Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 22-10-2012, 12:36   #16
Marine Service Provider
 
boatpoker's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Toronto, Ontario or Bahamas
Boat: Benford 38 Fantail Cruiser
Posts: 2,593
Re: Retirement age of a diesel engine

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluewaters2812 View Post
Yes I agree that an idling, or just above idle engine running the fridge shouldn't be a big problem ... I would think that would be easy work for a diesel?
Protracted iding for a diesel will shorten its lifespan. A properly maintained and properly run diesel should easily last 10,0o0hrs but sailboat diesels are seldom run properly.

Excerpt below from http://www.pcmarinesurveys.com/New%2...%20Engines.htm

Diesels run considerably hotter than gas engines (approx. 180 - 190F) and as a by product of combustion produce considerable moisture which is burnt off the cylinder walls when the engine gets up to full operating temperature. A diesel will never get up to full temperature idling and should never be idled for more than a few minuts.; it must be put under load to get up to temperature. Diesels should never be run hard until they are at full temperature as all the various metals which expand and contract (more than gas) at different rates must be allowed to equalize. The same applies in reverse when cooling down. Abruptly shutting off a hot diesel is a brutal thing to do to all the metals involved and will leave considerable condensate (can happen from proteacted idling too) in the engine. If you want to see how not to run a diesel and shorten its life by 50-60% go to any yacht club on a Wednesday night. All the sailboats are fired up, leave the harbour at full throttle and then are shut down so that they can get the sails up and go racing. The process is repeated on the way back to the bar. The engines never get a chance to warm up or cool down properly and this takes years off their lives. Consult your engine manual, it will tell you the optimum termperature and RPM to run at. This is not just for fuel efficiency but also for longevity. Immediately after starting up always look at your exhaust and see that lots of water is coming out.
__________________

__________________
That hysterical laughter you hear as you sail a way in your "new" boat ..... is the seller.
boatpoker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-10-2012, 12:36   #17
Senior Cruiser
 
Sailmonkey's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Houston
Boat: '76 Allied Seawind II, 32'
Posts: 5,766
Re: Retirement age of a diesel engine

FWIW I just came off of a fairly ordinary 90' shirmp boat 3 hours ago. The generator engines each had in excess of 20,000 hours of runtime with no rebuild, the mains were approaching 20,000 hours. These are engines installed in a commercial fishing vessel, so the maintenance isn't exactaly stellar, but the oil is changed and the engines are run a lot.

What I have seen as the largest problem with pleasure craft installations is not being worn out from use by and large, but rather a host of insurmountable problems from lack of use.

We've got 1800 hrs on our 3 cylinder kubota engine in the boat. I've also got a stationary genset that has 4500 hours on the same model engine, it starts easily and burns no oil.
__________________

__________________
Sailmonkey is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 22-10-2012, 12:47   #18
Registered User
 
markpierce's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Central California
Boat: M/V Carquinez Coot
Posts: 3,413
Re: Retirement age of a diesel engine

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cotemar View Post
Does not matter if its a Green (Volvo Penta), Grey (Yanmar) or Red (Westerbeke).
They all will get you a good 5000 hrs
How about white (John Deere)?

__________________
markpierce is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-10-2012, 12:54   #19
Senior Cruiser
 
DeepFrz's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Winnipeg
Boat: None at this time
Posts: 7,930
Re: Retirement age of a diesel engine

Egret has over 10,000 miles on her Lugger and still going strong last I heard. I don't believe there was anything but maintenance performed on her.

::Welcome to Nordhavn.com::
__________________
DeepFrz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-10-2012, 14:01   #20
Registered User
 
Bluewaters2812's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Cruising
Boat: Not a Beneteau!
Posts: 911
Images: 1
Send a message via Skype™ to Bluewaters2812
Re: Retirement age of a diesel engine

Quote:
Originally Posted by onestepcsy37 View Post
my perkins 4-108 is 33 years old now and still running well. can't tell you how many hours as the clock was broken when i bought the boat and i've never fixed it - i keep an engine log instead. i'm pretty certain the engine has more than 2000 hours.
Wow, that certainly must be breaking a few records lol. I gather you have serviced and maintained it properly.
__________________
Bluewaters2812 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-10-2012, 14:17   #21
Senior Cruiser
 
Sailmonkey's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Houston
Boat: '76 Allied Seawind II, 32'
Posts: 5,766
Re: Retirement age of a diesel engine

The Arthur foss is running on an engine that was installed in 1934. It replaced a reciprocating steam engine.
__________________
Sailmonkey is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 22-10-2012, 14:31   #22
Registered User
 
Snore's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: St Petersburg
Boat: Tartan 33
Posts: 1,880
Quote:
Originally Posted by boatpoker

Protracted iding for a diesel will shorten its lifespan. A properly maintained and properly run diesel should easily last 10,0o0hrs but sailboat diesels are seldom run properly.

