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Old 21-12-2010, 17:51   #31
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Keep in mind that Dorothy Parker was always courteous and civil, and could cut to the bone without profanity. If one who is direct and bluntly insulting is unwelcome, but one who is courteous and passive/aggressively/ circumspectly insulting IS welcome, it makes me wonder whether this is a community I wish to be a part of.
I can respect someone who TELLS me I am being a jerk, I cannot respect someone who anonymously reports my jerkitude, and the system that encourages it. It stifles honest dialogue and self-moderated behaviour. How am i supposed to know when i am offensive and who i have offended (thereby allowing me to resolve the problem and restore harmony) if, for all intents an purposes, someone talks behind my back?
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Old 21-12-2010, 18:05   #32
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As a receiver of several of these "private emails" I am not a supporter of the current system and fully endorse your views bljones. I have no problem with either ordinary users or mods criticising me in a public thread. I have a big problem with receiving private mails from mods seemingly acting as judge jury and executioner without any public trial or recourse .

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Old 21-12-2010, 18:12   #33
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Originally Posted by goboatingnow View Post
As a receiver of several of these "private emails" I am not a supporter of the current system and fully endorse your views bljones. I have no problem with either ordinary users or mods criticising me in a public thread. I have a big problem with receiving private mails from mods seemingly acting as judge jury and executioner without any public trial or recourse .

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Many would consider it polite to lean to someone's shoulder and say, "Your fly is open" instead of calling it out from across the room.
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Old 21-12-2010, 18:16   #34
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That only applies when it obvious my fly is open so to speak. In a forum thread nothing is that clearcut hence the need for openness and transparency. Intolerance is also a two way street In my cases the emails were impossible to decipher. There is no process no specific identification , arbitrarily conclusions and little comeback . Not so much as " your fly is open" more like " you've been a bold boy"


I've no wish to dominate on this topic. I will in future seek to put any such comments made privately back into the forum for public consumption. I have no fear of public ridicule .

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Old 21-12-2010, 18:18   #35
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Many would consider it polite to lean to someone's shoulder and say, "Your fly is open" instead of calling it out from across the room.
But they aren't telling me, they are telling a moderator my fly is open and not to tell me who told the moderator. big difference.

Pre-revolution France was pretty civil and polite. It didn't end well.
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Old 21-12-2010, 18:20   #36
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Andy if you are in Floripa I can only be envious Todo bem?


Different boards have different personalities and there are a lot of sailing/boating sites so if one is unhappy here - well one can always ask your membership fee to be returned. I thought the idea of banning emoticons a little silly but hey it's not my site. I certainly respect Gords opinion. This site has a bit of a goody goody vibe so when I'm here I try to be extra good. I don't go to SA because it can be a little nasty to suit me.

Vive la difference!
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Old 21-12-2010, 18:31   #37
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Weyalan,

I wouldn't say it that way but you say it accurate enough. The key to the forum is everyone has an equal status if everyone wants to keep any discussion going. We want new people to join in with the experienced people. It's the only way that can happen. Both ends of the experience need to make the bridge across the gap.

We have a pretty good moderation team and we watch each other, we learn from each other, and help each other. Just like it is out here when someone has a problem and members jump to the rescue. All the mods proved themselves out here first because this is where we work. All the posts are out there for all to see too. We make a list of prospects from those members that do it just a little bit better and then we ask them to consider joining after we explain the commitment. The moderation works just like the forum works except we do discuss issues in private and require confidentiality of the people involved. We need to name names and that isn't properly done in an open forum. All members are entitled to that respect even if we later decide to throw you out.

Goboatingnow, we don't do public beatings. We send you a couple of requests to be nice in private and those can be discussed confidentially with you and us. After three strikes we throw you out for a period to be determined. That might be a week, a month or until long after you die. It takes some people longer to grasp what a forum requires to stay a member. We give everyone a little extra time, but we can't be generous at the expense of the rest of the members.
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Old 21-12-2010, 18:32   #38
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I love this forum, and compared to other forums most people are here to learn or give advise, we don't have the bitchiness associated with other forums, I think the moderators do a good job.
I have also received a couple of "private emails"

I would like to see a more international approach though.

