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Old 22-07-2014, 12:50   #91
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Re: Rebel Heart Lawsuit

whats done is done here, lets all us armchair lawyers check back in a few months and compare notes. who got the money if any banknotes.fairwinds and godspeed.
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Old 22-07-2014, 16:30   #92
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Re: Rebel Heart Lawsuit

I still think whenever is going to have to show that regardless of a sick kid a boat that shipped "extra" water when the engine was run, that engine was needed to make electricity, the electricity storing system was failing, the electricity was needed to make water, water was not going to support a 4-person crew for 3+ more weeks at sea.

No sick kid at all and I still think this family doesn't make it to the destination. No sick kid, no need for satphone.

How about the medical release? They either got the blood work done or they didn't. If the doctor "cleared" Lyra why isn't the doctor named? Oh, yeah. Right. He's in Mexico...

- A record of satphone trouble
- A documented case of Salmonella for 2 crew and some other disease for a 3rd crew
- 6+ weeks planned at sea
- A "dodgy" medical release
- Documentation in their blog that Lyra was not keeping the meds down in the first 3 days of treatment.
- The boat was never turned back towards Mexico even after it was compromised. One could argue they were half way but any chance of rescue would come from the east not further west.

The Plaintiff (Charlotte) has a lot of responsibility here - IMO.
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Old 22-07-2014, 22:23   #93
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Re: Rebel Heart Lawsuit

Let's face it - this is too juicy a scenario to simply ignore and not speculate on the merits based on the facts we have and on the facts that we don't quite have yet. On the one hand, there's the RH claim which may have merit. On the other hand, there's the issue of what we apparently know (get ready for that to even change) and what ifs - what we don't know as well as the likelihood of contributory negligence or primary negligence of the RH crew. I'm not familiar with California jurisprudence - although awards do tend to be well above what is warranted in many cases. If it turns out that 'whenever' was culpable to a significant degree and was the proximate cause ('but for' test in Canada) then good on RH. OTOH, if this case is strongly defended then get ready for the questioning of each decision RH made or should reasonably have made to mitigate their circumstances. If this goes to trial there will likely have to be expert evidence regarding what a prudent sailor would/should have done in contrast with the RH crew. Of course, there will also be expert evidence supporting RH. Let justice prevail. BTW, of course I feel bad for anyone losing their dream, their home and going through a clearly anguishing situation. I'm glad everyone is fine and it's just property that's been harmed. I'm just not sure whether anyone else is to blame.....
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Old 22-07-2014, 23:29   #94
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Re: Rebel Heart Lawsuit

yes Bill. "juicy" is the slang.i figure most of the events are irrelavant to the sim card being cut-off. remember this is the USA and CA is the state. people sue and win cases that canadians must think unwinnable.people in USA have sued cities after hitting a pothole in the pavement and claimed "whiplash" and/or back injuries.i figure anything RH put on blogs or forums will never be allowed as evidence later.from what i read before the posts/blogspots were removed was they had been awake for days with little sleep.insomnia or little sleep can lead to increased anxiety and parania. geez,some people even have vivid aural hallucinations and begin to experience constant chattering in their minds.induced sleep-deprivation is still used as a form of torture today at the "crowbar hotel the cia run in cuba".i would think the sat-phone getting shut off must have caused the mother and father alot more worry and anxiety and caused them to flip the switch on the epirb.i probably would have done the same thing as it was the fastest solution without a sat-phone working and a kid needing meds. fairwinds and godspeed.
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Old 23-07-2014, 06:13   #95
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Re: Rebel Heart Lawsuit

When I was a law student long ago, one of my professors told us that more than 50 % of the world population of lawyers live in single country...

The years passed and now, reading this thread I'm just starting to realize how it is probably possible...

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Old 23-07-2014, 06:29   #96
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Re: Rebel Heart Lawsuit

I think this type of thinking (blaming others) is firmly imbedded into American culture
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Old 23-07-2014, 07:08   #97
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Re: Rebel Heart Lawsuit

I am late as we were crossing when things happened.

Can anybody here PLS link me to the place where the WHY was discussed?

Why was the boat abandoned? It seems like the boat was fine to go on.

The kid got stabilized, it was probably an option to lift the kids and the mother. Eric could have sailed the boat to whatever downwind destination comes first.

Why was the boat abandoned?

