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Old 26-02-2014, 16:28   #46
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My first boat ... a Jeanneau 50?

Who wants to be a great sailor? I'll settle for competent and safe, I'm too old to be great.

Link to the Island Packet please?
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Old 26-02-2014, 16:48   #47
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Re: My first boat ... a Jeanneau 50?

I disagree with some of your points. I do agree that dingy sailors are usually good as they have sailed a lot but I have met many pilot types that are sailors and by and large they are decent. They come with a very good understanding of Nav and weather as well as the basics of how.why sails work so they have a leg up on most folks. They are also a disciplined lot which helps as well.
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Old 26-02-2014, 17:06   #48
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Re: My first boat ... a Jeanneau 50?

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Originally Posted by Delancey View Post
I have known a number of airplane pilot/sailors in my life and always found it somewhat surprising that they were at best mediocre sailors, even then ones who really tried.
I found most pilots likes fast car and sailing. They are technically inclined and a good observer. It makes them a good sailor.
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Old 26-02-2014, 18:13   #49
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Re: My first boat ... a Jeanneau 50?

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Originally Posted by Southerncowboyz View Post
I want to purchase a Jeanneau 50. I can afford the boat, but I'm clueless as to what the real cost is for a boat that size. I have basically zero boat experience. I fly jets for a living, so some of that translates well....

....PS I've had a few to drink, so please forgive my lack of sentence structure and all errors.
Sounds to me like a recipe for disaster, you sure you want to encourage this? Really? You think it's a good idea for anybody to start out with a fifty footer? Because they're a pilot?

Let me know how being a pilot works for you when the wind is blowing one way twenty five knots and the current is flowing seven knots in another direction and the net effect is going to put you and your 40,000 pound boat up on the rocks. Maybe you can just apply a little more trust to get yourself out of that one?

It's this kind of hubris that ends up making nice people dead.

I think the OP would be well served to spend 0.10% of his budget and by a sunfish and master the basics before stepping up to a fifty footer. Forget safety, he will have a lot more fun with his fifty footer if has the self confidence and skill required to do more than sit at the dock with his investment.

I have sailed on one of the Colgate boats. I think they are great boats for teaching on and are limited only in the fact they have a keel. Unfortunately, in my view this is a significant short coming. I feel that gaining the experience of capsizing and righting a dinghy is quintessential to mastering the art of sailing.

One hand on the tiller and one hand on the sheet. No wheel between you and the rudder, no motor, no winches. Now make the boat go where you want it to.

Also, to clarify I never said there weren't good pilot/sailors. Never said it wasn't possible. I said I never met a great one personally but I will certainly let you know when I do.
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Old 26-02-2014, 18:37   #50
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Re: My first boat ... a Jeanneau 50?

If Island Packet is the boat of choice then I recommend the 32. They are small enough to learn on but at the same time big enough to live on for a few days. Here's one

1994 Island Packet 32 Cutter Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com
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Old 26-02-2014, 19:30   #51
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Re: My first boat ... a Jeanneau 50?

I have to agree with Delancey.
It is absurd that some are encouraging this individual to follow his dreams in the manner he has chosen.
I have been sailing all my life including some cruising and a hell of a lot of racing. This has made me very respectful of the water whether the ocean, bay or lake.
Some have encouraged this individual just get out there and do it which I find very scary. A fifty foot boat can be a beast to control......I know because I have owned one for almost 15 years and have sailed her extensively.
I do remember many years ago I was invited to do Key West Race Week by the designer of the boat we were racing. This happened to only be a 40 footer with the new owner aboard who had never sailed before! At the onset I found it odd and I thought this guy obliviously had more money than brains and unfortunately he had been taken advantage of by an over zealous broker. The boat was full of pros except for the new owner and myself. In typical Key West fashion it blew like stink and by the end of the week the new owner was in tears, bruised and a pitiful mess. I felt very sorry for him and needless to say it was a short lived romance between him and his new first boat.
Although a different situation it is the same theme.
People buy boats for different reasons. At my Yacht Club there are people with big boats that seldom leave the dock and know very little about true sailing. Maybe to them they are boaters and they get enjoyment out of their toy I am not sure.
However what they miss is the true Zen of sailing when you become one with your boat and the ocean. I personally think this can only be achieved when you start with the very basics.....know what it is like to turn a boat over, push a boat to its limits, sailing a small boat that will definitely flip if you re not on your toes. This experience is not to be underestimated and you are cheating yourself out of a lot of security and pleasure on the water by starting with a ship instead of a boat.
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Old 26-02-2014, 19:38   #52
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Re: My first boat ... a Jeanneau 50?

