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Old 13-04-2015, 16:58   #121
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Re: Phuket! I have "Right of Way"

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In some places they also enforce this by a 25km speed limit through intersections.
Could you cite a reference to this? This just does not make sense in my eyes, except perhaps at a few exceptional intersections such as children's school crossings or perhaps at uncontrolled intersections on secondary streets. In the worlds major cities this would bring traffic to a standstill.
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Old 13-04-2015, 17:05   #122
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Re: Phuket! I have "Right of Way"

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.
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Originally Posted by Rustic Charm
. . .Hence why Authoritative agencies have no qualms in explaining the collision regulations when it comes to a 'stand on vessel' as the vessel with the right of way.

Again, the terminology is not correct, but the terminology is not what's important, it's the understanding behind the regulation and putting it into place that is important.


"If you can understand the concept without any terminology -- then by all means, do away with the terminology or confound it with something else. But unfortunately, speaking in a sloppy way is almost always associated with thinking -- and understanding -- in a sloppy way."

This is when you can turn a discussion into silliness. And you show your determination not to understand any aspect of what someone else is discussing with you. And your a 'teacher' which really concerns me when you do this.

At NO stage have I suggested doing away with all terminology
Quote me where I have suggested doing away with 'all terminology'?

My only argument has always been that it matters NOT if one understands the 'stand on' regulation by referring to the vessel that has 'right of way', but I have always, ALWAYS predicated this with the insistence that one must understand the 'right of way' as not being an absolute!

I have and continue to dispute your insistence that it is wrong to use the term 'right of way'. As many authorities, do.
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Old 13-04-2015, 17:07   #123
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Re: Phuket! I have "Right of Way"

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I think inland rules are only valid for interior waterways and I am sure Colregs are the same on the US as in the Europe (except separation traffic scheme).

Regardind the Colregs, has I have said, the 5 blast means both: "what are your intentions" or a danger signal in case one considers that there are collision risk.
Inland rules apply anywhere landward of the colregs demarcation lines which are clearly marked on all US coastal charts. International rules apply seaward of these demarcation lines. I'm not sure what you mean by Inland waterways, but there are very few US coastal bays inlets or harbors where international rules apply. Most of the rules are the same, but there are a few differences. Each country gets to determine their own inland rules. Some simply adopt the international rules, some may not. For instance International rules no longer require a bell for boats greater than 12 meters and less than 20, but US inland rules still do. Furthermore individual US states have their own rules which can be different as well, so being in compliance can vary within individual US states.

All of this is so much fun. So with regards to this thread what rules was the sailboat governed by at the time of the collision? Was he under international rules or in fact in Thai internal waters where some local rules unbeknownst to me were in effect? I see a lot of people speculating based on international rules, but I don't see anyone that has stated that they know what rules he was operating under. Does Thailand adopt international rules for its internal waters or do they have their own local rules?
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Old 13-04-2015, 17:25   #124
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Re: Phuket! I have "Right of Way"

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I have and continue to dispute your insistence that it is wrong to use the term 'right of way'. As many authorities, do.
Which "authorities"? Apart from dumbed-down materials intended for students, can you show where some "authority" refers to "right of way" in relation to the COLREGS?
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Old 13-04-2015, 17:26   #125
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Re: Phuket! I have "Right of Way"

It isn't unusual that manual and sail-powered boats are both faster and more maneuverable than my fat/slow motorboat.





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Old 13-04-2015, 17:31   #126
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Re: Phuket! I have "Right of Way"

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It isn't unusual that both manual and sail-powered boats are both faster and maneuverable than my fat/slow motorboat.





Which is taken into consideration in Rule 2

I prefer sail to power, but I do have a special place in my heart for slow, efficient mobos, with single screws, and narrow, easily driven,displacement hulls But then again, that doesn't mean much, because I'm just an old boat whore who likes almost anything which floats
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Old 13-04-2015, 17:41   #127
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Re: Phuket! I have "Right of Way"

Maybe if I hoisted the stabilizing sails more often, I'd be given a break.
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Old 13-04-2015, 18:03   #128
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Re: Phuket! I have "Right of Way"

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Maybe if I hoisted the stabilizing sails more often, I'd be given a break.
Nice!

