Scuba, Hookah, Brownie Alternatives?

[Fishspearit]

Thanks for the link Canibul. I see why the Captain was relieved, a lot of strange things there. I suspect they were non divers tending the lines because there should have been a signal sent that they were going down before the line was fed out. But even stranger is that they went in with enough air for a 1/2 hour at 20 feet. An aluminum 80 will last 2 hours at 20 feet. They would have had to have been using pony bottles or nearly empty tanks.

[Charlie]

How's this for an idea. Use a truck tire inflator running on a 12V battery and attached to an Air Carry Tank such as this : Northern Industrial Air Carry Tank — 5 Gallon |Air Compressor Accessories | Northern Tool + Equipment Attach an approved hose and a second stage regulator to the Air Tank. This would be used for cleaning the bottom etc. Not diving. Thought is that the compressor would probably not be enough to allow someone to dive but the extra air in the Carry tank would allow for a long enough time underwater to accomplish cleaning the bottom or clearing the prop. Tank is on sale for less than $20 Tire inflator can be had for less than 40$ Don't know about hose and regulator.

[fstbttms]

Originally Posted by Charlie

How's this for an idea. Use a truck tire inflator running on a 12V battery and attached to an Air Carry Tank such as this : Northern Industrial Air Carry Tank — 5 Gallon |Air Compressor Accessories | Northern Tool + Equipment Attach an approved hose and a second stage regulator to the Air Tank. This would be used for cleaning the bottom etc. Not diving. Thought is that the compressor would probably not be enough to allow someone to dive but the extra air in the Carry tank would allow for a long enough time underwater to accomplish cleaning the bottom or clearing the prop. Tank is on sale for less than $20 Tire inflator can be had for less than 40$ Don't know about hose and regulator.

Two problems:
1.- You would breath that little tank down to nothing in no time flat. I have seen divers burn the better part of a 2000cf bottle just doing one boat. I suspect the 5-gallon tank would be next to useless.

2.- A steel tank like that will rust out from the inside in short order, being used in a marine environment. You'd be sucking down mud before you knew it.

Cheaping-out on underwater breathing apparatus is a big mistake, IMHO. If you can't bring yourself to pay for proper dive gear, you shouldn't be going into the water.

[kydivemaster]

Goto EBay buy a use reg, and first stage and a older tank. Have everything checked out well then buy yourselg a 50' hose for the reg to first stage connection....You'll have $200-$250 in the setup and you'll be set for just what your doing.

Keith

[fstbttms]

Originally Posted by fstbttms

Two problems:
1.- You would breath that little tank down to nothing in no time flat. I have seen divers burn the better part of a 2000cf bottle just doing one boat. I suspect the 5-gallon tank would be next to useless.

Here's an update:
Last week I bought a gas-powered compressor that I will be using in a hookah rig. It came with two 2-gallon reserve tanks for a total of 4 gallons reserve air. I will be removing the tanks and associated plumbing for the hookah, but as a test, I pressurized the tanks, shut the compressor off and then breathed the tanks down. On the dock, breathing relatively deeply, I got about 3 minutes of usable air. I guarantee that if I had been in the water working, swimming, whatever, it would have been less. FYI.

[schoonerdog]

I'm a newbie scuba diver, (open water cert), with just a few dives under my belt. Tell me about the pros and cons of the hookah? I would imagine a con would be that if there were two of you diving and you were needing a decompression stop, the air going out for one would more than likely go out for your partner as well. To travel around do you tow the dingy and drift dive? It sounds like it could be a good idea, but I would assume that all of the scuba safety precautions and training would still be needed?

