dream yacht managment ownership program

[sailorr]

Originally Posted by Shrew

64 months is 5.33 years. So essentially, 6 cruising seasons in charter. 35% down plus 25% is 60%. How much would it be to purchase a 6+ year old boat that has been through 6 charter seasons?

If the answer is 60% of the original sell price, then you're not really getting a good deal.

thank you.
But then again as mentioned above, I wasnt asking about the financial aspect of the deal.
I checked it carefully as well as other options in the market.
it might not be the best deal out there, but it's the best deal for me.

thanks again

[Captain Puget]

To answer your specific question- Get a good survey as a base point. Then you kno what you started with to gage “reasonable” wear and tear. - cheap insurance for a major commitment.

Additionally, I echo others rec’s for legal/ financial review of the contract.

[Larry Florida]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

Take it to your accountant/tax advisor and have them go thru and tell you how many ways this can turn out wrong.

I'll give you 100-1 odds, if you hear them out, you won't buy in.

You can say that again

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by sailorr

thanks for replying
at the end of the program therer is a long pahse-out stage and the boat should be given to me at a perfect condition with reasonable wear and tear

I will try to address your question and financial issues only as they relate to the decision to accept or not the boat at the end of the contract.

First I would want some very specific details on what the company considers reasonable wear and tear. To me that is far too broad and subject to interpretation by the charter company. What they consider reasonable wear and tear might be close to worn out or used up to you.

Examples:

- Charter boats typically have a lot more engine hours than a privately owned boat. What if the boat ends up with 6-8000 hours on a light duty diesel? It could be running just fine but only have another couple thousand hours of useful life left before a needing a rebuild. Engine rebuild would almost certainly be in the five figure range.

- Sails, same question. After 6 years they could be holding together, stitching good BUT blown out and with only a year or two of lift left.

- Rigging. Same.

All the above easily fall into normal usage, wear and tear but if handed to you in that condition could result in $30,000 in out of pocket costs to you before the boat is ready for cruising.

Also, bottom line on the survey question, do you want to place 100% trust in the charter company to closely inspect and replace every item on the boat that needs it? Even if the company is completely honest and trustworthy everyone makes mistakes. I've owned and rebuilt enough boats I would feel comfortable surveying the boat but would still get a professional inspection of the engine. If you don't have that background then I think a professional survey very good and not very expensive insurance. Speaking of insurance, if you plan to insure the boat you will need a survey anyway.

[guyrj33]

Yes, get the boat surveyed.

[HighTemp]

We looked into this approach before we purchased, and I could never reconcile forking over the down payment for an asset that I get very little use of for 5 years, and when it does come available, it has 5 years worth of wear and tear heaped on it by people who sailed it like they stole it. I suppose one should look at the down payment as paying for 5 years worth of charters in advance, but that made little sense to me. Just a personal thing.

To the OP's point, In my experience, there is no such thing as "Perfect" Condition when it comes to anything used, and rarely when something is brand new, especially boats. When it is tine for the hand over to take place, who exactly gets to determine what is reasonable and what is not when it comes to wear and tear? Yes, most Charter companies will address most issues discovered during the survey, but what about this items that are on the ragged edge but didn't necessarily get identified during survey.

There are still some good deals out there on the used market if you are patient. We found a 2.5 year old boat with very little use, and brand new Volvos for about 65% of what it sold for new.

[jmschmidt]

Hi Sailorr,

Some pretty bad advice and stupid opinions coming your way on your post. Many don't seem to know their you-know-whats from a hole in the ground.

Moorings/Sunsail/Footloose (same parent company) and Dream have excellent programs. You will get more high and low season owner's time than you can use along with guaranteed monthly income which is not based on the yacht's actual charter income. Plus all expenses will be paid for, and I do mean ALL.

A partner and I had a Moorings boat in Tahiti (Raiatea). After four years Moorings offered us 100% of our original price back on the purchase of one of their new boats but my partner (silly boy) wanted to buy me out so we didn't take the deal. Maintenance and surveyors in French Polynesia are not quite as good as at Moorings' main base in the BVI so they gave us a check for over $13,000 at the hand over for a bunch small items. We brought the boat to Honolulu with no problems.

Recently I bought a six-year-old boat from Moorings in the BVI that had just came out of charter. I had a sea trial and out of water survey done on the spot and Moorings took care of all items, the worst of which were a bent prop (which they replaced while I was watching with a brand new one) and a leaking turbo. A couple of months later one of the AC units packed up and Moorings sold us one out of their inventory for $800. She is earning good net income in a secondary charter fleet.

I've also talked with Dream and believe them to be equally reputable. I have a friend who has a boat with Dream in the Met and he speaks highly of them.

Good luck

[sailorr]

Originally Posted by jmschmidt

Hi Sailorr,

Some pretty bad advice and stupid opinions coming your way on your post. Many don't seem to know their you-know-whats from a hole in the ground.

Moorings/Sunsail/Footloose (same parent company) and Dream have excellent programs. You will get more high and low season owner's time than you can use along with guaranteed monthly income which is not based on the yacht's actual charter income. Plus all expenses will be paid for, and I do mean ALL.

A partner and I had a Moorings boat in Tahiti (Raiatea). After four years Moorings offered us 100% of our original price back on the purchase of one of their new boats but my partner (silly boy) wanted to buy me out so we didn't take the deal. Maintenance and surveyors in French Polynesia are not quite as good as at Moorings' main base in the BVI so they gave us a check for over $13,000 at the hand over for a bunch small items. We brought the boat to Honolulu with no problems.

