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Old 19-05-2015, 19:04   #1201
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Re: Make Money While Cruising - List

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Originally Posted by boden36 View Post
I am sure that graph is correct for what it is portraying, but if you look at the heading it says ' Futures and Spreads Equity Curves'.
Trading straight futures is too dangerous, I just trade spreads. Have made a profit every year for 5 yrs. Last year I made a return of 160% on capital. This year at present is around 20%. Other years between 60 and 70%.
My term deposits in an Australian bank are making me around 3.25% as a comparison.
I don't trade blindly and select my trades carefully.
This is my real world experience over five years and I am not a genius.

Regards,
Richard.
Do you use the same service as Delfin and others here?
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Old 19-05-2015, 20:26   #1202
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Re: Make Money While Cruising - List

"They claim to "educate" you one how to set up a internet business and then have you as a source to others "
Classical pyramid scheme. And if you get in at the top, get enough underlings, and then get out before the arrests and lawsuits start, you can do very well with any of them.
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Old 19-05-2015, 20:37   #1203
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Re: Make Money While Cruising - List

I use MRCI the same as Delfin and others, and I thank Delfin for writing about it here.
I have made over $500,000 since I started, but I started with money that I could afford to lose and I have other income streams as well.There can be a run of months where you lose every month so you have to have a good financial cushion to get you through these times.
I would not recommend using money that you needed for anything important.

Regards,
Richard.
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Old 20-05-2015, 10:01   #1204
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Re: Make Money While Cruising - List

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Originally Posted by s/v Beth View Post
I am going to throw something else into the mix. I came across these guys: Weathy Affiliates. They claim to "educate" you one how to set up a internet business and then have you as a source to others and visa versa to grow you niche business (for a fee). Sounds like something that could be done on a boat.
Anyone have any experience with these yahoos?
Wealthy Affiliate - Online Business Starts Here
Starting an online business that makes money by selling your own products or somebody else's is a great idea, in my opinion. I'm working towards doing just that and blogging about it here. I'm still in the early days, but I've learned a lot in the last 9 months or so!

Affiliate income from promoting other people's products is absolutely viable, but I'd be a bit cautious about these wealthyaffiliate guys. It's hard to find a bad review of these guys because part of their business model is offering cash for leads. Everybody and their dog has put up a glowing review to try to make a few bucks. This guy seems to have a pretty honest sounding review.

My scam alert radar started going off when they claimed that with SEO it is easy to dominated Google (it isn't, especially these days). They also mention 75% commissions and that there are lots of things on Amazon that have commissions. Both statements are true, but not connected. Amazon commissions are 4%. Any time a "make money on the internet" website claims that it's all so easy, be a bit cautious. It takes a lot of work, but it can be done.

They offer "free" hosting as part of your $49/month. If you decide to give them a try, be very sure that you own your URL and you can get your website transferred if you decide to leave them. Your website is your business. Don't let anybody else own your business.

I'd maybe spend some time on the free smart passive income blog and podcast and maybe check out the very honest folks over at fizzle.co instead. I'm a member there and I feel like I get very good value for my $35 per month.
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Old 20-05-2015, 11:02   #1205
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Re: Make Money While Cruising - List

Thanks Chris. I too fell the concept has promise, but have to figure out my way around these new get rich quick schemes. I will check out your leads.
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Old 20-05-2015, 12:25   #1206
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Re: Make Money While Cruising - List

Yes, thanks Chris.
I've been enjoying the SailLoot podcast too, got some useful ideas.
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Old 20-05-2015, 12:55   #1207
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Re: Make Money While Cruising - List

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Thanks Chris. I too fell the concept has promise, but have to figure out my way around these new get rich quick schemes. I will check out your leads.
Unfortunately, none of them are really "get rich quick." However, if you do find a good way to provide real value to people online, there are many, many examples of people who have created an online business that gives them a full time, location independent income.

It usually takes at least a few years to get going and it's a lot of work, but it's absolutely doable. Active Captain comes to mind.

I've just finished the book $100 start-up. It's excellent and has hundreds of real-life examples of actual businesses. Well worth the read.
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Old 20-05-2015, 13:17   #1208
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Re: Make Money While Cruising - List

All kidding aside, . . . I read about (I think in a sailing magazine) a couple who had two different ways to bring in a little cash. She made jewelry and sold it to local boaters and tourists. They also invented some type of waterproof radio that they can put together on the boat and mail out. Sorry I can't recall all the details but it supplemented their cruising kitty. I have also thought about a blog as an avenue to creating revenue (thus mountainsandseashore.blogspot.com) but besides that also offering an avenue to be a bit creative as well as documenting our life for family and friends even if for no one else. Right now we live aboard, but stay on the hook in St. John, USVI and are currently working, though sail when we can. Looking forward to longer term cruising in the future.