This forum is very pro american. (I am Australian) however I have lived in the USA and I can see where the Americans are coming from.
However we can both learn from different cultures and we are all cruisers or wanttobe cruisers.
Swearing in Australia and most of the world (except the USA) is not such a big deal, why have our posts removed because somebody said "damn"

I have also noticed a lack of tolerance from moderators on political views that are unamerican.
For cruisers it is important to discuss things as we see them, when it is associated with cruising.
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Old 21-12-2010, 18:35   #39
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Ok... oar in time... sorry about this but I'll have to agree on some points here...
It would be nice to at least know whom ones insulted and/or attacked and how... could just be something totally innocent that cant be googled..
Stick to the private headmasters slap if you must but at least treat us more like adults and give us the option of making the peace over the alledged 'Breach'...
Personally I love the freedom to send a PM apologising/explaining my post
I strongly suspect that in my case its others that do the reporting.. rather than the person I've supposedly attacked...
If nothing else I'm sure I'm the only one on here with Pakistani family... and I've never complained about me..
So someone enjoys being PC ......... or is it darker than that...
Whats that saying... more than one way to skin a cat

Remember... I'm one of the very few on here who are not "UNDER COVER"
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Old 21-12-2010, 18:56   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pblais

Goboatingnow, we don't do public beatings. We send you a couple of requests to be nice in private and those can be discussed confidentially with you and us. After three strikes we throw you out for a period to be determined. That might be a week, a month or until long after you die. It takes some people longer to grasp what a forum requires to stay a member. We give everyone a little extra time, but we can't be generous at the expense of the rest of the members.
Let's just clear a few things up

Firstly I have every respect for moderators when they are moderating. I mod three boards and I know the commitment that it takes ( none of which I contribute while being identified as a moderator )

However I have received two emails from mods one seemed like ( repeat seemed like) to me to be sour grapes the other was to me completely inexplicable. I had maintained a strong viewpoint in a particular thread but never personally criticised anyone. ( the view does not acord with many americans view) Yet I was partially blamed for taking the thread down . No explanation , no reference to specifics , a sort of general condemnation.

Also I wasn't aware of the three strikes rule. How does one know one has received a strike.

I would also agree that anti American views more specifically anti-gun views sees to bring out the mod slap both of my incidents related to them anyway. Yet the pro- lobby seem to get away with increasing outrageous perspectives

I like this forum , but I am a passionate believer in the adult exchange of views. There has to more to this forum that merely answering newbies questions ( which all of us do without complaint)

A PM from a ordinary user is one thing one from a mod is another.

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Old 21-12-2010, 19:08   #41
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Its funny how different people view the same thing. I don't see myself as the cop on the walk, but sailors being an independant lot, I could see how others might see it that way. As for the rules change- I don't think that is going to happen. They were here before I was and will be here long after I am gone. Moderators are not going to stop posting, or moderating to the best of their ability.
As for an American bias- our man in charge does not live in United States. I think he would stop us as he reads these forums. To cut the conversations on religion drugs guns etc have come from long experience where these threads go to. And it is not my experience, by and large. I rest on the shoulders of Giants that sit in the back and give advice. They have been here forever.
Yes, there is someone watching over the moderators- and everyone, from the Chief to the ones that take out the Spam, listen to your PM's. That is why the system is the way it is. I think it is actually quite fair.
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Old 21-12-2010, 19:15   #42
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otherwise we have a classic " who guards the guardians" issue.
We have processes in place for this. If you feel that someone on our team is out of line, please use the Contact Us link at the bottom of the page and describe the issue.

We have a clear set of Community Rules (link) which everyone must abide by. Considering we have 1,000 members per day chatting I think we do a great job at keeping things civil and respectful. Vitriolic discussions are not welcome and if people are seeking a place to be loud and argumentative there are plenty of other Cruising forums. In order to keep the peace sometimes we have to shut down threads or deal with a member who is fanning flames, as a percentage of total threads it's very tiny so it's nothing to worry about.
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Old 21-12-2010, 19:43   #43
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I strongly disagree with the idea that mods shouldn't be allowed to post. These guys can have valid opinions sme as everybody else. It isn't like they are getting paid to moderate. There are plenty enough moderators to moderate a moderator if, as is human, they err.
I agree with the above quote. The moderators contribute more than just their moderating. They contribute a lot of experience.
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Old 21-12-2010, 20:07   #44
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However I have received two emails from mods
I don't see how a discussion of your problem here in this thread will help. As I said we can discuss any issue with anyone privately. If you get an email you want to discuss you can contact any of the team you want if you feel uncomfortable with the person that sent it. They would understand and I know if I sent one to a member I would too. We really don't feel it's appropriate in public. This thread isn't about you. I know Andy wouldn't start a thread with that idea.

CF has been through a few rounds of growing pains. The size of the place demands a lot of behind the scenes changes and some things that were minor when scaled up to 10,'s of thousands of members are suddenly a lot of work. If it were possible nothing would ever change here but if we start doing things better and more people like it. The growing pains are hard on the staff more because we don't want to change the basic idea of a friendly place.

In spite of great growth we think just one member still matters.
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Old 21-12-2010, 20:35   #45
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Natural Justice...

While not claiming to be perfect my understanding is that the principles of Natural Justice underlie any disciplinary action that I take.

In particular my understanding is that there is no right to an open hearing, or to challenge your accuser.
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