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Old 18-09-2017, 17:18   #1
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Beware! GEICO Marine Insurance for 1997 and older boats

Since my 1982 Hudson Force 50 will be on the hard for a couple years for extensive work, I was searching for options to insure it. I am mostly concerned with unlikely events such as fire and the boat falling off the stands as sinking or running into other boats are even more unlikely, given its dry location at my business. I thought there would be a significant discount because of this. Not so apparently.

Currently i am insured with BoatUS/GEICO and my premiums jumped up about 40% over last year with no claims. In my search for new insurance I was presented with the fact that without a new survey, no one else would insure me. My boat is not in very presentable condition with the rig down and many parts being taken apart to be repaired so I can't imagine a new survey doing me any favors in the value of my boat.

It was suggested by a nice insurance broker that I just stay with GEICO and pay what they are asking and have it surveyed after the refit is complete. Then I would have many more options of who to insure with. When we were discussing the risk of not having it insured at all, she let me in on a little know policy change that GEICO has done this year that I think impacts a lot of people.

In my scenario of my boat toppling off the stands, I doubt with the amount of fiberglass they used on this boat it would be a total loss. This is where the problem comes in. In the "Partial loss" area of the policy, it has been changed to read that after 20 years of age, they will depreciate the amount they will pay by 10%/year not to be less that 20% of the repair.

In my case, that would mean they will pay 20 cents on the dollar for the repair leaving me with the other 80%.
I have an "Agreed Hull Value" policy but unless I have a total loss it looks like I really have a 20% hull value policy. This seem criminal not to have spelled this change out clearly in the renewal. It was only by chance that I found out about it. This shows the very real value of having an insurance broker. She told me that GEICO did not even tell them what changed in their policies, only that there was a change. They had to figure it out for themselves.

If you have a 1997 or older boat and have GEICO insurance (BoatUS) you need to know this.
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Old 18-09-2017, 17:40   #2
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Re: Beware! GEICO Marine Insurance for 1997 and older boats

I recently bought a 34 foot boat that is going to be on the hard ( trailer) for a while, and only wanted liability. I got 300K$ without a survey, but when I launch and want enough liability for a marina I will have to get it surveyed to get the common 500K$. I didnt ask about hull insurance since I am into a major refit. How much insurance is your boat yard requiring? Yes it is Geico. ______ Grant.
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Old 18-09-2017, 17:42   #3
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Re: Beware! GEICO Marine Insurance for 1997 and older boats

Is it worth insuring on the hard in SD?
Why would it come off the stands?
I tried to insure on the hard; My company said
no. Not on your life nellie, in that yard.
So I was uninsured for 10yrs.
Never really understood why.
Saved myself 8K.
When I launched instant ok for insurance, no survey, no credit chk or how's your father, or if the boat even existed.
And you wonder why I am suspicious of them.
This worlds a circus, not sure i'm the clown or they are.
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Old 18-09-2017, 17:48   #4
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Re: Beware! GEICO Marine Insurance for 1997 and older boats

I just re-read your post and since your at your business, have you discussed with your business insurance company about adding the boat on? Marine insurance is pretty pricey and after these recent hurricanes I suspect it is going to get much worse. Just a thought. Good Luck. ____Grant.
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Old 18-09-2017, 18:22   #5
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Re: Beware! GEICO Marine Insurance for 1997 and older boats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wind River View Post
Since my 1982 Hudson Force 50 will be on the hard for a couple years for extensive work, I was searching for options to insure it. I am mostly concerned with unlikely events such as fire and the boat falling off the stands as sinking or running into other boats are even more unlikely, given its dry location at my business. I thought there would be a significant discount because of this. Not so apparently.

Currently i am insured with BoatUS/GEICO and my premiums jumped up about 40% over last year with no claims. In my search for new insurance I was presented with the fact that without a new survey, no one else would insure me. My boat is not in very presentable condition with the rig down and many parts being taken apart to be repaired so I can't imagine a new survey doing me any favors in the value of my boat.

It was suggested by a nice insurance broker that I just stay with GEICO and pay what they are asking and have it surveyed after the refit is complete. Then I would have many more options of who to insure with. When we were discussing the risk of not having it insured at all, she let me in on a little know policy change that GEICO has done this year that I think impacts a lot of people.

In my scenario of my boat toppling off the stands, I doubt with the amount of fiberglass they used on this boat it would be a total loss. This is where the problem comes in. In the "Partial loss" area of the policy, it has been changed to read that after 20 years of age, they will depreciate the amount they will pay by 10%/year not to be less that 20% of the repair.

In my case, that would mean they will pay 20 cents on the dollar for the repair leaving me with the other 80%.
I have an "Agreed Hull Value" policy but unless I have a total loss it looks like I really have a 20% hull value policy. This seem criminal not to have spelled this change out clearly in the renewal. It was only by chance that I found out about it. This shows the very real value of having an insurance broker. She told me that GEICO did not even tell them what changed in their policies, only that there was a change. They had to figure it out for themselves.