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Not to stifle your dreams but this thread is very scary reading about some people who encourage you to go through with buying a 50 ft. boat with no experience.
Do yourself a big favor and please listen to those that have suggested a slower approach. There are so many things that can go wrong out there and I suspect those that are encouraging you have not really done that much sailing or sail in relatively protected waters such as the BVI's or live very dangerously no matter what size boat they now sail.
Simply bringing a 50 ft boat into a dock on a windy day can be tricky enough not to mention how you do when you experience your first squall.
It is one thing to not be concerned about the damage to your boat but what about all the other boats you will encounter? Also the "adventure" will certainly be crushed when you are responsible for someone's death.
Also 50 ft boats are expensive to maintain from yard bills to equipment and sails. Things are always breaking and the sea is a very harsh environment. Did I mention yard bills?
Buy a small keel boat and learn to sail. Eventually graduate to sailing in strong winds in protected waters. Also like others have suggested charter with a captain in the islands somewhere. Last but not least crew on a delivery that involves open ocean sailing for at least two to three days.

And if you have nice weather go again and again until you experience bad weather and you ask yourself WTF am I doing out here? Then and only then will you be ready to make an informed decision. Believe me it will be money and time well spent!

oh yea there are those that use their boats as condo's and never leave the dock.
good luck
^^^ Look up^^ What he said is 100% correct.

Buy a small cheap boat in the short term and use it to learn on.

Jeaneaus are lovely boats.. As a pilot you would know the difference between a 747 and a 767. As a passenger all i know is that they are usually white, made by boeing and dont appear to crash as often as airbus's. But there is no way I could make an educated decision about which one I should buy. Its the same with you and the Jeaneau. Get on some boats first and get to know what you are doing.
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Old 26-02-2014, 19:49   #53
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Re: My first boat ... a Jeanneau 50?

Further to my post above, this is what happens to people who buy boats (or in this case Hire) boats that they have no idea how to use. Its a few years old now , but it really answers the question "should i get lessons"
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Old 26-02-2014, 20:06   #54
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Re: My first boat ... a Jeanneau 50?

Great video. Never saw it before. Would really like to know what they were thinking/doing/trying...
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Old 27-02-2014, 03:39   #55
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Re: My first boat ... a Jeanneau 50?

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Great video. Never saw it before. Would really like to know what they were thinking/doing/trying...
Its obviously some guy who had a nice fat wallet and decided to rent the biggest MoFo boat in the charter fleet. Not always the best idea as a fat wallet doesnt exclude one from winning a Darwin Award at some point- hehe.

I think the entire debacle ran for well in excess of 45mins and included multiple collisions and hook ups.
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Old 27-02-2014, 04:01   #56
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Re: My first boat ... a Jeanneau 50?

It's all about how your head is screwed on. If you have the right mental approach, then jumping in boots and all can be perfectly fine.

Whilst I had a sailing background from when I was young which was a help for me, I had no experience sailing a 40 footer and I had a 25 year gap since I sailed a 34 footer as a crew and 27 and skipper. I jumped into 40 knowing I would solo a lot.

I started with a few weeks of sailing with a crew and had problems mooring in the marina. However my skills in that regard improved dramatically when I went solo as it forced me to always think ahead carefully about my manoeuvre plans and to evaluate all of the possible what ifs...

I have a mainframe computer background working on problem solving and I think that puts me in the mindset that allows me to attempt the sailing I do and I think that this similar mindset is what I would expect a pilot to have with the bonus of a "life & death" risk factor.

