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Old 13-08-2013, 01:17   #1
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Registration - Which Flag?

Greetings all!
British citizen, but non-resident.
Work in Africa.
"Home" in Bangkok.
Purchasing 2002 52' trawler based in Thailand. Currently has Australian flag. Plan to cruise locally (Thailand) for 12-18 months during vacations, then live aboard.
Just looking for an economical, simple deal. Will of course need MMSI etc.
So, who can kindly give advise on where to register?
Any thoughts on Delaware???
Many thanks to all in advance!
John
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Old 13-08-2013, 03:10   #2
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Re: Registration - Which Flag?

Personally I would avoid the cost and aggro of going the corporate reg route.....but for own name your options are limited.

You can register in own name in Jersey (same as UK part 1) without any residency requirement. Downside is that will need a tonnage survey which ups the initial costs a tad, upside is reg lasts 10 years (UK is 5).
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Old 13-08-2013, 08:13   #3
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Re: Registration - Which Flag?

John

Registering as a Corporation in Delaware is very costly and probably not worth your money.

Frankly, I see no reason to register a recreational boat under 65 feet as a corporation vessel, since it cost so much, not only to create the corporation, but then the to pay the fees to the Documenting Country, which usually charge you the same rate as a commercial vessel.

For instance a friend had a 45 foot sailboat documented in Panama, he was French... It cost $1800US per year and he had restrictions on how long he could keep the boat in Panama, something like 60 days per year, since it was convenience flagged.

Your decision should be based on what best suits your needs for taxes. Since you have so many different residences, but not citizenship, which is key to obtaining documentation in countries I would go with what David suggested and get your UK-Part 1.

Good luck!
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Old 13-08-2013, 08:31   #4
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pirate Re: Registration - Which Flag?

I hear Belgium is an easy place...
Have you no relatives in the UK your friends with... that way you can go SSR or Part 1...
Don't over think it...
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Old 13-08-2013, 09:12   #5
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Re: Registration - Which Flag?

If you have a choice, register where it is most convenient. Avoid flags that can turn against you where you plan to sail.

b.
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Old 13-08-2013, 09:36   #6
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Re: Registration - Which Flag?

Quote:
Originally Posted by boatman61 View Post
I hear Belgium is an easy place...
Have you no relatives in the UK your friends with... that way you can go SSR or Part 1...
Don't over think it...
Yeah, normally I would hint at "magicking up" a UK address for an SSR (friends / family or paid for) - but as OP mentioned he is a UK non-resident then sounded to me like he is likely wanting to stay that way officially for tax reasons.....and a magick UK address requires someone to confirm they are in fact residing in the UK, which may end shooting him in the foot . Not to say that HMRC do check boat reg, but they might........
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Old 13-08-2013, 09:47   #7
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pirate Re: Registration - Which Flag?

Ahh well... just a thought... know someone who use's his lawyer for Part 1... another his accountant...


Quote:
Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey View Post
Yeah, normally I would hint at "magicking up" a UK address for an SSR (friends / family or paid for) - but as OP mentioned he is a UK non-resident then sounded to me like he is likely wanting to stay that way officially for tax reasons.....and a magick UK address requires someone to confirm they are in fact residing in the UK, which may end shooting him in the foot . Not to say that HMRC do check boat reg, but they might........
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Old 14-08-2013, 10:59   #8
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Re: Registration - Which Flag?

David,
"Nail on the head".
I do work in Middle East and other tax exempt places, but having the boat registered in the UK under Part III could result in the registration morphing into "chains" - making it impossible to get out of the registry (i.e. Sell). Right????
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Old 14-08-2013, 11:10   #9
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pirate Re: Registration - Which Flag?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnInBKK View Post
David,
"Nail on the head".
I do work in Middle East and other tax exempt places, but having the boat registered in the UK under Part III could result in the registration morphing into "chains" - making it impossible to get out of the registry (i.e. Sell). Right????
Nope... wrong...
Part III is just a bit of card in plastic to satisfy Johnny Foreigner... its renewable every 5 years... as for getting off the Registry you just mail it back with a brief note to say the boat is sold... it does not even prove ownership of the vessel... but yet to meet an official whose turned it over and read the other side... lolol
end of story
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Old 20-08-2013, 18:30   #10
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Re: Registration - Which Flag?