Originally Posted by Louis Riel

I just tried my Brownies third lung this summer. What a great way to dive. No big hunk of metal on your back, no more hydros , visuals and fills. It worked well down to 70 feet. Skip the huge float ring and fibreglass inner ring. Just put the compressor in your dinghy and tie it down.Leave that bulky crap ashore.Too much weight , storage space wasted and too much hassle to set up.
It takes far less room than a couple of tanks, is lighter and you can dive for hours on a bit of gas. No more worries about how much air you are wasting. Huff and puff like a locomotive if you want.
Brent

[Brent Swain]

You could hook a cheap generator to power a cheap diaphragm or oiless compressor and put the works in your dinghy.
Brent

[viking69]

i bought a hookah unit here in oz. it has been great. soon as you drag it out to use it in the marina you have people wanting to pay you to do their boat or can they hire it? but me i like the barter system so see what they have to offer. but asside from that it has been great. i use it to collect crays etc and i reckon it has paid for itself a 100 times over. here is a link.
DeckSnorkel | Powerdive

[salty_dog_68]

Back in the day...i worked for a yacht maint. outfit for a few years. Primarily, i was the "brightwork guy" but throughout the year, particularly in the summer, I would help out the dive team cleaning bottoms. The set-up we used was a hooka - 2nd stage regulator attached to a 50' high pressure air hose attached to 1st stage regulator attached to a aluminum 100 scuba tank. The reason I bring this up is the high pressure air hose we used. For years before I got there and for years after I left the h.p. hose was bought from a retail goodyear tire and rubber supplier. The hose was the same hose you would use at the gas station to fill your tires and certainly not rated for air breathing. I was young and ignorant to the fact that the hoses could have ruined my lungs. Now that I have me own sailboat I returned to that goodyear store to buy some hose for my cockpit drain scuppers. The first thing I noticed when I walked into the store is a huge sign over the counter "The hose we sell her is not approved for breating air -do not use it for that purpose." That yacht maint company had 5-7 divers breathing thru that hose 8-9 hours a day year round. I felt no ill effects and did not hear of anyone else getting sick. I guess we were just lucky. Also, I hope Phil has changed his hose supplier.

side note to newbie diver - the difference between diving with hooka and diving with tank and bc is huge. It is almost as good a sex to breathe underwater and not have the big bulky and cumbersome tank and bc to drag along. I recommend diving with hooka if you ever get the chance.

[Billiam]

I think this may work......

** pic 2542 the compressor is a cheap Husky. You could use any unit as long as it's oilless and can go up to at least 135-140 lbs. I think mine was about $100 a couple years ago. I figure cheap because no matter what you get the salt water is going to eat it up. I figured it's just be throw away every few years and go to Lowes and get another one. The rest of the systme should last a long time.

** pic 2543 the reg I got off ebay real cheap. This is a cheap back up reg. You don't want a main reg the back ups are designed to work on a little less pressure. Plus getting banged around on a boat they are cheap to replace. Also make sure you get the hose with it.

** pic 2544 the air filter I also got off ebay from Divers Supply. Not sure how bad you really need this but I got one on my main air line but don't have one on the secound line. Plus notice the brass fittings connecting the filter to the air hose. You need a few of these.

** pic 2545 The water filter for the tank. I got a small one for mine to make it take less space. Big misstake get the bigger one and put up with the hassle. Mine will fill with water with one diver in and hour or less. You also see the t-fitting I built. The permanate connection on the right is for my main 50' air hose. The quick disconnect is for connecting to the air tank, and the left T is the connection for the 2nd. air hose for 2 people. If I'm not using it you can see the quick disconnect I put on and just stuff some putty into the connector to block it. And again a few fittings to be put together.

** pic 2546 the 2nd air hose. This will connect to the tank for 2 - 50' air lines or to the other air hose to give you 100'

** The air hose is a starndard 3/8" ID 50' air hose from Lowes they came in black, blue, and orange, I got the orange it stands out great floating on the water so people can see it.

Thats it pretty simple and works, great. I don't know all the sizes of the little fittings I just carried it in to Lowes and home depot and set on the floor in front of the fitting bins and started putting it together untill I found the right sizes. Once you find them I think there was only like 3 sizes for all of them.
** pic 2542 the compressor is a cheap Husky. You could use any unit as long as it's oilless and can go up to at least 135-140 lbs. I think mine was about $100 a couple years ago. I figure cheap because no matter what you get the salt water is going to eat it up. I figured it's just be throw away every few years and go to Lowes and get another one. The rest of the systme should last a long time.

** pic 2543 the reg I got off ebay real cheap. This is a cheap back up reg. You don't want a main reg the back ups are designed to work on a little less pressure. Plus getting banged around on a boat they are cheap to replace. Also make sure you get the hose with it.

