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Old 22-07-2010, 08:50   #121

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To be legal you'll need your Captain's license AND commercial insurance, as yours will almost certainly not cover any commercial use of your boat.

The way round that is to join the cash economy, keep no records, leave no witnesses, and hope there's no reason you'll even be dragged into a court.

Although, if you're lucky you can usually make more money in Vegas than on a boat.
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Old 23-07-2010, 16:45   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by osirissail View Post
If you operate outside the territorial waters of a country you can do what you want.
Yes/No.

E.g. if you have a X flagged boat and you charter in a Y country then you have to follow the Y (charter place) country regulations for charter (sometimes very strict, sometimes not) AND the X (boat flag) country regulations for the licensing of the charter boat and the charter captain.

Otherwise you are exposed to all sorts of mess, boat impounded included.

Not that it is not done, just bear in mind the consequences before you jump.

b.
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Old 01-08-2010, 13:00   #123
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Absolutely true but the thrust of my comment was that there is little if any interest by local officials to go hunting for your "illegal" operations. Only if a local bitches or points out how you are horning into their livelihood do the officials show any interest. In the eastern Caribbean I would guess based on actual observation that the "bootleg" charter operations outnumber the legitimate ones. Some of this has to do with the locals not knowing what to do with you if you apply for permits, licenses, etc.
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Old 01-08-2010, 13:51   #124

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osiris-
Waiting to load on a late shuttle bus in Bermuda at oh'dark'hundred hours one morning...The doorman carried someone's bags to the rear of the shuttle because the driver was all caught up in trying to get someone else up and in the front door. (Doors and steps being all too complex for some people to negotiate on their own.)
Driver comes back to the rear to grab the next bags, sees there are two he didn't put in the bus, and immediately tears the doorman a new orifice "WHAT YOU DO, THAT NOT YOUR JOB, THAT MY JOB, YOU TAKE THEM OUT A THERE" and everything froze until that happened.

Even in some seemingly civilized parts of the world, if someone crosses the line when jobs and labor are a valuable resource...you can expect major incidents.

Same as touching the wrong tool in any union shop in America. A friend of mine cut a wire so a piece of equipment could be moved...and there was a 24-hour shutdown of an entire site, because he wasn't authorized to cut a wire, that was an electrician's job.
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Old 01-08-2010, 14:50   #125
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Yes, those are some good examples of why sailing off into the sunset is so nice. These 3rd world countries are not really into all that stuff you mentioned. However, once you "hire your man" he becomes very attached to you and doesn't like any other local approaching you. It can get touchy.
- - But back to the bootleg charter boats, they are very careful who they hire to do work and as a result their workers add an additional layer of protection against intruding officials.
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Old 20-11-2010, 18:20   #126
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Where and what adds have you seen? Thanks
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Old 21-11-2010, 13:37   #127
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I'm a bit late noticing this thread, but here's my 2 cents:

I met a cruiser in George Town who made jewelry, mostly jewelry having to do with boats and the sea. She sold it through her own website and on various craft websites. I wasn't entirely clear on how it all worked -- it seemed she mailed some items right from wherever she was, or whenever she got near to a post office. Other stuff got mailed by a helper back home in the states, I think. But she indicated that it was making them (family of four) plenty of money for cruising, and she kept making more jewelry as they went along.

My daughters, who are horse-crazy, just set up a pint-sized online business selling horse stickers. They promote it using Google ads, which can be quite cheap for niche items, and hit a very focused audience. So far, I doubt it'll produce more than a few hundred bucks a year, but you never know. . . . Maybe someday they'll buy me that 47-foot catamaran I keep asking for.

That business model -- niche item, online sales, focused marketing, etc -- which didn't really exist a couple of decades ago, is now a strong possibility for cruisers. Selling something that can be both sold AND delivered online (like boat plans in PDF format, or an IPhone app, or an e-book) would be ideal.
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Old 21-11-2010, 15:23   #128
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There is a book "The Four Hour Work Week" (or thereabouts) that details this process pretty well.
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Old 23-11-2010, 22:46   #129
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On the other side, being in a position to offer some work cruisers could be paid decent cash for ...

It feels close to impossible to find the right match. Teeth-gnashingly frustrating.

Not to mention that I'm very, very wary of violating maritime law and don't know enough about which licenses are required or reasonable for what I need done.

In the case of labour regulations, no real qualms as I'm good at making technicalities work. Sadly, though, far too few people are good enough at keeping their mouths shut.
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Old 27-11-2010, 03:43   #130
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Old 27-11-2010, 06:30   #131
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Hmmmmm....
I'm a firefighter/paramedic, two more years and I collect that pension,
Licensed Captain
Certified Welder, electrician, carpenter (ship's), plumber, fiberglass, paint, rigger, .
GF is an RN and knows how to sew canvas... I think we planned it ok.

