Adding 5ft means what in extra $$$?!

[presentmoment]

I need some advice to steer me away from a larger boat!

A 30ft sailboat VS. a 35ft VS. a 40ft? Does those 5 extra ft mean ?% more in maintenance and running or what?

Also, same question relative to volume inside the boat...how much does 5 extra feet translate to inside living room?

This link describes the boat Im in the market for :

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ans-87124.html

Cheers!

[speedoo]

Adding five extra feet will at least double your costs for pretty much everything.. What the extra feet does in terms of volume will depend on the beam and hull form. If you compare a 35 footer to a 30 footer of the same type of boat (in terms of beam to length ratio, and whether or not the boat has long overhangs) you should at least double the interior volume.

So the question then becomes, what is the benefit you are getting relative to the additional cost. Most of the time, the answer to that question is a direct function of how you intend to use the boat, and how many will be aboard.

[Nemo55]

Also berthing fees, slip fees,,etc.

[Cheechako]

Room is very particular to a given boat. An old school narrow boat like a Cape Dory 35 might have the same room as a newer beamier 32 ft boat etc. Generally, at about 40 feet you start getting 2 heads and 2 staterooms. Moorage costs add up and hauling bottom painting adds up. Other than that, not sure there is a huge maintenance hit.... IF the boats you are comparing dont need a bunch of equipment replaced. If they do, then a Self Tailing winch for a 40 footer is a lot more $ than for a 30 footer!

[presentmoment]

wow...good to know...5 extra feet is double the cost and volume...roughly. No wonder everyone raves about small boats. So for a single guy or couple...no more than 35ft? To live and sail on I mean...

[Cheechako]

I was very happy on 30-32 ft as a couple. However, 38-40 feels real nice for sure. a 30 footer is more forgiving for single handing/docking etc. When you make a docking error, you can still fend off a 30 footer a little. Forget it on a 40 footer! The mainsail goes up in a flash on a 30 footer etc. Realistically, it's about what you can find. if you can find a 37 footer with a real good engine, recent sails, bottom etc, then costs wont be that much higher. But 32 feet is simple and easy...
35 feet doesnt feel double the volume to me at all. But 35 feet is kind of a scarce commodity it seems....

[presentmoment]

well i dont need 2 heads and 2 staterooms thats for sure. Just a good comfortable size for 2 people with rare guests. If I have a double for me and the ms. and a couple singles for buddies and a galley that turns into a bed that would be just perfect. A Nav station would be nice too. With headroom for a 6 ft guy...

[presentmoment]

Thanx! So conclusion at this point is 30 - 35 ft....any boat suggestions?

[Stu Jackson]

If you don't hang out in marinas, the costs will be pretty much the same. I know, this flies in the face of everything you've heard, but except for sails and standing rigging, things are pretty much the same for everything else on the boat.

One or two heads would make a difference, but think about it: how many freshwater pumps do you have? One. How many engines? One. How many raw water pumps on your engine? One. How many hot water heaters? One. This list goes on.

For example, Catalina 30s, 34s and 36s have exactly the same systems on board.

So, rather than thinking that length alone doubles or trebles costs, think about what systems are on the boat, and where you're going to be sailing, before you start to creep out about rising costs.

Previous replies about boat volume based on length AND beam are spot on. The difference in volume between a Catalina 22 and a 25 is double. As you start to compare 30s and 35s, not so much. And the seaworthy layouts of some boats, compared to harbor condos is an amazing thing. If you plan to actually sail the boat, you would be wise to carefully considered the seagoing layouts down below as compared to some of the wide-open spaces down below on some newer models that are downright dangerous when at sea.

Good luck.

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by presentmoment

wow...good to know...5 extra feet is double the cost and volume...roughly. No wonder everyone raves about small boats. So for a single guy or couple...no more than 35ft? To live and sail on I mean...

I dunno about double for 35 foot to 40. But I think 30 to 40 in the ballpark........but that's comparing like for like - and in practice that rarely happens, if only because at 40' there is room for more mod cons - and therefore stuff gets fitted, whether by builder or PO(s). or you!

IMO the costs will be more affected by the condition you buy in - always costs more to do maintanence in arrears. Which is often enough why folks sell boats (past deferred maintanence accumulates to a point it makes sense to sell the bills to someone else - rather than actually pay them ).