** pic 2544 the air filter I also got off ebay from Divers Supply. Not sure how bad you really need this but I got one on my main air line but don't have one on the secound line. Plus notice the brass fittings connecting the filter to the air hose. You need a few of these.

** pic 2545 The water filter for the tank. I got a small one for mine to make it take less space. Big misstake get the bigger one and put up with the hassle. Mine will fill with water with one diver in and hour or less. You also see the t-fitting I built. The permanate connection on the right is for my main 50' air hose. The quick disconnect is for connecting to the air tank, and the left T is the connection for the 2nd. air hose for 2 people. If I'm not using it you can see the quick disconnect I put on and just stuff some putty into the connector to block it. And again a few fittings to be put together.

** pic 2546 the 2nd air hose. This will connect to the tank for 2 - 50' air lines or to the other air hose to give you 100'

** The air hose is a starndard 3/8" ID 50' air hose from Lowes they came in black, blue, and orange, I got the orange it stands out great floating on the water so people can see it.

Thats it pretty simple and works, great. I don't know all the sizes of the little fittings I just carried it in to Lowes and home depot and set on the floor in front of the fitting bins and started putting it together untill I found the right sizes. Once you find them I think there was only like 3 sizes for all of them.
** pic 2542 the compressor is a cheap Husky. You could use any unit as long as it's oilless and can go up to at least 135-140 lbs. I think mine was about $100 a couple years ago. I figure cheap because no matter what you get the salt water is going to eat it up. I figured it's just be throw away every few years and go to Lowes and get another one. The rest of the systme should last a long time.

** pic 2543 the reg I got off ebay real cheap. This is a cheap back up reg. You don't want a main reg the back ups are designed to work on a little less pressure. Plus getting banged around on a boat they are cheap to replace. Also make sure you get the hose with it.

** pic 2544 the air filter I also got off ebay from Divers Supply. Not sure how bad you really need this but I got one on my main air line but don't have one on the secound line. Plus notice the brass fittings connecting the filter to the air hose. You need a few of these.

** pic 2545 The water filter for the tank. I got a small one for mine to make it take less space. Big misstake get the bigger one and put up with the hassle. Mine will fill with water with one diver in and hour or less. You also see the t-fitting I built. The permanate connection on the right is for my main 50' air hose. The quick disconnect is for connecting to the air tank, and the left T is the connection for the 2nd. air hose for 2 people. If I'm not using it you can see the quick disconnect I put on and just stuff some putty into the connector to block it. And again a few fittings to be put together.

** pic 2546 the 2nd air hose. This will connect to the tank for 2 - 50' air lines or to the other air hose to give you 100'

** The air hose is a starndard 3/8" ID 50' air hose from Lowes they came in black, blue, and orange, I got the orange it stands out great floating on the water so people can see it.

Thats it pretty simple and works, great. I don't know all the sizes of the little fittings I just carried it in to Lowes and home depot and set on the floor in front of the fitting bins and started putting it together untill I found the right sizes. Once you find them I think there was only like 3 sizes for all of them.

[Billiam]

I think they call this the KISS principle

** pic 2542 the compressor is a cheap Husky. You could use any unit as long as it's oilless and can go up to at least 135-140 lbs. I think mine was about $100 a couple years ago. I figure cheap because no matter what you get the salt water is going to eat it up. I figured it's just be throw away every few years and go to Lowes and get another one. The rest of the systme should last a long time.

** pic 2543 the reg I got off ebay real cheap. This is a cheap back up reg. You don't want a main reg the back ups are designed to work on a little less pressure. Plus getting banged around on a boat they are cheap to replace. Also make sure you get the hose with it.

** pic 2544 the air filter I also got off ebay from Divers Supply. Not sure how bad you really need this but I got one on my main air line but don't have one on the secound line. Plus notice the brass fittings connecting the filter to the air hose. You need a few of these.

** pic 2545 The water filter for the tank. I got a small one for mine to make it take less space. Big misstake get the bigger one and put up with the hassle. Mine will fill with water with one diver in and hour or less. You also see the t-fitting I built. The permanate connection on the right is for my main 50' air hose. The quick disconnect is for connecting to the air tank, and the left T is the connection for the 2nd. air hose for 2 people. If I'm not using it you can see the quick disconnect I put on and just stuff some putty into the connector to block it. And again a few fittings to be put together.

