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Old 12-02-2011, 16:23   #1
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UK Citizen Buying Croatian Flagged, non VAT-Paid Boat

i wonder if anyone can help, im a uk citizen , considering buying a croatian flagged ex charter boat, which has had no vat payed, id like to export it to turkey outside the eu and put the boat on the uk ssr, would i get away with doing this without having to pay the vat and if so what would the situation be if i sailed her back into eu waters?

thanks

steven
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Old 12-02-2011, 16:44   #2
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Old 12-02-2011, 16:48   #3
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If you get her out of Croatia and you don't want to pay VAT, Turkey is a rather long sail. It would also mean you wouldn't be able to visit Greece.

When you come to sell it will have a lower selling price in Europe because the next owner knows he will have to pay the VAT. Sadly all the VAT rates are going up as I am sure you are aware.

Why not just pay the VAT and accept its part of the purchase price.

Are you looking at ex-charter yachts? its going to stand out isn't it and the Greek economy is in dire straights at the moment. If you visit and are caught some Greek official will get a pat on the back for raising 10k and what do they care, you are a foreigner in their country.

What Boatman is eluding too is a small old yacht with SSR and quietly cruising around keeping a low profile, but a big white shiney ex charter yacht is different.

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Old 12-02-2011, 18:03   #4
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Well i know i can buy a new yacht in the eu for export without paying tax even as an eu citizen, but of course if kept in eu waters tax will be due, im just not sure if the same applies to a used boat which has had no tax paid?
The other eustion im thinking is just how often would a gb flagged boat be stopped in eu waters and documents demanded to show vat has been paid?
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Old 12-02-2011, 18:07   #5
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nb excuse my typing , im not that illiterate just had a few whiskies
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Old 13-02-2011, 18:48   #6
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Well i know i can buy a new yacht in the eu for export without paying tax even as an eu citizen, but of course if kept in eu waters tax will be due, im just not sure if the same applies to a used boat which has had no tax paid?
The other eustion im thinking is just how often would a gb flagged boat be stopped in eu waters and documents demanded to show vat has been paid?
You can quite legitimately buy the boat in Croatia and take her to turkey VAT free and you can quite legitimately put her on the SSR

However as you are a EU tax resident. You will be required to pay VAT immediately on entry into any EU country.

Vat is not regularly checked , but it could always happen to you !

Dave
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Old 13-02-2011, 19:23   #7
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Or you could SSR it and have it delivered by a skipper... turning it into a 'vessel in transit'... you not being on board being the difference...
Still the same 'back into EU' problem tho...
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Old 13-02-2011, 19:45   #8
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Once the " beneficial owner" is a eu tax resident then vat is due on entry to the eu. It's matters not what the skipper is.

Dave
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Old 13-02-2011, 20:27   #9
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You can quite legitimately buy the boat in Croatia and take her to turkey VAT free and you can quite legitimately put her on the SSR

However as you are a EU tax resident. You will be required to pay VAT immediately on entry into any EU country.

Vat is not regularly checked , but it could always happen to you !

Dave

Hey Dave, I'm a dual citizen, one in EU and one in USA. If I own a boat with taxes paid in US, are the EU going to force me to pay VAT when I show up there?

-Brent
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Old 14-02-2011, 02:24   #10
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what about a flag of convenience would i as an eu citizen be able to take a boat into eu waters for the 18 months on a non eu flagged boat?
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Old 15-02-2011, 19:54   #11
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To answer both threads you can be a Eu citizen but not a tax resident and it's primarily "being established" in the EU that counts. But if you travel on an EU passport yet are not established then you better have lots of proof to substantiate a claim for TIR .

Secondly it matters not what the flag of the boat is. If you are the " beneficial owner" and are established in the EU, VAT is due. Sorry vat s one of thoses things that just has to be paid

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Old 15-02-2011, 20:00   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goboatingnow View Post
To answer both threads you can be a Eu citizen but not a tax resident and it's primarily "being established" in the EU that counts. But if you travel on an EU passport yet are not established then you better have lots of proof to substantiate a claim for TIR .

Secondly it matters not what the flag of the boat is. If you are the " beneficial owner" and are established in the EU, VAT is due. Sorry vat s one of thoses things that just has to be paid

Dave
So...what you are saying is.... I'm a Brit... I buy a boat in Malaysia... I've gotta pay VAT on it... whether I bring it into EU waters or not
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Old 15-02-2011, 21:11   #13
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what about a flag of convenience would i as an eu citizen be able to take a boat into eu waters for the 18 months on a non eu flagged boat?
No. The 18 months is not for EU citizens. Even if the boat is owned by, say, a BVI company, and flagged BVI, if it is being used by EU citizens you are not eligible for the 18 months free period.

If you're an EU citizen you pretty much have to just pony up for the tax, unless you are happy keeping the boat out of the EU forever and NEVER sailing into EU waters.

By the way, they do check VAT papers from time to time.
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Old 15-02-2011, 21:35   #14
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To answer both threads you can be a Eu citizen but not a tax resident and it's primarily "being established" in the EU that counts. But if you travel on an EU passport yet are not established then you better have lots of proof to substantiate a claim for TIR .
Dave
To switch this around a little (we're in a similar situation, dual US/EU citizens) what's the deal with bringing the boat back to Europe from the US as personal property when re-locating back home? Is it VAT-free in this situation?

Cheers.
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Old 15-02-2011, 21:49   #15
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So...what you are saying is.... I'm a Brit... I buy a boat in Malaysia... I've gotta pay VAT on it... whether I bring it into EU waters or not
Far be it for me to butt in but wotthehell.

You are only liable for VAT if you enter any EU country with the boat. You can avoid payment if you can prove residence outside EU. Plenty o' paperwork necessary and the test is not definite. That rotten word "discretion" rears its ugly head in the VAT man's favor not yours. If you have property or a business in UK then they might use that discretion to label you a resident anyway.

Assuming you succeed then you have 182 days to leave UK or the VAT man will label you a VAT resident. I'm not sure of the departure details for other EU countries. You can't slip across to France and do it all again either because the 182 days counts for all EU countries across a 1 year period.
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