Best,
Camile
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Old 20-05-2015, 14:41   #1209
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Re: Make Money While Cruising - List

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Unfortunately, none of them are really "get rich quick." However, if you do find a good way to provide real value to people online, there are many, many examples of people who have created an online business that gives them a full time, location independent income.
Agreed, they all just seem to promise too much and my cynic comes out. I can see starting a business on the net, making it work, then turning it over to the kids for 90 % of the time with you stopping by via wifi to check on things. Of course they would have to be involved and paid- something to think about.
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Old 20-05-2015, 15:06   #1210
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Re: Make Money While Cruising - List

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Agreed, they all just seem to promise too much and my cynic comes out. I can see starting a business on the net, making it work, then turning it over to the kids for 90 % of the time with you stopping by via wifi to check on things. Of course they would have to be involved and paid- something to think about.
Yes, that's certainly a model that can work. Many online businesses can be constructed so that the product (either electronic or physical) is delivered automatically. It doesn't matter if you're on passage somewhere, the process works without you.

You still need to work on promotion and whatnot, but this can be done when you can find internet access. Customer service can't be fully automated, so this might be something you pay a virtual assistant to help with.
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Old 20-05-2015, 16:33   #1211
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Re: Make Money While Cruising - List

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Originally Posted by boden36 View Post
I am sure that graph is correct for what it is portraying, but if you look at the heading it says ' Futures and Spreads Equity Curves'.
Trading straight futures is too dangerous, I just trade spreads. Have made a profit every year for 5 yrs. Last year I made a return of 160% on capital. This year at present is around 20%. Other years between 60 and 70%.
My term deposits in an Australian bank are making me around 3.25% as a comparison.
I don't trade blindly and select my trades carefully.
This is my real world experience over five years and I am not a genius.

Regards,
Richard.
Nope Boden. The title indicates "futures and spreads" because when you visit that link, they display both hypothetical return curves on the same graph individually. But they give you the option to de-select and hide either line. The pic I posted is SPREADS ONLY and represents the hypothetical returns of following the seasonal spread trading program that is being touted here. The only way you could be +20% YTD for 2015 is if you are doing something outside of their program because according to them, that chart includes all of their recommended seasonal spread trades which are at a $20K loss so far this year.
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Old 20-05-2015, 16:53   #1212
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Re: Make Money While Cruising - List

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How can both posters be using the same data.

Can't see how this could possibly be.

Do both have the same subscription?
You can check out the chart for yourself. It is not password protected on their site.

MRCI's Hypothetical Equity Chart

Everyone here is advocating the seasonal spread program, which is indicated by the blue "net equity" line as in my previous pic. The black line is outright futures, which nobody here is recommending. Here is the hypothetical results for the last 12 months. Notice that only the spread net equity curve is selected. Also note that this does not include commissions, data, subscription fees, etc. These would add another $3-5K expense over the course of a year in that program. Slippage could reduce returns again by at least that amount because in the real world, a trade to execute indiscriminately at the close "takes the market", meaning as soon as the trade is opened, it books a loss equal to the bid/ask spread which is extra large on the inter-commodity trades. This real world loss is not accounted for in their hypothetical trade graph. So in the real world, that $20,588 loss would actually be closer to $25-28,000 loss.



It's all fine and good for those touting the system to suggest that they carefully select only the best trades, but as was mentioned before by a couple people who have been trading the system longer, they typically do worse when they try to cherry pick trades over the long run. That is because it is a diversified strategy, and cherry picking trades reduces the statistical diversification. This increases the concentration risk relative to the diminished return potential and theoretically results in a worse risk/reward ratio, despite that fact that certain short term losses might be reduced.
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Old 20-05-2015, 17:24   #1213
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Re: Make Money While Cruising - List

And it reads just like every broker, brokerage house and advisor paperwork I have ever read.

