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Old 05-02-2019, 10:50   #1
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Scorkl or Scopel

Has anyone used one of the “hand held” breathing devices? Could be useful if u need to go below in an emergency. - snagged line or anchor?. Click image for larger version

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Old 05-02-2019, 12:03   #2
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Re: Scorkl or Scopel

For working on the boat, I think one would want both hands free to do the work. And if you're not trained in use of SCUBA, you could injure yourself with one of those.

Those things give you two or three extra breaths in an emergency ascent. In an emergency, I don't want to be in that much of a hurry, so I carry a pony bottle that will at least give me a few minutes. Or stay within my free-diving range.
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Old 05-02-2019, 13:32   #3
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Re: Scorkl or Scopel

There's a lengthy thread on them over at Scubaboard. Cliff notes version:


1) Quite a few people paid and didn't receive the item.
2) Amount of time and effort required to pump is unrealistic for actual use
3) Safety concerns because air produced may not meet accepted purity standards
4) Concerns that people who do not have scuba diving training and experience may suffer serious injury from arterial gas embolism


Like many on these boards, I scuba dive. I have accumulated a bunch of little air cylinders down to the 1.5 cf size included with the scorkl. 1.5 cf is maybe two minutes. Not enough. Much larger and it has to go on your back or it gets in the way, I use 72cf, but smaller are available if you're trying to save room on the boat. 19cf would be a good choice. Any dive shop will fill them if you're a certified diver and if you're not you should be.



The hoseless regulator on the top of the cylinder is a standard item available from several sources if it is the compactness of the package that appeals to you.
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Old 05-02-2019, 13:42   #4
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Re: Scorkl or Scopel

Smaller dive cylinders available for sale here: https://www.divegearexpress.com/alum...by-worthington


Integrated bottle and regulator: look for the "H2odyssey extra air source"


I recommend getting scuba training if you don't have it before experimenting
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Old 05-02-2019, 14:23   #5
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Re: Scorkl or Scopel

Since no part of my boat is likely to be more than four feet under, the cold ends up being a more limiting factor than air. After a frigid fouling experience, I make it a point to keep a wetsuit, mask, & snorkel on board, even when day sailing. When cruising, I'd have the full rig.
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Old 05-02-2019, 15:10   #6
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Re: Scorkl or Scopel

Get an electric scuba setup (hookah) instead... Much more useful.
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Old 05-02-2019, 16:52   #7
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Re: Scorkl or Scopel

Quote:
Originally Posted by boom23 View Post
Get an electric scuba setup (hookah) instead... Much more useful.
I'll second that.
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Old 05-02-2019, 17:23   #8
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Re: Scorkl or Scopel

Quote:
Originally Posted by boom23 View Post
Get an electric scuba setup (hookah) instead... Much more useful.
There's quite a few hookah options - any good recommendations vs don't-use-this? I had my eye on the new Air Buddy on Indie, but Brownie's has been around a long time...
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Old 05-02-2019, 17:32   #9
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Re: Scorkl or Scopel

I have a 40 ft hose for my regulator so I can keep my tank secured on deck. Just hook up the hose put on a mask and in you go. No need to wear and clean a BC.
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Old 05-02-2019, 22:12   #10
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Re: Scorkl or Scopel

Thanks guys. Some good stuff here. Obviously one should be scuba certified which I was years back. Air quality should not really be an issue with reasonable care. The amount of time and effort required to fill could be but if you have a problem it might be worth it On two occasions I’ve had to remove a line from a fouled prop. Difficult to stay down long enough with a snorkel and impossible without some means of driving air. I charter and travel to where the boat is. Can’t take scuba with me. So if I could get say 5 minutes below at a time that would be of significant benefit! Yes, I know, don’t get the prop fouled in the first place but s*%t happens.
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Old 06-02-2019, 05:56   #11
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Re: Scorkl or Scopel

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluenomads View Post
There's quite a few hookah options - any good recommendations vs don't-use-this? I had my eye on the new Air Buddy on Indie, but Brownie's has been around a long time...

Brownie is the only maker who I believe has a complete, safe, reliable, long-lasting system. That said, they are expensive.


There are other similar systems for much less. The problems with them are not so much the pumps or the basic design but rather the details of materials choices, how they cool the airstream from the pump, and whether the fittings and hoses are safe for breathing air, support and parts availability. Some are better than others. I don't have any specific advice.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeod View Post
I have a 40 ft hose for my regulator so I can keep my tank secured on deck. Just hook up the hose put on a mask and in you go. No need to wear and clean a BC.

