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Old 10-03-2011, 09:34   #16
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Re: Would 'this' Be Breaking the Rules ?

WITHOUT the selling part, sounds great..WITH the selling part, I'd pass. Never had much use for folks who use friendship as a license to pedal..
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Old 10-03-2011, 14:55   #17
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Re: Would this Be Breaking the Rules ?

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Originally Posted by grunzster View Post
s/v 'Faith' - NO WAY I'm going to become that guy. This is something I'd do part time on occasion, and it would be advertised as such. And even then I think I'd be really casual about it. Like here's some catalogs for what this thing is all about. Now let's just go out and have some fun.
Free beer and steak.

I'm onboard!

I'll even bring the salad.

But I don't know how you can afford it.
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Old 10-03-2011, 16:23   #18
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Re: Would 'this' Be Breaking the Rules ?

Those parties work for the ladies but the guys, not so sure.
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Old 10-03-2011, 16:41   #19
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Re: Don't be 'that guy'

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Originally Posted by s/v 'Faith' View Post
Apart from the legality, let's talk for a minute about the REAL rules...

... those of good decorum.

In other words, 'Don't be THAT guy'

I remember meeting a guy on Hamburger beach... he was kinda annoying, and I noticed most people steered clear of him.

He had this really obnoxious habit of talking about what people do/did for a living... one of the nice thing about cruising is to GET AWAY from these people.

Turns out, he was a financial planner and was looking for 'prospects' among his fellow cruisers. Completely uncool IMHO. Might be ok, if he were laid back about it... AND UP FRONT. But this 'hanging out' was kind of sleazy.

If I encountered a Am Way sales pitch while out cruising I would react the same way.

I don't know how your 'parties' work, but my advice is to be up front...

If you invite folks over for cocktails and start trying to peddle something you risk becoming 'that guy'.

if you are 'that guy' in the anchorage / marina you may find your list of friends gets short in a hurry.
"THAT GUY" with the free steaks and beers? Sounds like a great "THAT GUY" to me!
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Old 10-03-2011, 16:46   #20
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Re: Would 'this' Be Breaking the Rules ?

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Never had much use for folks who use friendship as a license to pedal..
That's just a little bit of a stretch.

I understand what you're saying, though. I've cut a few friends loose over the years, because they were a PITA to ever get in touch with, yet they'd pretty much spam you with every latest thing they were trying to sell.

Key words here, "part-time" and "on occasion". Also, I'd primarily use facebook for promoting. So just an occasional post or invite on there. If you're not interested, you're still more than welcome to come to the non selling parties (I understand) and I'll leave you off the next invite.

Maybe that still meets your definition, but if anything I think it would be way less annoying than the political rants most people have on facebook on a daily basis. Besides it seems all anyone uses that site for these days is to promote something.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Therapy View Post
But I don't know how you can afford it.
Of course I get a discount.
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Old 10-03-2011, 18:17   #21
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Re: Would 'this' Be Breaking the Rules ?

Ask yourself, would it hold up in Coastie Court where they are the judge, jury and prosecutor?
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Old 10-03-2011, 18:46   #22
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Re: Would 'this' Be Breaking the Rules ?

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Ask yourself, would it hold up in Coastie Court where they are the judge, jury and prosecutor?
You've got that right!

Back in my scuba instructor days I couldn't get my six-pack certification because I couldn't pass the color blindness test. That meant I couldn't take students or clients out on my dive boat. Period. One day, a buddy and I were spearfishing, and the Coasties boarded us at anchor at the end of the dive. They asked my buddy if he was my student, and he replied "yes," which was true because he was working on his divemaster certification, which is about a six-month process. But spearfishing isn't in any way part of this training, and the fact was that this buddy was really just a fishing buddy on that particular day. This was really not an instructor/student relationship; I was even his son's godfather.

So the boarding officer said he was going to impound my boat. Just like that. At that point, my buddy pulled his wallet out of his dry bag and produced a military ID. He was a captain in the US Army, a captain with Ranger training, a combat infantry badge, and a Silver Star. (He was promoted to Major shortly after he got his divemaster rating.)