Excerpt below from http://www.pcmarinesurveys.com/New%2...%20Engines.htm
Boat poker I would like to read that article, but the link does not work. When I googled "new to diesel engines" I could not find that article. Could you provide a link?


+1 for the maintenance. I changed the oils and filter the day I bought Cynosure and change the engine oil and filter every 100 hours. Based on comments in another thread, when I get to the dock I idle the engine for about 10 minutes and run the blower after shut down for 10-15 minutes to cool the engine compartment.

Thanks
__________________
"Whenever...it requires a strong moral principle to prevent me from deliberately stepping into the street, and methodically knocking people's hats off- then, I account it high time to get to sea..." Ishmael
Snore is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 22-10-2012, 14:39   #23
Registered User
 
Bluewaters2812's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Cruising
Boat: Not a Beneteau!
Posts: 911
Images: 1
Send a message via Skype™ to Bluewaters2812
Re: Retirement age of a diesel engine

Quote:
Originally Posted by boatpoker View Post
Protracted iding for a diesel will shorten its lifespan. A properly maintained and properly run diesel should easily last 10,0o0hrs but sailboat diesels are seldom run properly.

Excerpt below from http://www.pcmarinesurveys.com/New%2...%20Engines.htm

Diesels run considerably hotter than gas engines (approx. 180 - 190F) and as a by product of combustion produce considerable moisture which is burnt off the cylinder walls when the engine gets up to full operating temperature. A diesel will never get up to full temperature idling and should never be idled for more than a few minuts.; it must be put under load to get up to temperature. Diesels should never be run hard until they are at full temperature as all the various metals which expand and contract (more than gas) at different rates must be allowed to equalize. The same applies in reverse when cooling down. Abruptly shutting off a hot diesel is a brutal thing to do to all the metals involved and will leave considerable condensate (can happen from proteacted idling too) in the engine. If you want to see how not to run a diesel and shorten its life by 50-60% go to any yacht club on a Wednesday night. All the sailboats are fired up, leave the harbour at full throttle and then are shut down so that they can get the sails up and go racing. The process is repeated on the way back to the bar. The engines never get a chance to warm up or cool down properly and this takes years off their lives. Consult your engine manual, it will tell you the optimum termperature and RPM to run at. This is not just for fuel efficiency but also for longevity. Immediately after starting up always look at your exhaust and see that lots of water is coming out.
That seems like good and informed advice and I will take a mental note of that, thanks.
__________________
Bluewaters2812 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-10-2012, 14:53   #24
Moderator
 
Dockhead's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Cowes (Winter), Baltic (Summer) (the boat!); somewhere in the air (me!)
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 19,737
Re: Retirement age of a diesel engine

My father's boat has a Westerbeke (so Perkins) 4-108 made in 1982, so 30 years ago. When he bought the boat in 1996, there were 9,000-odd hours on the clock - and the clock was broken God knows how long before that. He has run the hell out of it since then -- his boat sails so badly, he motors 80% of the time. I wouldn't be surprised if he has put another 9,000 hours on it in his 16 years of ownership (he has been retired since then and cruising full time). He doesn't know anything about idling harming diesel engines, and without a genset, he idles it for hours at a time "warming it up", and charging batteries. Despite all this, it runs like a top. Spews oil all over the place, but disposable diapers deal with that. I think marine diesel engines can last for a very, very long time as long as you don't overheat them, run them out of oil, or grossly abuse them in some other way.
__________________
Dockhead is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 22-10-2012, 15:03   #25
Registered User
 
Bluewaters2812's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Cruising
Boat: Not a Beneteau!
Posts: 911
Images: 1
Send a message via Skype™ to Bluewaters2812
Re: Retirement age of a diesel engine

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
My father's boat has a Westerbeke (so Perkins) 4-108 made in 1982, so 30 years ago. When he bought the boat in 1996, there were 9,000-odd hours on the clock - and the clock was broken God knows how long before that. He has run the hell out of it since then -- his boat sails so badly, he motors 80% of the time. I wouldn't be surprised if he has put another 9,000 hours on it in his 16 years of ownership (he has been retired since then and cruising full time). He doesn't know anything about idling harming diesel engines, and without a genset, he idles it for hours at a time "warming it up", and charging batteries. Despite all this, it runs like a top. Spews oil all over the place, but disposable diapers deal with that. I think marine diesel engines can last for a very, very long time as long as you don't overheat them, run them out of oil, or grossly abuse them in some other way.
Wow, another longevity story. I guess that making sure the oil is changed, not revving the '#%$& out of the engine and making sure no water gets in will "almost" guarantee a long life. Just hope the Yanmar's and Kuboto's have the pedigree of your Dad's Perkins.
__________________
Bluewaters2812 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-10-2012, 15:13   #26
Registered User
 