Recently I bought a six-year-old boat from Moorings in the BVI that had just came out of charter. I had a sea trial and out of water survey done on the spot and Moorings took care of all items, the worst of which were a bent prop (which they replaced while I was watching with a brand new one) and a leaking turbo. A couple of months later one of the AC units packed up and Moorings sold us one out of their inventory for $800. She is earning good net income in a secondary charter fleet.

I've also talked with Dream and believe them to be equally reputable. I have a friend who has a boat with Dream in the Met and he speaks highly of them.

Good luck

Thanks a lot.
There will always be people for and against, I don't get excited by that. I will go for the deal, just wanted to make sure I'm doing it the right way

[sailorr]

I have a friend who has a boat with Dream in the Met and he speaks highly of them.

Good luck[/QUOTE]

Is there a chance to contact him maybe?

[sailorr]

Thanks a lot.
Is there a chance to talk to your friend who's with dream in the med?

Originally Posted by jmschmidt

Hi Sailorr,

Some pretty bad advice and stupid opinions coming your way on your post. Many don't seem to know their you-know-whats from a hole in the ground.

Moorings/Sunsail/Footloose (same parent company) and Dream have excellent programs. You will get more high and low season owner's time than you can use along with guaranteed monthly income which is not based on the yacht's actual charter income. Plus all expenses will be paid for, and I do mean ALL.

A partner and I had a Moorings boat in Tahiti (Raiatea). After four years Moorings offered us 100% of our original price back on the purchase of one of their new boats but my partner (silly boy) wanted to buy me out so we didn't take the deal. Maintenance and surveyors in French Polynesia are not quite as good as at Moorings' main base in the BVI so they gave us a check for over $13,000 at the hand over for a bunch small items. We brought the boat to Honolulu with no problems.

Recently I bought a six-year-old boat from Moorings in the BVI that had just came out of charter. I had a sea trial and out of water survey done on the spot and Moorings took care of all items, the worst of which were a bent prop (which they replaced while I was watching with a brand new one) and a leaking turbo. A couple of months later one of the AC units packed up and Moorings sold us one out of their inventory for $800. She is earning good net income in a secondary charter fleet.

I've also talked with Dream and believe them to be equally reputable. I have a friend who has a boat with Dream in the Met and he speaks highly of them.

Good luck

[Symphony]

I have never entered into one of these charter management contracts, but I have delivered boats for a few companies and I found Dream Yacht a well run operation in Antigua and Abaco, Bahamas.

[Augi]

Originally Posted by sailorr

hi all,
after searching threads with that topic still have some unanswered questions.
I'm considering entering the DYC managment program caalled "dream easy" which in that program you put 35% downpayment, get few charter weeks a year and then at the end of the contract after 64 months you have 2 options:
1. walk away without paying nothing.
2. add another 25% and take over the boat.

I found a boat that is alreaady chartering for a year (the boat is 2017 model) which means the contract ends somewhere in 2022.
my qyestion is:
1. since the boat is going to be chartering for the next 4 years, is there a point of taking it into a survey before i make the final decision?

Checkout SailTime. SailTime allows you to rent a fractional share of usually either a Beneteau or Lagoon Yacht. Depending on the location, for example you can rent the use of Beneteau 40' for $800-$900 a month that allows you use of the boat 6 weeks a year and unlimited use if booked within 3-4 days if the boat is not booked. Included in the $800-$900 a month is the first tank of diesel, first tank of water, all maintenance, and marina fees at the boat's home base. An advantage is you always sail the same exact boat. It is only a year long commitment and if you want to re-up you can change to a different base and different boat every 12 months. The SailTime program works out to about 1/2 the price of chartering based on 6 weeks usage. If you use the boat on short notice a lot then it is much less than chartering. Possibly the only advantage of Dream Easy is Dream Yachts has bases all over the world where you can sail your 4-8 weeks a year they allot you when you buy a boat in their Dream Easy Program

[danielamartindm]

Originally Posted by sailorr

thanks for replying
at the end of the program therer is a long pahse-out stage and the boat should be given to me at a perfect condition with reasonable wear and tear

While charter companies vary in the maintenance they afford yachts, in my experience there is not much "reasonable" about the wear and tear that we typically see. "Perfect condition?"

[p435]

Originally Posted by sailorr

hi all,
...1. since the boat is going to be chartering for the next 4 years, is there a point of taking it into a survey before i make the final decision?

When I looked at charter boats a few years ago, I was surprised how much they are run down. Thus, I would always taking a survey done a person with critical eyes.

[Village Idiot]

Sailorr;

I have just got back from our first (6 week) trip on a boat we are buying on the DYC Dream Easy program , and in general at this stage only have good things to say about the company and program. PM me if you like for more info

Like you we bought a 2017 model at the end of 2017 ie less than 1 year into the contract / after one season's charter. Its not clear from the OP whether you are asking about a survey now or before you take the boat in 5 years but ;

I didn't get a survey before signing the contract as it was essentially a new boat and I am not buying it now, I am buying it in 5 years (well, about 4.3 years now), so its the condition at that point I am interested in.

As you have read there is an extensive phase out program and we have the right to have a surveyor involved from the final haul out and through the final season to ensure acceptable condition at handover. That survey I shall definitely be having , as well as spending time on the boat and at the base myself in the last year before taking it over.

As it happens the boat has now done 1.5 seasons, or 25% of its charter time, and at the moment I am happy with the amount of 'wear and tear' and the way it is being looked after.

Having said all that, ours is in Croatia which is probably the most favourable place to 'own' a charter boat. Having one somewhere like the Caribbean which gets more and harder use might well be a different story.