All the different rules in general and in my opinion are screwing up lots of the fun.
Things sometimes can get so complicated that even a marine lawyer has no advise.
In fact I do not feel free while cruising while there always seem to be some law that I broke without even knowing it or while knowing but can't avoid. I would like to import my boat in the country I reside officially but they have unreasonable import taxrules (about 70%) so like all people there I have to hide myself behind a construction that I don't like at all. One day they could confiscate maybe all boats, who knows. And what can I do? Not even carry the boat to EU because of CE certification there.
Also the insurance (if you want to insure more then liability) is an issue when the situation is unclear.
as far as the government concerns boats and Yachts are a pain in their ass since their problems are; drugs runners, "illegal" entry/exit so why should they facilitate people that can afford to have a boat making life of the officialdom even more complicated.
They see boats as a way to travel from A-B (Need despachio every time you go out) and do not understand the fun of it. Stopping somewhere to BBQ or fish? have yr excuse ready !
Indeed a lot of things that screw it up while the freedomlovers that most of us are keep trying to get around or handle most of the hassle.
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Old 20-08-2013, 18:35   #11
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Re: Registration - Which Flag?

Not sure on your rego, but its cheaper to move the boat to Langkawi for the purchase isnt it?
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Old 21-08-2013, 10:48   #12
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Re: Registration - Which Flag?

Guys, once again thanks for the responses.

News: it is no longer possible to get a Part III registration UNLESS you can give proof of residence - i.e. Utility Bill etc.

Needless to say, I am not investigating the part I option. However, I am stumped on the "Tonnage Measurement" - from googling it appears you have to fly a surveyor to the boat!!!

My last boat was on Part I and all I can remember was receiving a wooded plaque in the post with the O.N. number. NOBODY performed a "Tonnage Measurement Survey".
Is this a new money making racket or is there a way round this???

Many thanks, John
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Old 21-08-2013, 10:54   #13
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Re: Registration - Which Flag?

Quote:
My last boat was on Part I and all I can remember was receiving a wooded plaque in the post with the O.N. number. NOBODY performed a "Tonnage Measurement Survey".
Is this a new money making racket or is there a way round this???
to my knowledge , back into the dawn of time , there was always a tonnage survey for PArt 1, something to do with determining your hold capacity and therefore taxes

dave
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Old 21-08-2013, 11:14   #14
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Re: Registration - Which Flag?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captaincees View Post
All the different rules in general and in my opinion are screwing up lots of the fun.
Things sometimes can get so complicated that even a marine lawyer has no advise.
In fact I do not feel free while cruising while there always seem to be some law that I broke without even knowing it or while knowing but can't avoid. I would like to import my boat in the country I reside officially but they have unreasonable import taxrules (about 70%) so like all people there I have to hide myself behind a construction that I don't like at all. One day they could confiscate maybe all boats, who knows. And what can I do? Not even carry the boat to EU because of CE certification there.
Also the insurance (if you want to insure more then liability) is an issue when the situation is unclear.
as far as the government concerns boats and Yachts are a pain in their ass since their problems are; drugs runners, "illegal" entry/exit so why should they facilitate people that can afford to have a boat making life of the officialdom even more complicated.
They see boats as a way to travel from A-B (Need despachio every time you go out) and do not understand the fun of it. Stopping somewhere to BBQ or fish? have yr excuse ready !
Indeed a lot of things that screw it up while the freedomlovers that most of us are keep trying to get around or handle most of the hassle.
I think by that you mean freeloaders .

Don't like the rules (for boat and / or you)? - then don't visit, let alone become a resident. Seemples .

Complaining that not easy to freeload on others by not paying your way / meeting your obligations (which the locals get to decide, not you on a pick and mix basis ) don't attract much sympathy from me ........whether that in the West or the 3rd World.
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Old 21-08-2013, 11:42   #15
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Re: Registration - Which Flag?

Tonnage surveys are not all that expensive. 200 quid is typical. Any surveyor in UK can do one and it will be accepted in any of the British tax havens such as Jersey, Guenrsey, IOM, Gibraltar, BVI, Caymans
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