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Old 21-08-2012, 00:57   #16
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Re: Advice & Opinions From Owners Of Boats In Charter In The Caribbean Please

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Originally Posted by Sander View Post
Well I live in Andalucia in southern Spain and I would put money on the Caribbean being efficient and service minded in comparison!
Ha, I had to giggle. We lived in Andalucia too (Near San Juan de los Terreros) and I know exactly what you mean
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Old 21-08-2012, 13:30   #17
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Hi Bill, thanks for your opinion on the moorings charter program.
I'm sure you are aware that not everyone shares this opinion nor your positive experiences. There are very many dissatisfied moorings "owners". Either way though, it doesn't matter. If you are happy then that's great.
It's not reasonable of you though to assume your numbers reflect a "good deal" because you forget a few things in your calculations.
- at what price could you have bought the boat outside the moorings?
- what return would you have made on the money you spent had it been invested?
- how much interest did you pay over the entire period?
- what was the present value of the sales price achieved at the end of the program?
- how much income did you give up by going for a guaranteed income?
- do you know if "your" boat chartered for 25 or 30 weeks? (In that case a variable program would have paid you much much more)
It is one thing to be naive about the numbers because you passionately want to believe its a good deal and you really want an affordable way to buy a boat but if you do the numbers properly and include opportunity cost and compare to alternatives it isn't as clear as you make out.
As always with boats, the emotion drives the decision because financially it never makes sense. It's about finding the best and cheapest way that's fits your pans. Your plans may be different to mine.
Also, your numbers only reflect cashflow, not profit and loss.
Do you really think both parties made money on this? Why wouldn't moorings buy and finance the boat themselves? You took all the risk!
Anyway, please don't get emotional and assume I am "guessing" just because you don't like my post. I'm not guessing, I'm not being emotional and I am very experienced when it comes to finance. I have offers right here in front of me.
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Old 21-08-2012, 13:37   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fizzwizz

Ha, I had to giggle. We lived in Andalucia too (Near San Juan de los Terreros) and I know exactly what you mean
I hope I am right on this fizzwizz! I can't imagine the Caribbean being worse than southern Spain!
It's no coincidence that it's the southern med countries that are suffering the most in these times of crisis. Culture and climate!
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Old 05-09-2012, 15:30   #19
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Re: Advice & Opinions From Owners Of Boats In Charter In The Caribbean Please

Have you read "Don't stop the Carnival" by Herman Wouk ?

Dave L38 #38[/QUOTE]

I read the book over 10 years ago and liked it so much I read it two times while sitting on the beach in Barbados.
Always dreamed of doing the same thing. Now I hope to pick up a cat and do something similar, but on a boat. Still learning about all of the rules and surprises.
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Old 05-09-2012, 18:46   #20
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Re: Advice & Opinions From Owners Of Boats In Charter In The Caribbean Please

We looked at the Moorings and Sunsail and decided against them primarily because we didn't want to buy the boat that they wanted to sell us. We ended up with an owner's version Lagoon 400 in charter with SailCaribe out of Fajardo Puerto Rico. After two years we traded up to a 2012 Lagoon 450 owner's version with all of the options that we wanted.

With both boats we had our choice of a guaranteed monthly payment, a profit sharing agreement, or a limited charter agreement if we wanted to only have it chartered under certain circumstances or certain times.

The maintenance has been great. SailCaribe is associated with Atlas Yacht Sales and they have filled in the gaps that Lagoon leaves in warranty service.

You can permit bareboat or crewed only charters and for bareboat charter the charterers must supply a boating resume AND demonstrate their ability to maneuver the boat, use the systems, and raise and lower the sails. If they fail, they have the choice of paying for a captain, or staying at the dock. While this hasn't always kept the boats from being less than pampered, the SailCaribe crew has done an admirable job of repairing or replacing as needed.

Not only are we happy with our experiences with SailCaribe, we recommended them to a friend who is now buying a new boat to place into charter with them.


Lucky Larry
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Old 08-09-2012, 06:44   #21
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Re: Advice & Opinions From Owners Of Boats In Charter In The Caribbean Please

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Originally Posted by Sander View Post
Hi all,
I am interested in any information and experiences from boat owners with Caribbean charter companies please.
I intend to leave a brand new 44ft cat with one of these companies (have decided against the guaranteed income programs) and want to know who is going to take the best care of her. Income is secondary.

- are these companies honest about what needs repairing and replacing?
- do they give your boat to anyone who books it, experienced or not?
- do they do hull inspections post charter (dive)?
- are the technical staff properly trained in maintenance of the brands in the fleet?
- how is the relationship wit the boat owner?
- are they service minded and can you easily communicate with them?

I see a lot of posts about different companies but very few from the owners perspective.
Thanks for your responses.
Alex
My experience was a bad one. I went with a mom and pop charter company (no longer in business) operating out of Eluthera in the Bahamas. They treated it like a rent a car and it came back in shambles with sails torn, hull damaged from someone not securing the anchor and letting it swing into the bow repeatedly and the engine ruined from lack of maintainence.

Be very careful.

RT
PS BTW what is the origin of your name Sander. I am curious because my son Alexander goes by Sander for short.
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Old 08-09-2012, 08:36   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky Larry
We looked at the Moorings and Sunsail and decided against them primarily because we didn't want to buy the boat that they wanted to sell us. We ended up with an owner's version Lagoon 400 in charter with SailCaribe out of Fajardo Puerto Rico. After two years we traded up to a 2012 Lagoon 450 owner's version with all of the options that we wanted.