SEASONAL TENDENCIES ARE A COMPOSITE OF SOME OF THE MORE CONSISTENT COMMODITY FUTURES SEASONALS THAT HAVE OCCURRED OVER THE PAST 15 YEARS. THERE ARE USUALLY UNDERLYING FUNDAMENTAL CIRCUMSTANCES THAT OCCUR ANNUALLY THAT TEND TO CAUSE THE FUTURES MARKETS TO REACT IN A SIMILAR DIRECTIONAL MANNER DURING A CERTAIN CALENDAR PERIOD OF THE YEAR. EVEN IF A SEASONAL TENDENCY OCCURS IN THE FUTURE, IT MAY NOT RESULT IN A PROFITABLE TRANSACTION AS FEES, AND THE TIMING OF THE ENTRY AND LIQUIDATION MAY IMPACT ON THE RESULTS. NO REPRESENTATION IS BEING MADE THAT ANY ACCOUNT HAS IN THE PAST OR WILL IN THE FUTURE ACHIEVE PROFITS UTILIZING THESE STRATEGIES. NO REPRESENTATION IS BEING MADE THAT PRICE PATTERNS WILL RECUR IN THE FUTURE. HYPOTHETICAL PERFORMANCE RESULTS HAVE MANY INHERENT LIMITATIONS, SOME OF WHICH ARE DESCRIBED BELOW. NO REPRESENTATION IS BEING MADE THAT ANY ACCOUNT WILL OR IS LIKELY TO ACHIEVE PROFITS OR LOSSES SIMILAR TO THOSE SHOWN. IN FACT, THERE ARE FREQUENTLY SHARP DIFFERENCES BETWEEN HYPOTHETICAL PERFORMANCE RESULTS AND THE ACTUAL RESULTS SUBSEQUENTLY ACHIEVED BY ANY PARTICULAR TRADING PROGRAM. ONE OF THE LIMITATIONS OF HYPOTHETICAL PERFORMANCE RESULTS IS THAT THEY ARE GENERALLY PREPARED WITH THE BENEFIT OF HINDSIGHT. IN ADDITION, HYPOTHETICAL TRADING DOES NOT INVOLVE FINANCIAL RISK, AND NO HYPOTHETICAL TRADING RECORD CAN COMPLETELY ACCOUNT FOR THE IMPACT OF FINANCIAL RISK IN ACTUAL TRADING. FOR EXAMPLE, THE ABILITY TO WITHSTAND LOSSES OR ADHERE TO A PARTICULAR TRADING PROGRAM IN SPITE OF TRADING LOSSES ARE MATERIAL POINTS WHICH CAN ALSO ADVERSELY AFFECT ACTUAL TRADING RESULTS. THERE ARE NUMEROUS OTHER FACTORS RELATED TO THE MARKETS IN GENERAL OR TO THE IMPLEMENTATION OF ANY SPECIFIC TRADING PROGRAM WHICH CANNOT BE FULLY ACCOUNTED FOR IN THE PREPARATION OF HYPOTHETICAL PERFORMANCE RESULTS AND ALL OF WHICH CAN ADVERSELY AFFECT ACTUAL TRADING RESULTS. RESULTS NOT ADJUSTED FOR COMMISSION AND SLIPPAGE.


Still waiting for someone to put their skin in my game.

Ain't never going to happen.
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Old 20-05-2015, 17:57   #1214
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Re: Make Money While Cruising - List

Certeza is correct on fees - It costs me around $5000 a year but I am running a fairly substantial account. A smaller trader would pay less.
Certeza is also correct that it is not for the faint hearted and not a guaranteed money maker.
Unfortunately, Certeza does not seem to be doing it. His theory does not stack up against my practical experience. He would say my experience is unusual, but it is real and sustained.
I think this discussion is getting a little like an anchors thread so I will leave it to the rest of you in future. (pun intended)
Regards,
Richard.
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Old 20-05-2015, 18:33   #1215
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Re: Make Money While Cruising - List

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And it reads just like every broker, brokerage house and advisor paperwork I have ever read.

SEASONAL TENDENCIES ARE A COMPOSITE ..........


Still waiting for someone to put their skin in my game.

Ain't never going to happen.
I get what you're saying. In all fairness the government requires certain risk disclosures to be posted verbatim, regardless of personal opinions.

To your last point, unlike subscription services and street corner investment advisors, it is pretty much standard in my segment of the industry for managers to have a substantial amount of their own capital participating along side client capital, and subject to the exact same trades and risks. In my arena, few would invest in a fund where the manager didn't have significant skin in the game. Also, the use of hypothetical results is highly regulated. Typically, performance claims are only actual trading composites net of all fees and expenses. We are held to a much higher standard and like I mentioned awhile back, posting charts like that is strictly prohibited in this space.



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