Surely you get some drive out of those, and not just stabilization?
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Old 13-04-2015, 18:23   #129
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Re: Phuket! I have "Right of Way"

Boat US - Online Boating Safety Study Guide

Quote:
Rules of the Road

Right of Way Rules

Whenever you meet another boat, it’s like approaching an unmarked intersection in your car. Knowing a few, simple right of way rules will help you avoid a collision. Just as motorists must know what to do when approaching a four way stop, every crossing situation at sea is like approaching an unmarked intersection. ...........
Navigating the Law - Boating Rules of the Road

Quote:
• Learn the right-of-way – when crossing paths, the boat to your right has the right-of-way.
• Give sailboats and paddlecraft the right-of-way.
The right of way in boating


Quote:
On a crowded, busy lake, it can sometimes be difficult to tell who has the right of way. Unfortunately, many boating accidents result when drivers do not understand the ways in which boats are supposed to interact. Operating a boat is just like driving a car: if you do not understand the rules governing right of way, you are putting everyone around you in danger.
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Old 13-04-2015, 18:33   #130
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Re: Phuket! I have "Right of Way"

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...
Surely you get some drive out of those, and not just stabilization?
About a half-knot boost or so when winds are right and engine-power setting is below hull-speed.
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Old 13-04-2015, 18:36   #131
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Re: Phuket! I have "Right of Way"

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Don't be so hard on Rustic on this one, as their is an element of truth in what he is saying. I'm off today to do the practicals and exam for the a Coxswains Grade 1 over the next week and a half and I haven't had one assignment question on the COLREGS from what I recall for the duration of the 18 week course and the COLREGS component of the course is comparatively minor. It's incorporated into the MARI001 (Comply with regulations to ensure safe operation of a vessel up to 12 metres) unit which also covers a lot of other stuff to do with regulations and safety requirements. I'm obviously doing my quals in Qld, and there is a definite Qld flavour, but the course is run to national requirements. Does the small COLREGS component surprise me? Yes. I'm assuming they expect you to know most of it from lower marine quals e.g. recreational license. With such a low proportional content in the overall syllabus, it's entirely feasible that one could get all the COLREGS questions wrong and still pass the course depending on the format of the final examination process.

Having said that, it I were to use the "right of way" phrase on a COLREGS exam question, I wouldn't expect to get the red tick.
Perhaps there has been some dumbing down of the COLERGS recently which would be unfortunate.

Certainly 30 years ago when I sat for my master ticket the TAFE lecturers and examining harbour master rated understanding the COLERGS highly.

I certainly disagree with Rustic attempting to link the COLREGS to example of road situations.

It is certainly a real problem that that the majority of licenced boaters on the water in Australia have little if any real knowledge of the COLREGS. For those not from Australia boat owners with Coxswains and Masters and Yachtmasters tickets would be a small minority of those on the water.
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Old 13-04-2015, 18:36   #132
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Re: Phuket! I have "Right of Way"

Old mate at the heart of the OP's story must've been working within those guidelines.
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Old 13-04-2015, 18:37   #133
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Re: Phuket! I have "Right of Way"

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Perhaps there has been some dumbing down of the COLERGS recently which would be unfortunate.

Certainly 30 years ago when I sat for my master ticket the TAFE lecturers and examining harbour master rated understanding the COLERGS highly.

I certainly disagree with Rustic attempting to link the COLREGS to example of road situations.

It is certainly a real problem that that the majority of licenced boaters on the water in Australia have little if any real knowledge of the COLREGS. For those not from Australia boat owners with Coxswains and Masters and Yachtmasters tickets would be a small minority of those on the water.
It's all about MARPOL et al and not hurting the crew's feelings now.
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Old 13-04-2015, 18:38   #134
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Re: Phuket! I have "Right of Way"

Sadly, this is all too true. In Phuket waters, speed takes precedence and at this time of year (Songkran) especially there is a good chance the crew/captain of the other boat have been drinking or worse. I see them at the island bars having a few while their boatload of tourists are sightseeing etc.
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Old 13-04-2015, 18:41   #135
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Re: Phuket! I have "Right of Way"

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It's all about MARPOL et al and not hurting the crew's feelings now.
International Convention for the Prevention of Pollution from Ships (MARPOL)

Why am I not surprised? Who was running the course you were doing in Mackay?

cheers
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