Overseas Citizen, US Boat. What Does it Take?

[Fishman_Tx]

This is something I would like opinions on. The info would be helpful for others as well. I know I've seen quite a few boats with registry from other countries, so I wondered what was required on both ends to keep the boat here that was purchased in the US and the owner is a citizen in another country.

Let's use Florida as the location state for the boat in the example. The citizens country is an EU country.

[Pblais]

The boat needs a registered title some place so the owner can prove ownership. A bill of sale is not a registered title. The skipper and crew need proper passports and are restricted to how long they can stay and / work based on the normal requirements if they just ended up here off an airplane. Arriving on or owning a boat means nothing. The people are just aliens in the US.

The key is the boat is not a person so it's not related to the person that owns it. It is a illegal for a non US citizen to document a boat with the USCG. If it was formerly documented it must be undocumented. They can register it in any state that cares to have them. They can also register it outside the US and get a 6 month all you can cruise US permit. Just in case there is a dinghy it's just a second boat and all the rules apply to it as there are no two for one deals on a dinghy with a bigger boat. No one cares about a dinghy if it has no engine. You just need to have PFD and all safety gear required for any boat based on length.

Boats are US state regulated even though there are USCG requirements some states have extra goodies. The final issue of taxes is more complex.

[Fishman_Tx]

Ok making sure I am clear. In this scenario the individual would want to leave the boat in FL permanently and fly in during "season" or on holiday to stay on and cruise their boat. STANDARD Visa rules apply, registration will be in the "home country". The boat is up to USCG safety standards (it was a US boat prior to purchase). Is their anything else that would need to be done, regarding the boat, no "extra" paperwork for the US Gov?

[Vasco]

The cruising permit is good for one year, not six months.

[anjou]

So maybe its a little complex to own a boat and keep it in Fl and just sail it on vacation, but what about a UK or EU citizen keeping / registering in Brit Bahamas or BVI or other Brit /EU carib islands? What would the rules be then?

[Vasco]

Originally Posted by anjou

So maybe its a little complex to own a boat and keep it in Fl and just sail it on vacation, but what about a UK or EU citizen keeping / registering in Brit Bahamas or BVI or other Brit /EU carib islands? What would the rules be then?

There is no Brit Bahamas. Bahamas is an independent nation. UK citizens are subject to the same rules as other foreigners.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Vasco

There is no Brit Bahamas. Bahamas is an independent nation. UK citizens are subject to the same rules as other foreigners.

That's not exactly true. The Bahamas are a Commonwealth Realm, so Queen Elizabeth II is the queen of the Bahamas, too, and theoretically commands military forces and can overturn laws and so forth. It is true that the Bahamas are self-governing, but if you think they're completely sovereign just look at what happened in the Turks & Caicos last month.

So the Bahamas are British (even if they are not part of the UK) and UK citizens are not just like any other "foreigners".

[billyehh]

The Caymans are still a British Colony like Anguilla and Turks and Caicose while the Bahamas like Jamica have been completely independant for decades. It is a member of the Comonwealth, that does not give any special privileges to citizens of the UK.

[Vasco]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

That's not exactly true. The Bahamas are a Commonwealth Realm, so Queen Elizabeth II is the queen of the Bahamas, too, and theoretically commands military forces and can overturn laws and so forth. It is true that the Bahamas are self-governing, but if you think they're completely sovereign just look at what happened in the Turks & Caicos last month.

So the Bahamas are British (even if they are not part of the UK) and UK citizens are not just like any other "foreigners".

You obviously haven't been to the Bahamas lately. UK citizens are treated no differently from other foreigners.

The Bahamas is a sovereign independent nation unlike the Turks and Caicos which is a British Overseas Territory as is The British Virgin Islands and some other vestigal "colonies".

British overseas territories are under the sovereignty of the UK and are not sovereign independent nations. T & C and BVI are in effect British colonies only they're no longer called colonies as that term seems to have lost favour.

And if you look at the various British Nationality Acts that the UK has passed since the late forties when the colonies started gaining independence, the citizens of the Bahamas and the "colonies" such as BVI and T & C are not British citizens like UK citizens.

Apparently the sun has set on the British Empire.

[Zanshin]

Originally Posted by anjou

So maybe its a little complex to own a boat and keep it in Fl and just sail it on vacation, but what about a UK or EU citizen keeping / registering in Brit Bahamas or BVI or other Brit /EU carib islands? What would the rules be then?

No worries there, an EU citizen can now register and keep a boat in the BVI. I did that with my last boat, the current boat is UK registered and is currently in Antigua - no problems there, either.

[Fishman_Tx]

Anj: Ahh there's a thot! That was something I was referring to in the "Formosa" thread about being in territories...

So then the cruising permit is what is required for the boat to remain in US waters at a rented slip? How much "break" time is required between permits?

[Vasco]

Originally Posted by Fishman_Tx

Anj: Ahh there's a thot! That was something I was referring to in the "Formosa" thread about being in territories...

So then the cruising permit is what is required for the boat to remain in US waters at a rented slip? How much "break" time is required between permits?

This is a good question and I have gotten different answers from different Homeland Security people. I know that even if you leave the US and return with an existing cruising permit they will not give you a new one. Your old one must expire before they issue a new one. Many snowbirds that lleave their boats in the US and spend the winters in the Bahamas ask for a cruising permit of less than one year, usually ten months. That way when they return in May or June the permit will have expired and they get a new one.

[Fishman_Tx]

Originally Posted by Vasco

This is a good question and I have gotten different answers from different Homeland Security people. I know that even if you leave the US and return with an existing cruising permit they will not give you a new one. Your old one must expire before they issue a new one. Many snowbirds that lleave their boats in the US and spend the winters in the Bahamas ask for a cruising permit of less than one year, usually ten months. That way when they return in May or June the permit will have expired and they get a new one.

The issue I was trying to determine was whether the vessel or the people had to leave. Does the "cruising permit" really apply here? As they are flying in and already Visa'd, I don't think that it would be applicable in this case.

[Vasco]

Originally Posted by Fishman_Tx

The issue I was trying to determine was whether the vessel or the people had to leave. Does the "cruising permit" really apply here? As they are flying in and already Visa'd, I don't think that it would be applicable in this case.

It's the boat that has to leave but it can stay longer than most visitors. Canadian visitors in the US are only allowed to stay there 6 months a year. As far as other citizenships, it would depend on your visa. The cruising permit pertains to the vessel, not the owner, skipper or crew.

[Fishman_Tx]

Anj (cont):
That's what i was considering to give you options at purchase. A place to leave her til she or you were ready for transport, passage, or your retirement! Also, a way to spread out expenditures over time so as not to have to "dump the wad" at one time on all the requirements....