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Old 23-07-2014, 07:16   #98
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Re: Rebel Heart Lawsuit

Quote:
Originally Posted by barnakiel View Post
I am late as we were crossing when things happened.

Can anybody here PLS link me to the place where the WHY was discussed?

Thank you,
b.
There were many threads on the subject (probably all closed by now)
Just use the search function with "Rebel Heart" as keywords and "display threads" option
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Old 23-07-2014, 07:41   #99
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Re: Rebel Heart Lawsuit

Quote:
Originally Posted by barnakiel View Post
I am late as we were crossing when things happened.

<snip>

Why was the boat abandoned?

Thank you,
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These two oughta catch you up - reminder this thread is about the lawsuit. (as much as any of us can stay on topic - LOL)

All the event stuff has already been hashed.

Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)

Captain's Log, April 30, 2014 from the Rebel Heart Blog
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Old 23-07-2014, 07:41   #100
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Re: Rebel Heart Lawsuit

Dovetailing on what Freyewe posted, presumably (but not necessarily so) what was blogged by RH was truthful. If it wasn't then there's a credibility issue and the blog postings are certainly going to form part of the cross-examination of RH crew (they're likely still available in cyberspace somehow). Removing those blog posts (I couldn't find them now) demonstrates (to me) that the lawsuit isn't about truth/justice. It's an attempt at a money grab. Win at all costs??? Being accountable for one's actions does not necessarily eliminate partial liability elsewhere. It has been said that you learn the most about someone in adversity, divorce, and lawsuits.
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Old 23-07-2014, 08:36   #101
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Re: Rebel Heart Lawsuit

Thanks. But my question still stands.

Why was the boat abandoned?

From one of the threads: "... As to damage.... Eric said the boat was broached, mast and sails under water, and forces on the sails and rigging while righting were transferred to the hull causing failure of the hull to deck joint. He estimated an immediate inrush of water at about 70 gallons if I recall correctly. Adding that water was also coming in from an unknown source...."

Stands in clear contradiction to what I could listen to in a 24 minute or so interview on youtube (10news Interview Eric and Charlotte Kaufman, Youtube).

They do not talk of any damage whatsoever.

If the boat was fine, why was she abandoned?


Anybody can PLS clarify this?

Thanks,
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Old 23-07-2014, 08:49   #102
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Re: Rebel Heart Lawsuit

Eric says the boat was too badly damaged to sail anywhere.

If the Navy had given him some water I reckon he could have made Hawaii in following trade winds all the way. They were rescued at somewhere around 12 - 14N and Hawaii starts at 19N.

Anyway, I wasn't making the decisions so there you go.
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Old 23-07-2014, 08:57   #103
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Re: Rebel Heart Lawsuit

Why is it always the first instinct of Americans to litigate?

Can they not just be grateful that 4 people risked life and limb and parachuted into the ocean to help their daughter?

They are incredibly lucky to be American and to have the vast resources of the USCG and associated rescue facilities at their beck and call. Just a snap of a finger and they launched an aircraft with the 4 jumpers. The rest of us can only marvel at what a wonderful service you guys have and we have to be self sufficient with no expectations of anyone coming to help us.

Should I sue the satphone company because I spilled some hot coffee in my lap while making a call?
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Old 23-07-2014, 09:04   #104
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Re: Rebel Heart Lawsuit

Here are some stats that have been thrown around California where I live. I can't verify if they are true or not, but from all the law suits about crazy stuff I hear about, they may very well be true. They are: The US of A has more lawyers than all the rest of the world combined. California has more lawyers than the other 49 states combined! There sure must be a lot of lawyers in this state and a lot looking for work. Amusing in a sick, slick way.
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Old 23-07-2014, 09:09   #105
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Re: Rebel Heart Lawsuit

Not sure if CA will grant jurisdiction just because a PI lawyer tries forum shopping by having a wife sue her husband because of claimed loss due to phone service interruption from a company in FL that has a contract the husband signed demanding jurisdiction in FL.

But where ever jurisdiction is lets keep in mind if it does go to trial it is not likely anyone on the jury will know the difference between a halyard and a sheet; probably think a sheet is what you put on a bet. That type of juror will most likely think anyone who would sail a small boat out of sight of land is a moron, and a sadistic moron to take small children on the boat.

This will not be an easy case to sell to a jury of landlubbers.
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