In another year we start shopping for a bigger boat
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Old 27-11-2010, 23:42   #132
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I teach Web design. All you need is a periodic internet connection.

Now you have me wondering why I am not cruising and working from there.
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Old 28-11-2010, 03:00   #133
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i made 3 years ago a good money by rescuing a freighter with my sail boat.
Happened in the indic and a true story, but at present i did not translate it in english.

Gio
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Old 28-11-2010, 19:00   #134
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Besides winning a lottery or some similar stroke of coincidence (luck) resulting in a windfall of money, cruisers need a consistent source of income to remain cruising. Nothing is free in this world and certainly is getting "less free" as governments worldwide seek money to keep themselves in business. You might say, in essence, the product they are selling is access to their island/country.
- - Then add in the increasing complexity of our floating "homes" and the realization by the manufacturers/suppliers that there "is a growing market" and are applying classical capitalism in raising prices until the market demand flattens. As more and more people enter the cruising world, they generate increased demand for products which classically always causes prices to rise more than justified by manufacturing cost increases.
- - Even the most basic, stripped down boat - a hull, sails/rigging, and handheld navigation needs repairs, painting, caulking, sewing and of course feeding of the crew. As you climb the "comforts of life" ladder in bigger and more complex cruising boats the costs escalate dramatically.
- - I am ignoring home-country live-aboards whose purpose for being on a boat is they cannot afford to live on land and "weekend cruisers" who still live most of their life in their homes on land. The break-off becomes touchy as is spending a week or two onboard cruising? And is two(+/-) months in the Bahamas then 10 months back on land cruising? For the sake of discussion I would set the "bar" at 6 months out of their home country per year only because of the large number of "6-on, 6-off" cruisers.
- - So where does the "money" come from? Mostly from savings accumulated during land-based work periods in the home country and put into the "cruising kitty." Here there is a large number of Caribbean cruisers who take advantage of the storm season to return to their home country to replenish the "kitty."
- - Then there are the "retired" cruisers who have investments "active or passive" that fund their voyages. However, market crashes/depressions can force them back to their homeland to attend to their finances.
- - Lastly you have the wandering "gypsy" cruisers, usually young men or young couples -and- some really ancient couples who have always wandered the oceans in their ancient boats and really don't know how to do anything else. The first group is statistically small and the second group really, really small and mostly only seen in the distant corners of the cruising world.
- - I sense a very large percentage of the CF members seeking the potential to be "gypsy" cruisers because of the classical "romance" impression of such a lifestyle. But it ain't romantic any way, shape or form. It is hard work and a lot of deprivation. Somewhat like walking across a continent with a backpack and no money. It is done but you won't get fat doing it. You will probably end up a lot skinnier. And it is definitely a "short term" endeavor as at the first major incident or boat repair they reach the end of their financial road and have to abandon their quest and go home. There are a lot of small sailboats in the various Caribbean islands free (except for bureaucratic hassles of getting ownership) for the asking left over from terminated "gypsy" cruisers.
- - Other than the 6-on/6-off style of financing, what is left for the "gypsy" cruisers to keep their finances and boat afloat? You can rule out any work in foreign countries on a short term basis (except for musicians) as the work permit requirements take a lot of time and money to get. However, there are in the cruising boat support industry mostly former cruisers who have opted to spend significant time in the "new" country and set up businesses. The key word here is "former," as they have opted to transition to being a resident of the new country and give up cruising as I have defined it above.
- - That leaves only one legal source of income for active cruisers, the new opportunities afforded by the world wide web to do business "without borders." There is supposedly some significant amounts of money to be made in that arena. Everything from managing porn sites, Nigerian scams, to FOREX and equity trading, etc. - not sure if there is a moral distinction amongst those. And then consulting, data mining, and other intellectual services. I believe this whole field will allow many more younger cruisers to head out cruising rather than waiting until they have "retired" and accumulated their nest egg over 40 years or so.
- - But earning money by physical labor outside your home country is a non-starter except for those wishing to "settle" and convert from the cruising life to building a new land business in some other island/country.
- - Bootleg endeavors exist and even there, they are forced to give it up as new bootleggers underbid them. Ideas of doing work for other cruisers is also a non-starter as we all (well off and marginal) are trying to stretch our resources to be able to continue to cruise further and longer. In other words, we are cheapsters and pinch pennies even with a pocket full of dollars.
- - So don't dream of supporting yourself outside your home country as a "gypsy" cruiser if you don't have a stomach for operating illegally and paying the consequences if you get caught.
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Old 30-11-2010, 21:21   #135
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The truth

comes out?

Transients with problems can be vexing.....Years ago I had one sail out under cover of darkness.......Finally located him and the boat a year later in Belize....
got paid.....I could write a short story 'bout that internet adventure.

Quote:
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In other words, we are cheapsters and pinch pennies even with a pocket full of dollars.
-
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