I have a friend who is in sales and marketing, always positive and gungho. He once tied his wakeboarding boat up at a waterside restaurant and had to ask a chef for a knife to cut his line. If he ever got a charter skipper licence, he would be the skipper in the video.
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Old 27-02-2014, 07:06   #57
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Re: My first boat ... a Jeanneau 50?

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It's all about how your head is screwed on. If you have the right mental approach, then jumping in boots and all can be perfectly fine.

Snip .
I think that is perhaps one of the most dangerous things ever written in this forum!
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Old 28-02-2014, 16:22   #58
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Re: My first boat ... a Jeanneau 50?

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Originally Posted by Captaintim1 View Post
I'm not underestimating him at all. But no experience and jumping straight to a 50' boat is a bit much. What is the draft or mast height on a boat like that? He's going to be sailing around Florida. I don't like the ICW either, but it's nice to have the ability to come inside if the weather gets bad. I've just seen too many folks with the money to buy big, but when they get out and get in trouble they end up not sailing.
my first and only boat is a 40' -- my sailing experience was not a lot when i took off and headed northbound from miami to mass by my self -- the next year the admiral joined me and we have sailed the entire carib and across the atlantic -- we are not great sailors and never will be but we have done it
if we would have listened to some posters here we should have gotten a little play boat and learned to sail properly and then sell it and move up a bit -- had we listened to that advice we would be still in miami instead of tunisia --
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Old 28-02-2014, 16:33   #59
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Re: My first boat ... a Jeanneau 50?

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Originally Posted by caradow View Post
I have to agree with Delancey.
It is absurd that some are encouraging this individual to follow his dreams in the manner he has chosen.
I have been sailing all my life including some cruising and a hell of a lot of racing. This has made me very respectful of the water whether the ocean, bay or lake.
Some have encouraged this individual just get out there and do it which I find very scary. A fifty foot boat can be a beast to control......I know because I have owned one for almost 15 years and have sailed her extensively.
I do remember many years ago I was invited to do Key West Race Week by the designer of the boat we were racing. This happened to only be a 40 footer with the new owner aboard who had never sailed before! At the onset I found it odd and I thought this guy obliviously had more money than brains and unfortunately he had been taken advantage of by an over zealous broker. The boat was full of pros except for the new owner and myself. In typical Key West fashion it blew like stink and by the end of the week the new owner was in tears, bruised and a pitiful mess. I felt very sorry for him and needless to say it was a short lived romance between him and his new first boat.
Although a different situation it is the same theme.
People buy boats for different reasons. At my Yacht Club there are people with big boats that seldom leave the dock and know very little about true sailing. Maybe to them they are boaters and they get enjoyment out of their toy I am not sure.
However what they miss is the true Zen of sailing when you become one with your boat and the ocean. I personally think this can only be achieved when you start with the very basics.....know what it is like to turn a boat over, push a boat to its limits, sailing a small boat that will definitely flip if you re not on your toes. This experience is not to be underestimated and you are cheating yourself out of a lot of security and pleasure on the water by starting with a ship instead of a boat.
i am a lousy sailor and even worse racer -- - but cruising in my opinion is totally different -- i knew a few racers who just could not or would never make a cruiser -- you go racing because the race is scheduled regardless of the wx and you see how hard you can push a boat -- if things break gee we can go back to the marina and get a new piece -- try getting the think you broke by see hard you can push your boat on a sail from the san blas to cartagena and see how much fun it is to get it down there --

i personally do not understand all the bragging about how fast you can go around the cans while i know a lot of racers can never understand our talking about making a new landfall in a distant port
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Old 28-02-2014, 16:38   #60
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Re: My first boat ... a Jeanneau 50?

[QUOTE=Delancey;1478494]Sounds to me like a recipe for disaster, you sure you want to encourage this? Really? You think it's a good idea for anybody to start out with a fifty footer?

glad i did not listen to your advise on a small boat -- as above 1st and only boat is a 40' and we have not done to bad for taking our 1st sailing lessons in dec 2000 - and by 2013 we did a 2 person crossing of the atlantic -- i personally think what he is doing is fine - but then again i am a lousy sailor - just happen to an awful lot of miles under our keel - a lot more than most
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