If you have a 1997 or older boat and have GEICO insurance (BoatUS) you need to know this.
I believe you are misinterpreting. My understanding is that they are talking about what constitutes a partial loss, not what they will pay on a partial loss.
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Old 18-09-2017, 18:32   #6
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Re: Beware! GEICO Marine Insurance for 1997 and older boats

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Originally Posted by MarkSF View Post
I believe you are misinterpreting. My understanding is that they are talking about what constitutes a partial loss, not what they will pay on a partial loss.
It says repairs...less depreciation. For my 27 yo boat That would be 70%. This merits clarification with geico. Geico sucks anyway.
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Old 18-09-2017, 18:36   #7
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Re: Beware! GEICO Marine Insurance for 1997 and older boats

I read that as the policy will pay a depreciating amount of the hull value. Meaning a reduction of 10% a year calculated from the hull value. So if the hull is worth $10K, they will pay an amount no less than $2K.

Disclaimer, I am a Health insurance guy, not a property insurance expert, so I could be wrong.
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Old 18-09-2017, 18:38   #8
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Re: Beware! GEICO Marine Insurance for 1997 and older boats

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkSF View Post
I believe you are misinterpreting. My understanding is that they are talking about what constitutes a partial loss, not what they will pay on a partial loss.
"We will pay the reasonable cost of repairs or replacements on accordance with quality marine practices, less the cost of depreciation."

How can that be interpreted any other way than what it plainly says?
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Old 18-09-2017, 18:43   #9
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Re: Beware! GEICO Marine Insurance for 1997 and older boats

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Originally Posted by Tetepare View Post
It says repairs...less depreciation. For my 27 yo boat That would be 70%. This merits clarification with geico. Geico sucks anyway.
My interpretation would be they would pay only 30% of the hull value in this case as they would depreciate 10% per year for 7 years..
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Old 18-09-2017, 18:45   #10
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Re: Beware! GEICO Marine Insurance for 1997 and older boats

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Originally Posted by sagablu View Post
I read that as the policy will pay a depreciating amount of the hull value. Meaning a reduction of 10% a year calculated from the hull value. So if the hull is worth $10K, they will pay an amount no less than $2K.

Disclaimer, I am a Health insurance guy, not a property insurance expert, so I could be wrong.
This is the way I read it too. Much to my dismay!
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Old 18-09-2017, 19:19   #11
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Re: Beware! GEICO Marine Insurance for 1997 and older boats

I just emailed BoatUS/Geico. We will see how they respond.

THEN I will call them because verbal and written usually get different responses- the latter being legal mumbo jumbo and verbal being the truth.

What is NOT clear is depreciation of what? The repair cost? Or the boat value? The market value or agreed value? Either way these bastages are screwing us.

Not that it's just Geico anymore. My home insurance is Amica and they're playing games with me on a claim- Amica, for God's sake!

Why, why did I get an honest career? What a waste of time for little return. Next life I'm going to work in insurance or forensic accounting. Better yet, I'll get an advanced degree in forensic accounting and work for a big firm, become a whistle blower, and get my 10% from the government. Or maybe I'll work for the government and be a whistle blower...oh, never mind, that gets one in prison or Vince Fostered.
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Old 18-09-2017, 19:46   #12
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Re: Beware! GEICO Marine Insurance for 1997 and older boats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tetepare View Post
It says repairs...less depreciation. For my 27 yo boat That would be 70%. This merits clarification with geico. Geico sucks anyway.

Imho, they ALL suck.
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Old 18-09-2017, 20:09   #13
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Re: Beware! GEICO Marine Insurance for 1997 and older boats

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Imho, they ALL suck.
Truth. Like politicians and banks, they all suck. But if one is revealed to be the suckiest, we can try to find one that sucks less. If BoatUS is really screwing us, it's an opportunity to find a better insurance. I had Chubb for auto insurance, then they stuck in a particular provision, and everyone I know bailed. That's the beauty of the internet...ah....finding out who sucks less. Truly a wonderful challenge in life (not).


BoatUS insurance used to be great. If we discover they suck now with Geico (which would be no surprise to me) then we as a community quit BoatUS and maybe they'll get the message. Ship, BoatUS selling the insurance arm to Geico is like Porsche selling production to GM. Idiots. Whoever decided that would be a good idea should be fired after being drawn and quartered. Of course, "MORON" is rampant these days, case in point the Equifax disaster, lead by a CSO who has only music degrees. Welcome to the NWO.
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Old 19-09-2017, 08:41   #14
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Re: Beware! GEICO Marine Insurance for 1997 and older boats

One paragraph out of the context of the entire contract is a bit difficult to really understand.

It might be that this paragraph defines what a total versus partial loss would be regardless of the AHV is. Thus the older a boat gets, the lower the threshold for totaling the boat.

Be interested in hearing what the insurance company says.
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Old 19-09-2017, 08:48   #15
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Re: Beware! GEICO Marine Insurance for 1997 and older boats

Marine Insurance for Boats, Yachts, Charters, Commercial

Give those folks a call. I assume they will also want a survey.
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