.....l


Lucky Larry
After seeing the new Moorings 3900 (Leopard 39), it was exactly what we were looking for. Owners version, solar, diesel gen, good davit system, hard top bimini,excellent helm, storage galore, fantastic fridge/freezer, good electronics, ect.etc.,

So far very pleased with our decision to go with Moorings.... Now just wish plane ticket prices hadn't sky rocketed so much... That was the only thing not in the plans... Aw well!
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Old 09-09-2012, 00:21   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vtcapo

My experience was a bad one. I went with a mom and pop charter company (no longer in business) operating out of Eluthera in the Bahamas. They treated it like a rent a car and it came back in shambles with sails torn, hull damaged from someone not securing the anchor and letting it swing into the bow repeatedly and the engine ruined from lack of maintainence.

Be very careful.

RT
PS BTW what is the origin of your name Sander. I am curious because my son Alexander goes by Sander for short.
I'm also Alexander. Sander for short. It's a Dutch habit!
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Old 09-09-2012, 07:06   #24
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We bought our boat after she came out of a five year charter service with Sunsail. We put her into a second tier charter company in the BVis. We have literally just taken her out of service and moved her to Puerto Rico where we are outfitting her for cruising, our approximate departure date is November 1st. The charter company was sad to see her go because she was one of the best charterers.

In general, we were happy with the way the charter company took care of her and really liked the people at the charter company. We were very involved owners, we visited the boat often 3-4 times a years for 2-3 weeks at a time. That and the fact that we took the time to do upgrades to her when we visited I believe had a big impact on her care. But to answer you questions:

1. Were they honest about what needed repairs -- about the big stuff yes. On the other hand, we bought a lot of lightbulbs (one of the first things we did after we bought the boat was replace all of the bulbs with LEDs. Sometimes, it seemed as if they had charged us for work we had done when we were on the boat.

2. Do they give the boat to anyone -- can't say for sure. But in our experience, the most noticeable thing that the boat was being used were the engine hours. It appears that everyone that sailed the boat knew the basics and treated the boat well.

3. Hull inspections -- yes. They even did hull inspections when we brought the boat back!

4. Properly trained maintenance staff -- the honest answer is yes and no. At a second tier charter company, they have many different kinds of boats. We had already decided to replace the refrigeration on the boat when we moved aboard. The refrigeration crapped out last fall and they brought in someone to install the new system we purchased because it was beyond their capabilities. Initially I was please to be getting the work done before we got there, now looking at how they had it installed I wish we had done it. The first thing we will be changing is the wiring, the refrigerator side of the system is showing a fault and the wire is very hot -- an indication to us that the wire is undersized. While in Puerto Rico we are completely replacing all of the standing rigging. We met with the rigger yesterday to review what he found after inspecting the boat. The good news is there were no major issues. On the other hand, there were silly little things that made us wonder what they were thinking. One example is that we had them replace the main sail last winter, when they put it on they just tied the halyard to the top of the sail rather than using a shackle. This is a small thing but I guess I would have used the shackle from the old sail. There were small things that made us wonder if they were cutting corners or, with short turn around times between charters, they were quick fixes that never got completely fixed -- we will never know.

5. We had a great relationship with the charter company, but as I stated before we were there a lot and our boat was chartered a lot.

6. They were very service minded and extremely easy to communicate with.

For us the experience was positive. We had done and did ourselves many upgrades to the boat while she was in charter service. There are always glitches when you are trying to do things long distance and communication about what you want done will not always be understood exactly as you meant it. In the end, we would both be willing to do it again.

Robyn
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Old 09-09-2012, 07:27   #25
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Re: Advice & Opinions From Owners Of Boats In Charter In The Caribbean Please

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I'm also Alexander. Sander for short. It's a Dutch habit!
Thanks for the info and good luck...

RT
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Old 26-01-2013, 07:31   #26
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Re: Advice & Opinions From Owners Of Boats In Charter In The Caribbean Please

Mrs_Dergon are looking ahead to a point in our lives where we will have more time for cruising and considering Moorings/other for the point where I transition to part-time work.

A couple of questions.

Someone really needs to start a full detailed blog about the day-to-day (or week to week) experience as a charter owner ....I'd read it!

If you have your boat in Tortola at the BVI Moorings base do you take *your* boat when you to the BVI or just get a similar boat? Are you under the same chartering agreement when you get on your boat in the BVI? Or could you, for intstance, pick? up your boat for a few weeks, make a passage, cruise in some other grounds, make a passage back and drop it back in the BVI?
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Old 26-01-2013, 07:51   #27
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Re: Advice & Opinions From Owners Of Boats In Charter In The Caribbean Please

Here's an actual case.
The Usual Suspects - Caribbean Sailing Adventures
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Old 26-01-2013, 11:50   #28
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Re: Advice & Opinions From Owners Of Boats In Charter In The Caribbean Please

Someone really needs to start a full detailed blog about the day-to-day (or week to week) experience as a charter owner ....I'd read it
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vasco View Post
Now THAT is service. Thank you. I've been reading with great interest for the last hour!
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