A widely used approach. I use a 72 cf tank in a harness, no BC. PADI and the other major agencies no longer recommend diving without a BC, but there are skilled divers who are aware of the hazards who do it.


Quote:
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I charter and travel to where the boat is. Can’t take scuba with me. So if I could get say 5 minutes below at a time that would be of significant benefit! Yes, I know, don’t get the prop fouled in the first place but s*%t happens.

With the scorkel type devices think in terms of an hour of pumping for 2 minutes of underwater time.


The hazard of air contamination is not something that can be overcome by being "careful." The problem is that some production of hazardous compounds is inherent in the process of compressing air to high pressure. Using a hand-powered pump rather than a motorized pump does not change this.


People travel with smaller empty cylinders all the time. TSA makes you remove the valve, which isn't a big deal, you just get the cylinder filled at your destination.


Here's a photo of a 1.8 cf cylinder (the scorkel is 1.5 I believe) and an 11 cf cylinder for comparison.


Also a photo of my air quality report. I have my own compressor, and take air quality extremely seriously. I pay the lab to test it, because contamination can be deadly
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Old 06-02-2019, 06:34   #12
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Re: Scorkl or Scopel

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jammer View Post
With the scorkel type devices think in terms of an hour of pumping for 2 minutes of underwater time.
To me, this is the big problem. And it probably won't be two minutes, but more like 2-3 breaths.


This hand pump is not going to pressurize the air in the tank to the degree that a real SCUBA compressor is able to. The guys who get their little 1.5cf tanks filled by SCUBA compressors only get 2-3 minutes. With a hand compressor you are going to get way less time than that.


And these things are not cheap. For the price you can get a regular sized SCUBA tank and a long hose. Or for just a little bit more you can get a commercial hookah system. Size a problem? Then just buy the longer hose and take that with you. When you get to your destination, rent a SCUBA tank to hook your hose to.


I'm just not really seeing the benefit of this system when compared to the alternatives.
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Old 06-02-2019, 10:43   #13
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Scorkl or Scopel

I agree with most of the comments and am equally skeptical! Essentially that is why I am trying to find out if anyone has used one? Certainly 2 to 3 minutes does not make it worthwhile.
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Old 06-02-2019, 11:18   #14
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Re: Scorkl or Scopel

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jammer View Post
Brownie is the only maker who I believe has a complete, safe, reliable, long-lasting system. That said, they are expensive.


There are other similar systems for much less. The problems with them are not so much the pumps or the basic design but rather the details of materials choices, how they cool the airstream from the pump, and whether the fittings and hoses are safe for breathing air, support and parts availability. Some are better than others. I don't have any specific advice.





A widely used approach. I use a 72 cf tank in a harness, no BC. PADI and the other major agencies no longer recommend diving without a BC, but there are skilled divers who are aware of the hazards who do it.





With the scorkel type devices think in terms of an hour of pumping for 2 minutes of underwater time.


The hazard of air contamination is not something that can be overcome by being "careful." The problem is that some production of hazardous compounds is inherent in the process of compressing air to high pressure. Using a hand-powered pump rather than a motorized pump does not change this.


People travel with smaller empty cylinders all the time. TSA makes you remove the valve, which isn't a big deal, you just get the cylinder filled at your destination.


Here's a photo of a 1.8 cf cylinder (the scorkel is 1.5 I believe) and an 11 cf cylinder for comparison.


Also a photo of my air quality report. I have my own compressor, and take air quality extremely seriously. I pay the lab to test it, because contamination can be deadly


Thanks Jammer. How much time do you get with an 11 cf?
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Old 06-02-2019, 12:58   #15
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Re: Scorkl or Scopel

It depends what I'm doing. If I'm working under water at something fairly physical I breathe up as much as 1.5 cf per minute even fairly shallow (10 feet). If I'm just relaxing in the tropical water looking at all the fishies, it's less than half that. I'm a big guy, lots of people get by on less air.


So, to answer your question, maybe 6-7 minutes if I'm not leaving a reserve.


There are cylinders of all sizes, I pulled out an 11 because it was the first thing I saw on the shelf and wanted to show you something, you might consider a 19 which will still fit in luggage pretty easily.
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