The Coasties let us go. But I wonder to this day what might have happened had my buddy been a mere civilian. Thank the gods he outranked the Coastie boarding officer.
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Old 17-03-2011, 18:04   #23
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Re: Would 'this' Be Breaking the Rules ?

Completely legal sounding. Even sounds kind of fun. It kind of makes for a fun salesroom.
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Old 17-03-2011, 20:52   #24
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Re: Would this Be Breaking the Rules ?

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Sharing expenses is "not for hire." There is a lot more expense beyond fuel.
There has been considerable USCG discussion of "sharing expenses" as meaning a commercial operation. The missing word above to make it Not commercial is "actual" between "sharing" and "expenses." Actual expenses can be shared but they cannot be pre-determined before the trip. After you return from the sail then you can add up the receipts/invoices and split/share the "actual expenses" without jeopardizing your classification.
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Old 17-03-2011, 21:48   #25
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Re: Would 'this' Be Breaking the Rules ?

Seems the USCG should have better things to do than go after the small fry, but I am not part of that community.

Would it not be safer from both a legal and practical perspective, if the boat was tied to a stable dock for a private party?

Booze and BBQ’s take time to heat up and cool down.
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Old 17-03-2011, 22:37   #26
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Re: Would 'this' Be Breaking the Rules ?

Therapy came up with your sales line for you .... Free beer, free steak, how can i afford it heck how cant i afford with these low prices!!!!
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Old 28-04-2011, 11:00   #27
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Re: Would 'this' Be Breaking the Rules ?

You'd be completely legal as long as you set things up as described in your first post. No one would be giving you any form of consideration as a condition for going along on the outing. You might run into a snag if you REQUIRED the guys to buy something as a condition for going, but as long as you are providing the refreshments at no charge you'd be just as legal as a person who sold a fellow boater an anchor or a bottle of milk while on board. You are not selling the boat trip, that's free, so no problem.
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Old 28-04-2011, 11:24   #28
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Re: Would 'this' Be Breaking the Rules ?

Who cares about the legality. I'd say no to "Mancave", and some would say yes. I'm sure it's a lot of fun, just not my style...

In any event, how is it different than a cruiser who pulls up and offers to stitch canvas on their Sailrite or splice a few ropes? Do you declare income or live under the radar? If you're textbook perfect you'll declare it on your tax return and deduct the xerox copies from Kinkos on which you wrote your invoice.

Does the government need $3.28 in income from your entrepenurial endeavour? You bet, Lloyd Blankfein needs new artwork for his office - he's thinking Picasso....
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Old 28-04-2011, 11:49   #29
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Re: Would 'this' Be Breaking the Rules ?

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Originally Posted by harryrezz View Post
You are not selling the boat trip, that's free, so no problem.
Fascinating legal advice.

A few years ago, Champlin's Marina on Block Island started a free launch service (a water taxi) from the anchorage to the docks, and was competing with Old Port Launch, who charged for their services. Old Port Launch had all licensed captains, and Champlin's used unlicensed captains.

Not all of Champlin's launch passengers even went to their facility, but most did. And no one who used the launch was required to buy anything from Champlins. Some just came in to shore to catch a taxi to town.

Champlin's claimed that because they didn't charge for the boat ride, they didn't need licensed captains. Old Port made a query to the USCG, who investigated and determined that because Champlin's potentially profited by bringing passengers to their marina, they needed licensed launch drivers, and the USCG ordered Champlin's to stop operating with unlicensed drivers.

Champlin's Marina still offers free launch service, but all their operators are now licensed, because the USCG told them so.

Quote:
Free launch requires licensed operators By K. D. Weaver

Sep 06, 2003

Champlin's Marina must use licensed launch operators for its free launch service, determined Coast Guard attorneys last week.
Following the decision, the Coast Guard Office of Marine Safety (OMS) set a Sept. 26 deadline for the marina to employ ...


Free launch requires licensed operators By K. D. Weaver - - Block Island Times - News, Classifieds, Events and Business in Block Island, RI

The phrase "for consideration" is open to interpretation.
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