Electrical: Batteries, Generators & Solar 18 06-11-2011 23:53
Problem with New Motor Idling Target9000 Engines and Propulsion Systems 8 12-10-2011 17:34
Problem Since 2.2.918 - Garmin Won't Work MarkJ OpenCPN 28 29-06-2011 18:40



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 14:18.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.