And of course some same sized boats are bigger than others! - especially when you compare accross decades. Interior volume sells. Which is "better" is really down to each person to decide the likely use.

Personally I would say that if 35 foot (plus or minus a couple of feet, depending on the boat / the deal) ain't enough room (and boat) for a single person then perhaps being onboard a boat 24/7 for extended periods ain't for you. Not to say that bigger does not have pros - but IMO getting into the realms of nice to have, rather than need.

I read your other thread, I think you really need to get onboard a few boats (of varying ages, lengths and designs) just to get a feel for what you are looking at, then have a good hard think about what you are actually going to use the boat for - rather than might one day think about doing. maybe.........by that I mean; if most of the use is going to be coastal hopping and maybe the occassional ocean crossing (to change continents) and you won't be in any great rush to do either - then you don't need a boat that is capable of handling the North Face of the Eiger in January .....so can trade some of that capability for money / onboard conveniances (who cares if that galley might be a PITA or even a tad dangerous in a F10 gale? - or that the boat might not survive a direct hit by a nuclear weapon ..............if 99.99% (and hopefully 100%!) of the time you will be anchored somewhere warm, at anchor and sipping a cool beer . (and at which point that double sized fridge instead of a wet locker for weather gear">foul weather gear will seem a fair enough trade off).

[presentmoment]

Copy those comments. Volume inside is design plus length and beam. And costs are mainly due to systems on board and sails/rigging - not necessarily just boat size.

What about fuel costs...bigger boats cost much more to push?

[Cheechako]

Originally Posted by presentmoment

Thanx! So conclusion at this point is 30 - 35 ft....any boat suggestions?

hmmmm, alot of boats out there. Depends on your need for performance. Caliber 33 supposed to be a good boat, Wauquiez made some great boats and some in the 35 ft range, Island Packet always a good bet, Pacific Seacraft, Nauticat. Personally I would stay away from older Taiwan boats with teak decks, and Beneteau, Hunter, Catalina and the newer light boats like that. Nothing wrong with those boats at all, just doesnt sound like what you are looking for. 30 is a little tight if you're having guests aboard.

[Stu Jackson]

Originally Posted by presentmoment

C

What about fuel costs...bigger boats cost much more to push?

Good point. Here's a real world experience: in the 25+ years that Catalina produced our C34s and C36s, they had a series of engines in them. Started in the early to mid-80s with M25s, 21 HP and M25XPs 23 HP. They got 1/2 gallon per hour. Newer Mark II boats, same boats, had M35 30HP engines which slurped anywhere from 0.75 to 1.2 GPH. Same size fuel tanks, half the range.

Now one could make the point that that's DOUBLE the fuel consumption. Sure it is. But one has to factor in the amount of motoring time overall in the big scheme of things. Even coastal cruising wouldn't make a big dent in your wallet if you're blessed with an ocean that has wind. If, however, you're say "sailing" in the California Delta or the AICW, where motoring takes precedence, then it WILL make a HUGE difference.

Your boat, your choice.

[gjordan]

I have told this story a few times before on this forum, but here goes. We started cruising with an engineless 26 foot fiberglass boat. Well equiped but no frills. Had a great time and sailed for many miles. 10 years later I owned a beautiful 44 foot boat and cruised and lived aboard. I had a fridge and freezer, hot and cold pressure water etc etc. After a few years on the 44 we figured out that we were spending as much per month to cruise the 44 as we had spent per year to cruise on the 26. It was a shock to come to that realization. The comfort level was way better, but the work ( and expense)of keeping her in good condition was also way up. We all like bigger boats until the bills start coming in. Best of Luck to you.____Grant.

[jeremiason]

Another thing to consider is what you are going to do with the boat.

More waterline normally means more speed and if you are traveling long distances, a knot or two extra boat speed could mean the difference of a day or two of sailing time or arriving in the dark.

Larger boats also have heaver loads on the rig and although doable, become more of a challenge to single hand.

As previously stated it is all about give and take... Yes larger boats are more expensive to maintain, from bottom painting, berth rates and sails... but the bottom line is that you have to decide your comfortable with.