Tortuga's Lie's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Virginia
Boat: Tartan 4100
Posts: 384
Re: Retirement age of a diesel engine

My westerbeke 40 (4-108) is a 1977 with 2500 hours and still running smooth with no smoke from the exhaust. Regular oil changes and I just adjusted the valve clearances last weekend for the first time in a long while. Sure it drips a very small amount of oil, but I can live with that....I have a good drip pan under the engine
__________________
Tortuga's Lie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-10-2012, 15:34   #27
Registered User
 
Bluewaters2812's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Cruising
Boat: Not a Beneteau!
Posts: 911
Images: 1
Send a message via Skype™ to Bluewaters2812
Re: Retirement age of a diesel engine

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tortuga's Lie View Post
My westerbeke 40 (4-108) is a 1977 with 2500 hours and still running smooth with no smoke from the exhaust. Regular oil changes and I just adjusted the valve clearances last weekend for the first time in a long while. Sure it drips a very small amount of oil, but I can live with that....I have a good drip pan under the engine
From the responses I have the impression that a properly serviced diesel will in fact go for yonks despite age or engine hours or the combination.

This seems to be what a diesel needs then:

1. Good and regular servicing/oil change/filters.
2. Regular use.
3. Warm the engine.
4. Make sure the exhaust is working properly.
5. Run it at more than idle once warm (do not rev the hell out of it).
6. Get it back to idle to cool down a bit before switching off.

I am sure there is a bit more but with this basic attention the chances of a long life are much better.
__________________
Bluewaters2812 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-10-2012, 15:45   #28
Registered User
 
GaryMayo's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Branched Oak Yacht Club, Wife is an Admiral in the Nebraska Navy
Boat: Clipper Marine 32 CC Aft Cabin Ketch
Posts: 1,211
My single piston Yanmar is 36 years or 315,576 hours old. (Not used hours) engine still going strong, hour meter broken: )

A diesel engine in a boat has too many variables to take into account. Taken care of, should outlast 80% of the boat and the people that sail her.
__________________
W.I.B. Crealock when asked what he thought of the easily trailerable Clipper Marine sailboats by a naval design collegue, Gentelman Bill responded, "I am very proud of them".
www.clippermarine.org & www.clipper-sailor.net
GaryMayo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-10-2012, 15:53   #29
Registered User
 
Bluewaters2812's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Cruising
Boat: Not a Beneteau!
Posts: 911
Images: 1
Send a message via Skype™ to Bluewaters2812
Re: Retirement age of a diesel engine

Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryMayo View Post
My single piston Yanmar is 36 years or 315,576 hours old. (Not used hours) engine still going strong, hour meter broken: )

A diesel engine in a boat has too many variables to take into account. Taken care of, should outlast 80% of the boat and the people that sail her.
Yip, that is what reckon having read all on here. Just a question: what are all the service items that one should attend to regularly?
__________________
Bluewaters2812 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-10-2012, 16:02   #30
Registered User
 
Cruiser2B's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Norfolk
Boat: Westsail 32
Posts: 367
Re: Retirement age of a diesel engine

I would first say parts and also how long you are willing to fix or repair and maintain such engine. Diesels when properly maintained should last forever. The engine will need parts, rebuilds and maintenance. As long as you can get parts for them and you are willing to work on it then keep it. At some point the maintenance and reliability will warrant the money for a new one.
__________________

__________________
http://svsalacia.blogspot.com
1971 Alberg 30..preparing to get underway!
USCG 100T Master Near Coastal with Inland Aux Sail
Cruiser2B is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
diesel, engine, retirement

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
The Right Way to Run a Diesel off-the-grid Engines and Propulsion Systems 80 09-12-2012 19:06
Sustainable? Diesel Engine Blowby Saqqara Engines and Propulsion Systems 6 25-08-2012 19:03
Engine Wouldn't Quit MikeTurner Engines and Propulsion Systems 5 14-01-2012 23:55
Need Help with 350 Cummins Diesel Engine BigDawg99 Engines and Propulsion Systems 9 25-10-2011 09:27



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 13:19.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.