** pic 2546 the 2nd air hose. This will connect to the tank for 2 - 50' air lines or to the other air hose to give you 100'

** The air hose is a starndard 3/8" ID 50' air hose from Lowes they came in black, blue, and orange, I got the orange it stands out great floating on the water so people can see it.

Thats it pretty simple and works, great. I don't know all the sizes of the little fittings I just carried it in to Lowes and home depot and set on the floor in front of the fitting bins and started putting it together untill I found the right sizes. Once you find them I think there was only like 3 sizes for all of them.

sorry,no pics

[fstbttms]

Originally Posted by Billiam

The air hose is a starndard 3/8" ID 50' air hose from Lowes they came in black, blue, and orange, I got the orange it stands out great floating on the water so people can see it.

Holy kee-ryst. Pneumatic hose is designed to do one thing; provide air to pneumatic tools. It is not designed to provide safe breathing air to humans underwater (or anywhere else.) The manufacturers test the hose with oil-laden air under pressure. That oil didn't disappear from the hose when you ignorantly included it in your hookah rig. Do you believe for a second that you are not breathing that oil when you use such hose for a purpose for which it was never intended? It's your life and your health, but if you want the advice of someone who dives professionally with surface supplied air every day, ditch the cheapo hardware store crap and only use hose designed to provide clean, safe breathing air underwater.

The same goes for using a hardware store compressor with a steel reservoir. That thing is going to rust out in short order and you will be breathing mud. The only materials suitable for that application are aluminum, stainless or plastic.

[S/V Aphrodite]

Pneumatic rubber hose is not suitable for hookah use. The fact that the air smells funny will give you a clue. You can use the plastic hose that comes with many air compressors, but the coil acts like a spring and pulls you back to the surface unless you're using a lot of weight. Better to just buy straight uncoiled hose.

Suitable breathing hose can be obtained from Keene Engineering (www.keeneeng.com), approx $75 for a 50ft hose. They also sell both low and high pressure reserve tanks to fit in-line as well as every thing else you need to build your own hookah system.

The main problem seems to be getting a good oil-less compressor. The standard industrial compressors will eventually rust inside. I suspect that if you drain the water routinely and use a water separator and in-line filter you can get by with the Husky or Porter-Cable or Sears compressors just fine. In fact, I see a lot of boat cleaners using such rigs around Oahu routinely.

I started with a cheap inflation air compressor from Costco. It works okay with a 4 gal reserve tank up to 25 feet. But it is only good for 15 to 20 min continuous use before you have to shut it off to cool. That's not adequate for cleaning my boat or even snorkeling. So, I'm going to get an electric pancake compressor and use that.

Cheers,

Carl

[fstbttms]

Originally Posted by S/V Aphrodite

The main problem seems to be getting a good oil-less compressor. The standard industrial compressors will eventually rust inside. I suspect that if you drain the water routinely and use a water separator and in-line filter you can get by with the Husky or Porter-Cable or Sears compressors just fine. In fact, I see a lot of boat cleaners using such rigs around Oahu routinely.

I started with a cheap inflation air compressor from Costco. It works okay with a 4 gal reserve tank up to 25 feet. But it is only good for 15 to 20 min continuous use before you have to shut it off to cool. That's not adequate for cleaning my boat or even snorkeling. So, I'm going to get an electric pancake compressor and use that.

With the proper compressor, a reserve tank and the associated plumbing that goes with it is unnecessary. My divers and I use the Thomas 1020, 110 volt oil-less compressors. They are nearly indestructable, run all day without needing to be shut down to cool and if any of the few moving parts does fail, the compressor can be rebuilt with parts from Grainger for less than $75.00. In fact, it is so inexpensive, I rebuild my compressors every year or two whether they require it or not.

[S/V Aphrodite]

Thanks for the tip on the Thomas 1020! I'm definitely checking it out.

Apparently you're using it to supply a hookah. What have you found to be your depth limit without a reserve tank?

My boat has an 8 ft draft, so that's the deepest I need to go for hull cleaning, but it would be super nice to be able to dive a bit deeper anchored in an atoll somewhere.

Cheers,

Carl